Tech trees

[skeletor]

LOL, this is insane...

Have you seen how many Viking units there are?

javelinmen, bondi, militia bowmen, bowmen, militia archers, viking archers, birkebeiner archers, crossbowmen, spear militia, viking spearmen, geirrmen, militia swordscavalry, militia spearcavalry, raider cavalry, viking cavalry, danish knights, landsmenn, karls, gestr, viking huskarls, birkebeiners, jarl's hird, joms vikings, royal hird, ballista, mangonel.

Thats 25 unit's..

I'll say we cut:

bowmen + milita bowmen = bowmen (hunters)

bondi + spearmilitia = bondi

Royal hird + viking huskarls = viking huskarls

viking cavalry + raider cavalry + militia swordscavalry = raider cavalry
--------------

That leavs 20 unit's, more then most vanilla factions

-Skel-

[ScionTheWorm]

but won't these be spread over four factions? if maybe 15 is shared, there is 3-4 uniques per faction.

[Incongruous]

Yeah, this is a disproportionate amount of units dudes.
Definatley need to revamp the list methinks.

[GoreBag]

25 units for four factions doesn't seem like too many to me.

[Incongruous]

No but most of those units are going to be shared by those factions.

[Ranika]

Maybe 25 units then for each of the 'cultures' then? Not the technical in game cultures, but things like 'Gaels' and 'Norse' and such, just to give an idea of where to put said units; considering there are a lot more homogenized, similar cultures in this mod than in vanilla Rome, so it'd be easier to share more unit models, so model space shouldn't be too much of a problem.

[ScionTheWorm]

Actually I wonder what cultures we'll have? I would think
Barbarian = Norse (nordmannaland, danmark, sveariket,rus)
Roman = Catholic (can we only assign 3 + 1 factions to this?). Because of restrictions, catholics would be HRE, French, Loth, Papals, Normandie, Asturia, Welsh and Saxons? Or should welsh be gaelic and saxons norse maybe?
Eastern = Steppe (Bulgars, magyar, Khazar(?))
Greek = Greek (Byzantine)
Carthagian = Muslim (abbasid, al andalus)
And if this is an own culture:
Ptolemaic = Gaelic - if not, gaelic has to be norse or catholic. (alba, eire)

When it comes to BI, I doubt there will be more cultures than this but I've got no clue.

I think around 15 units per faction would be decent (15*20 = 300), allthough this is a hell of a lot of work for two skinners/modellers. So approximatly this could be the case:

Norse: 15-20 shared units (ok I agree this is a lot, but we do focus on vikings), maybe 2-3 uniques
Catholic: 10-15 shared?
Steppe: Should have around 15 shared I think
Greek: lots of zor, counting around 20
Muslim: should be 10-15 shared
Gaelic: I think 10-15 shared

Oh by the way, when I say shared I mean on model and stat basis, not skins. I may have misunderstood.

[skeletor]

Most of the unit's i have mentioned is lesser unit's for all factions. I fou see the techtree, all unit's, with ekcept birkebeiners, jomsvikings, and dannish knight, are used for all factions. Rus is not mentioned, but with the scandinavian ones it's 75 unit's. With rus, it will be 100 unit's.
Legio have only specified birkebeiners, jomsvikings, and dannish knight as zor or factionspecific unit's.

Allso the fact that vikings, who didn't use cavalery in battle have 5 difrent units is a bit silly. All their cavalery is supposed to be rather weak. So having 4 difrent types of poor cavalery is a bi too mutch. Having some very light spearcavalery, and then you get the bether viking cavalery (raider cavalery) .
Then the danes get their knights as the latest one.

Allso having a militia archer, then archer, thats two allmost identical unit's.
I'd say they can get the regular archer as the first base archer, then get vikingarchers, and at the en the crossbowmen + the birkebeiner in the zor system.

Bondis were usually spear militia, so thats the same as making 2 diffrent unit's of the same kind. I personally never use the Roman townwatch unit, unless i restrict myself from using peasants as garison in roman campaigns. So having only one "crappy on the battlefield, but good for garison" i'd say is enough.

Keaping all these unit's for all factions will probably mean AI large stack of militiaunit's, instead of apropriate viking armys.

Ofcourse, if alot of these unit's are for only one or some of the viking factions, its reasonable. But then i wold like to know witch..


Any other thoughts on this, or what do you think of my cutting?

-Skel-

[ScionTheWorm]

when it's like this (75 and 100 units!), I think your cutting might be for the best, I totally agree with the cavalry.

Btw, I remember I saw some excellent skins for Geirmen at the NTW forum...