Input requested - faction naming

[khelvan]

Well, we aren't trying to make the names recognizable, we're trying to make them as close to what the people called themselves as possible. We have that exactly, for the Carthaginians. I'm a mere mortal as well, and Punic is just as foreign to me as it is to you.

[anonymous_joe]

Hmmm. For simplicity's sake I'd argue Carthage, but, for accuracy...

Hmmm, I'd go with the historical ones.

Translating all the Gaelic unit's names into Irish will provide me at least ten minutes of amusement. So, go with the accuracy! It seems to be the EB spirit.

[Ranika]

There aren't that many really, and some grammar and such have changed, but if you're fluent, you should probably get at least most of them, though some use words no longer in use except in isolated local dialects (like 'guirran').

[a houston chronicler]

khelvan - being the lazy-a*s i am, i would go with whatever is easiest to read and takes up less space, whether it's the political name or the "ethnic" name. but you guys aren't lazy-a*ses, so......
i know you guys want to be consistent, but i don't think anyone wants Safot Softim biQarthadast showing up too often. i think everyone will start calling it carthage if you do that.

[anonymous_joe]

Unfortunately, I'm not fluent. I'm doing higher level Irish, but I'm only hoping for a low B.

[hoom]

I think the point is that it shouldn't be consistent, certain groups thought of themselves as a people first and a political entity second (or third or whatever) while for others it was reversed. I feel that EB should try to reflect this.

What he said.
Option one would give a whole lot of factions called 'the Greeks' wouldn't it?

[Big_John]

What he said.
Option one would give a whole lot of factions called 'the Greeks' wouldn't it?

i was thinking the same thing, lol.

[Simetrical]

As I said over at TWC, I favor the use of the state's full name for the faction selection screen, the diplomacy screen, the turn order, the faction screen, etc., but a shortened, informal version of that name used attributively for purposes where it shouldn't be so long. So, for instance:

• Qarthadasht Diplomat
• Roma Army
• Sweboz [insert diacritics, I'm too lazy] Capital
• The following faction has been defeated: Sepot Sopetim Beqarthadasht.
• Battle results:
  Hannibaal, Sepot Sopetim Beqarthadasht, X casualties, Y kills
  Lucius Aemilius Paullus, Res Publica Romanus, X casualties, Y kills

I would use attributive nouns and not adjectives because it's just weird, somehow, to adopt another language's adjectives. So "Tsori Diplomat," "Romanus Army"—those just seem wrong to me, particularly since both languages use postpositive adjectives. As for "Tsorim Diplomat," "Romani Army," just translate that—"Carthaginians Diplomat," "Romans Army"? It doesn't make much sense.

-Simetrical

[khelvan]

Interesting proposal, but for some factions, particularly Carthage, we don't know what a an appropriate (e.g. Punic) abbreviation would be - it would be a pure guess.

[eadingas]

Hmm can we do such distinction, though? I don't remember how the files look like right now, but I had the impression that the game uses one "faction name" variable for all messages, except army/unit tooltips? Or do I remember wrong?
If we can do it, i'm all for it. Still more immersion!

[khelvan]

Naw, there is plenty of flexibility in the display text. You should check my posts more often!

[caesar44]

in the campaign map you should call the factions like in a modern map , that is , the political name
even that is very hard
let us take rome as an example , these are the options -
1. rome (the city itself in english)
2. roma (the city itself in latin)
3. senatus popolusque que romanum (the senate and the roman people in latin , a political term)
4. imperium romanum (all the territories that were under roman control - roman empire)
5. quirites (after the first roman king , romulus-quiritus)
6. just romans
7. the res publica or roman republic (we should remember that rome was a rebublic until 44 or 27 bce)
etc'

so again , in modern political maps we see political names and that should be the choice (for examples - french republic and not the land of the french , us of a and not the americans territories , the state of israel and not the jewish state etc')

[The_678]

I agree with Simetrical that the more formal aspects (diplomacy) of the game should use the Political name, while less formal ones like armies and stuff should use the people.

This is a really hard question to have an ironclad rule though for, as many people have pointed out, so I would say unless you do something along Simetrical's lines (rough base) I would say the people's names in general for gaming ease. If you have tons of long names in foreign languages, people won't really care too much and just use the current name. Eg if you use that long carthage name instead of Tsorim, I'll just think of them as Carthage. As of now even when playing vanilla, I'm hyped enough that I already think of carthage as Tsorim. So for aesthetic reasons I would say the people's names (from what I know)

I hope this thread ain't all out of date and this was a waste of typing.