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  1. #1

    Default Re: Names

    I have looked at all my history books and knowed history links and I have found poorly information about asturican court.

    king Alfonsus II (800-842) restored gothic Aula Regia (or royal Court). I´m not sure he restored exactly, but I am going to put you the offices of gothic Aula Regia in order to allow you use some of them (choose yourself as you like) as asturican offices.

    - Rex (king) or faction leader.
    - dux (duke): military head of a province and usually also civil power. The only historical asturican dux was dux of Galicia (dux Galicarum). (++ influence)
    - Comites- singular comes (Count): were two kind of counts: local counts, as governors of towns and counties, and comites of "officia palatina" (royal court offices)

    a) About local counts we know the powerful count of Castille (comes Castellarum) (+ influence and probably + command due to be a border county), count of Alava (+ influence), count of Bierzo (+ influence), count of Bureba (+ influence), count of Viseo (+ influence), count of Lugo (+ influence), count of Saldaña (or Saldania if you have not ñ) (+ influence), count of Carrion (+ influence), count of Dueñas/Duenias (+ influence)

    b) royal court offices (remember, gothic offices, could not be as exactly as in asturias):
    - comes cubiculi: as in roman times, reliable person near the king, in order to advise him. (++ influence, - personal security, because of the envy and the court plots)
    - comes scanciarum: similar to majordomus in frank kingdom, but with no comparable power (+ influence)
    - comes thesaurorum: head of the royal treasure. (++ management, + tax collection- he does not listen at odd tales at the moment of tax collection )
    - comes patrimonii: administrator about royal inheritance possesions (+ management, could be + farmer and trader)
    - comes notariarum: he controls all the documents of the chancellory (+ management, + influence)
    - comes stabuli: head of the royal stables (I suposse + when command cavalry...)
    - comes spatariorum: head of the personal royal bodyguards (+ perosnal security and could be + command). I think this office really doesn´t exist at asturican times, so be sensible about it.
    - comes civitatis: major of the royal court town. Depend on where you put the capital it could be comes civitatis ovetensis or comes civitatis legionensis, but I think if you are going to let the player to move the capital it could be wise name it as simple "comes regis civitatis". (+ influence, + personal security)

    Of course I will try to achive historial sure asturican offices, but you can begin with these ones.
    Good work, guys!
    Last edited by Nacheras; 11-04-2005 at 21:25.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Names

    Here am I again... :)

    I think about agents (spy, diplomat, assasin), and could be you want to put surnames to them.

    You can use the name+az or -ez about I´ve talking about yet. i.e Froilaz, Garces, Fernandez, Gonzalez, Ansurez, Sanchez, Velez, Vermudez, Ordoniez, Menendez, Ximenez or Jimenez, Nuniez, Munaz, Dieguez or Diaz...

    In fact, I think that at IX century only the great nobles (magnates) used surname.

    You can use the name of the birth town too. And then I provide you of a good list of towns to add as "of..." to the name:
    Cangas, Pravia, Compostela, Valtierra, Gijon, Cosgaya, Tuy, Astorga (Asturica), Lugo (Lucus), Oporto, Braga, Chavez, Viseo, Simancas, Ledesma, Agueda, Salamanca, Zamora, Toro, Saldaña, Mabe, Amaya, Oca, Avila, Segovia, Sepúlveda, Clunica, Arganza, Osma, Miranda, Revenga, Cenicero, Carbonaria, Alesanco,Palencia, Valladolid, Sahagun, Santillana, Burgos, Lamego, Soria, Coca, Vitoria, Calahorra, Najera, Orense, Mieres.
    Last edited by Nacheras; 11-04-2005 at 21:42.

  3. #3
    is not a senior Member Meneldil's Avatar
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    Default Re : Re: Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Nacheras
    Here am I again... :)


    You can use the name of the birth town too. And then I provide you of a good list of towns to add as "of..." to the name:
    Cangas, Pravia, Compostela, Valtierra, Gijon, Cosgaya, Tuy, Astorga (Asturica), Lugo (Lucus), Oporto, Braga, Chavez, Viseo, Simancas, Ledesma, Agueda, Salamanca, Zamora, Toro, Saldaña, Mabe, Amaya, Oca, Avila, Segovia, Sepúlveda, Clunica, Arganza, Osma, Miranda, Revenga, Cenicero, Carbonaria, Alesanco,Palencia, Valladolid, Sahagun, Santillana, Burgos, Lamego, Soria, Coca, Vitoria, Calahorra, Najera, Orense, Mieres.
    Unfortunatly, agents and characters share the same name lists, so either we use surnames for everyone (except captains) or we don't use them at all. Do you know an 'asturian' equivalent for 'of' ? 'De' ?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Re : Re: Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Meneldil
    Unfortunatly, agents and characters share the same name lists, so either we use surnames for everyone (except captains) or we don't use them at all. Do you know an 'asturian' equivalent for 'of' ? 'De' ?
    Mmmmh, difficult question. In fact, there was not "asturian language" in that time. All the official documents were scribed in latin. Surely, as in other parts of "Romania", there was a popular spoken local version of latin, that in later centuries derived in galaic, asturian, leonese or the more spreadly castilian, but first documents in that languages belongs two centuries after the beginning of game.

    "de" is "of" in modern spanish, not at that time.
    If you want to achieve maximum reality, you must to use latin forms for asturian names (and arab forms in arabic alphabet for andalusies ). In fact, most of names I have provide you are modern form spanish names of old latin, gothic or pre-roman names.

    i.e, if you want to name a character as "Vermond of Oviedo", you can post "Vermudo de Oviedo" in modern spanish, but if you want to be historical exactly, you must name as "Veremundus ovetensis" (I think, cause I´m not an expert in latin ).

    Is your choose which form will be used. IMO has no sense to use spanish modern forms, except could be for names without known original forms. And has little sense use a "mix" of spanish, latin and english.
    Using latin forms you really hit a good kick of historically accuracy, but you will need a latin expert, and most of the names I will provide will remain untranslatable or simply posted as "macaronic latin".

    Sorry, I don´t know if I have helped you or have I confused you more.
    In any case please don´t doubt about questioning anything.

    Good work and go on.

  5. #5
    is not a senior Member Meneldil's Avatar
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    Default Re : Names

    Well, yeah, we'll try not to mix ancient latin, modern spanish and visigothic

    The best would be to have some good latin speaker, cause he would be helpful for both Asturians and Franks.

    Btw, could you help me by providing a list of all the names you posted in alphabetical order, kinda like Csatadi did in the previous page ? That would be really handy, cause I currently have a lot of work (studying, helping EB, testing the viking factions )

  6. #6

    Default Re: Re : Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Meneldil
    Well, yeah, we'll try not to mix ancient latin, modern spanish and visigothic
    The best would be to have some good latin speaker, cause he would be helpful for both Asturians and Franks.
    Btw, could you help me by providing a list of all the names you posted in alphabetical order, kinda like Csatadi did in the previous page ? That would be really handy, cause I currently have a lot of work (studying, helping EB, testing the viking factions )
    Male asturian names

    Adaninus
    Adeca
    Adefonsus/Athalfuns (goth)
    Aierio
    Aldroitus
    Aloitus/Alois (german)
    Alvarus
    Annaia
    Ansuro
    Antin
    Anton
    Antonius
    Apringius
    Arduca
    Arias
    Aurelius
    Ausonio
    Adolfus/Astholf (lombard)
    Bagauda
    Beatus
    Belaius
    Bellidus
    Berengarius
    Bernardus
    Boronta
    Bureus
    Calorato
    Casius
    Cesius
    Cervelius
    Christophorus
    Chrsituevalus
    Cisila
    Dia
    Didaco
    Diego
    Dulcidus
    Egerius
    Eita
    Eiximenus
    Elias
    Elipandus
    Elisipus
    Emerardus/Hemerard (goth)
    Eulogius
    Favila-Fafila
    Felix
    Ferdinandus/Ferdinand (goth)
    Fidelius
    Flacencius
    Flacianus
    Flaino
    Flavius
    Florentius
    Fortis
    Fortunius
    Fredegarius/Fredgard (frank)
    Froila
    Garcia
    Gatonius
    Gemellus
    Genesius
    Gisando
    Glimirus/Gelmir (goth)
    Gomis
    Guntericus
    Gustio
    Gutierre
    Harmonius
    Hermenegildus/Ermenkhild (goth)
    Heterius
    Holalio
    Ienesius
    Iohannes
    Kintila
    Julianus
    Lope
    Lucas
    Mames
    Manricus/Mannrikh (goth)
    Martinus
    Matrolo
    Maurecatus
    Melendus
    Menendus
    Monnio
    Monito
    Montano
    Nepotianus
    Nunio
    Nonito
    Odoarius
    Opila
    Ordonio
    Orvano
    Pascual
    Pelagius
    Penoio
    Pepi
    Petrus
    Puniolus
    Radolfus/Randolf (goth)
    Raimundus/Radimund
    Ranemirus/Radomir (goth)
    Recafredus
    Recaredus/Rekhard (goth)
    Revelio
    Rodanio
    Rodericus/Rodrikh (goth)
    Rotibus
    Samson
    Sancio
    Sarracinus
    Saulus
    Savaricus
    Scipionus
    Sebastianus
    Servandus
    Severus
    Silo
    Soario
    Sonna
    Stephanus
    Suinitus
    Tellus
    Teoda
    Teodila
    Teodulfus/Teodulph (german)
    Teudemirus/Teodomir (goth)
    Tinnus
    Tizo
    Toribius
    Usunnio
    Uzerius
    Valerius
    Veila
    Velascus
    Veremundus/Vermund (goth)
    Victorius
    Vida
    Vigila
    Vimaranus/Vimara (goth)
    Vincebilis
    Vincentius
    Zamma
    Zezius
    Zoilus
    Zonius



    Female asturias names

    Aba
    Adosinda
    Aldonza
    Anella
    Argilo
    Bermesinda
    Brunila
    Caudiosa
    Creusa
    Christina
    Elvira
    Ermesinda
    Faquilo
    Favinia
    Froiliuba
    Galla
    Goto
    Hildegarda
    Icka
    Leodegundia
    Marina
    Masita
    Munia
    Nunia
    Nunilona
    Oneca
    Ozenda
    Paterna
    Sancia
    Sara
    Savilli
    Terencia
    Teudilla
    Tezana
    Thisiena
    Togia
    Urbana
    Urraca
    Valeria
    Verilde
    Ximena


    Male Basque (kingdom of Navarra) names

    Antzo
    Asnar
    Bela
    Eblo
    Enneko
    Fortunio/Fortun (basque)
    Garcia
    Gondesalvo
    Gustio
    Rodericus/Ruy (basque)
    Sanctius
    Sigerici/Geriz (basque)
    Ximeno/Gemeno (basque)


    Female basque names

    Aldoncia
    Anderazo
    Belascuza
    Belasquita
    Çinara
    Constanza
    Domeca
    Domicussa
    Elvira
    Emazteona
    Endregoto
    Fronilla
    Iuxta
    Jurdana
    Justa
    Leguntia
    Lupa
    Maria
    Mencia
    Muniadona
    Oneca
    Ortissa
    Sancia
    Toda
    Urraca
    Yenega
    Zianna



    Hispanic Mark (catalonian and aragonese) male names

    Acenar
    Albinus
    Aleran
    Angelinus
    Ansur
    Arifred
    Armengol
    Arnaudus
    Asnarius
    Babila
    Bela
    Belasco
    Bellon
    Bera
    Berenguerius
    Bernardus
    Bertrand
    Bivas
    Borrelius
    Bradila
    Centollius
    Cesarius
    Chacus
    Dacho
    Dato
    Elias
    Enneko
    Ermennisculus
    Estebanus
    Exemeno
    Ferriolus
    Filgolo
    Fortunio
    Galindus
    Garsia
    Gerallo
    Gilbert
    Guillem
    Gundisalvo
    Hug
    Humfred
    Incalzatus
    Magier
    Maiolphus
    Mancio
    Mascarone
    Martinus
    Miro
    Odalric
    Odila
    Oleguer
    Oliba
    Oriol
    Petrus
    Pontius
    Porcelius
    Ranimirus
    Rampo
    Raymond
    Raterus
    Robert
    Rodebaldus
    Rodulf
    Sabarinus
    Sancio
    Salomon
    Sampiro
    Savigildus
    Scemeno
    Scluva
    Suniarius
    Sunifred
    Uincentius
    Vida
    Vigila
    Wifred
    Wiliesindus
    Witard


    Hispanic Mark female names

    Ahalaez
    Ailo
    Ato
    Balla
    Cixilona
    Dadildis
    Emma
    Emon
    Ermisenda
    Ermisindis
    Fakilo
    Maria
    Matrona
    Petronila
    Richildis
    Vinidildes



    All them are real names, from around 750 until around 1030.

    I hope this list will be enough, because I´m exhausted (remembre, that dismish the moralle ) of searching history books.

    Next day I´ll post about surnames in latin.
    But first I will take a short "historic holiday". Surely I´ll pass my time playing RTW-BI or RTR

  7. #7
    is not a senior Member Meneldil's Avatar
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    Default Re : Names

    Thanks a lot Nacheras. I'm adding them to the game right now

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