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Thread: America's irreplaceable ally

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    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default America's irreplaceable ally

    America's irreplaceable ally
    Caroline B. Glick (archive)

    June 18, 2005 | printer friendly version Print | email to a friend Send

    In an in-depth article entitled "How we would fight China" published in the June issue of The Atlantic Monthly, military correspondent Robert D. Kaplan analyzes the encroaching specter of a cold war between the US and China. He also sets out the strategies and tactics that the US military's Pacific Command is constructing to contend with the emerging reality.

    In his words, "the center of gravity of American strategic concern is already the Pacific, not the Middle East." From the US military's perspective, "the current epoch of Middle Eastern conflict... will start to wind down during the second Bush administration."

    Kaplan quotes a US Marine general in the Pacific Command who explains that the nascent US strategy for dealing with China will be based on multilateral military cooperation, or as he put it bluntly, it will be "military multilateralism on steroids." As its Atlantic alliances with NATO countries are breaking down in the face European rejection of America's decision to fight Islamic imperialism rather than appease it, the US is quietly building deep military alliances with countries such as Singapore, India, Australia, Japan and Thailand, which will all play key roles in containing China in the coming cold war in the Pacific.

    Kaplan notes that one of the US's Achilles' heels in building this alliance structure is the technological gap between the US military and these crucial allies in the Pacific. As he writes, "Getting militarily so far ahead of everyone else in the world creates a particular kind of loneliness that not even the best diplomats can always alleviate, because diplomacy itself is worthless if it's not rooted in realistic assessments of comparative power."

    Kaplan's report points to a strategic reality that US policymakers in Washington seem intent on ignoring. Israel's military sales and strategic military ties to linchpin states in the Pacific, like Singapore and India, have made it possible for these states today to center so prominently in American long-term strategic planning for its emerging cold war with China.

    Israel was the first state to offer military assistance to Singapore, back in 1965 when that tiny island nation's entire military amounted to one battalion. For the next 10 years Israel was the only state assisting the Singaporeans, who one US military official interviewed by Kaplan referred to today as "just awesome in every way."

    Israeli military officials involved in strategic cooperation with Singapore explain that the relationship has advanced to the point where most of the arms sales take the form of joint military ventures. Israel sells Singapore weapons systems that are tailor-made for its needs, and Singapore finances much of the research and development of these systems. Until it was outpaced by India, Singapore was the Israeli military industries' largest client. Sales range from hundreds of millions to billions of dollars per year.

    While military cooperation with India has only become prominent in recent years, Israel was assisting India militarily as early as the 1960s, during its war with Pakistan. Today, between multi-billion dollar annual military sales and joint training exercises, Israel's strategic importance for the modernization of the Indian military is undeniable.

    In cultivating its relationships with countries like Singapore and India, Israel's defense planners have followed a clear rationale that fuses commercial and strategic concerns. On the one hand, for Israel to maintain its military superiority over the Arabs, it must have a cutting-edge arms industry. For the industry to remain state-of-the-art, Israel must develop export markets to make its research, development and production costs manageable and sustainable. On the other hand, Israel has a strategic, long-term interest in developing ties with countries like India and Singapore, which share similar threats and concerns, because at the end of the day, these states form natural alliances with Israel.

    Today, rather than thank Israel and India and Singapore for their forward thinking, whose importance to the US is unquestionable, the US is punishing them. This week it was reported that following Israel's misguided sale of Harpy aerial drones to China, Washington is now demanding control over its weapons exports to India and Singapore.

    There can be no doubt that Israel's decision to sell advanced weapons systems to China was strategically blind. China does not only threaten US interests. Through its missile sales to Iran and Saudi Arabia, it also threatens Israel's national security interests. In the wake of US wrath over the Harpy deal, Israel has corrected its behavior and agreed not to sell weapons systems to China in the future.

    It is more than possible that the US attempt to take away Israel's independence in developing its exports markets is simply an attempt to hitch a ride on the current crisis with China to advance the interests of US weapons manufacturers, who have trouble competing with their Israeli counterparts. Yet in so acting, not only is the US harming its relations with Israel and damaging Israel's reputation internationally, it is also insulting Singapore and India by acting as though there is something wrong with these US allies' acquisition of advanced weapons systems.

    In comparing the ease of crafting a strategy for contending with China to the difficulty of formulating policy on the Middle East, Kaplan makes one of the most common American mistakes in characterizing the constraints on their actions in the Arab world. Kaplan writes, "Our actions in the Pacific will not be swayed by the equivalent of the Israel lobby; Protestant evangelicals will care less about the Pacific Rim than about the fate of the Holy Land."

    Yet what Israel's cultivation of its own bilateral strategic ties with countries like Singapore and India shows is that when Israel is behaving in a strategically responsible way, it is also advancing America's strategic interests. This is the case because, at the end of the day, the two countries share the same enemies and therefore are drawn to the same potential allies.

    That is, the foundation of the US-Israel alliance is not American altruism or domestic political pressure to save God's Chosen People from destruction. The rationale behind the US-Israel alliance is the fact that Israel is a strong, self-sufficient democracy whose strength and stability, both locally and globally, enhance US national security.

    When, as happened this week, Palestinian Authority cabinet ministers insanely announce that Israel is trying to poison the Palestinians by selling them cancer-causing juices, there should be no place for doubt as to who America's ally is in the Middle East. Indeed, the levels of cultural anti-Americanism and anti-Semitism in Palestinian society and the Arab world should make it absolutely clear to Washington that a strong Israel is a national security necessity.

    Yet, in the Americans' haste this week to humiliate Israel and emasculate its arms industry, even at the expense of its other allies, we see a disturbing indication that as the Bush administration slogs through its second term, it is intent on ignoring the strategic realities of the region and indeed of the global strategic environment, preferring instead to try to appease the Arabs and the Europeans at Israel's expense in the hopes of receiving their cooperation in the future.

    This latest American move was not carried out in a vacuum. It comes against of backdrop of a disconcerting pattern of behavior by the administration that leads inexorably to the devastating conclusion that the US is moving to abandon its alliance with Israel. The publication of the federal indictment against former Pentagon analyst Larry Franklin this week is case in point.

    From a perusal of the charges against Franklin, the following picture emerges: Franklin, a hawk on Iran's nuclear weapons program, sought to bring his views to the attention of decision-makers. In so doing, he did what countless Washington policy analysts do on a daily basis. He sought to build a coalition with like-minded thinkers outside the government.

    According to the indictment, Franklin passed no significant classified information to AIPAC officials or to Naor Gillon at the Israeli embassy. He received no compensation for his relationships with them. All he did was talk about Iran with people who share his concerns in the hope that they could – through their official dealings with administration officials – advance his views.

    Franklin's one crime, it would seem, was his unquestioning view of Israel as a strategic ally of the US at a time when powerful circles in Washington are trying to disengage from this alliance. Had he conducted identical conversations with British diplomats or pro-Japanese lobbyists, there is little doubt that he would still be sitting behind his desk at the Pentagon.

    Franklin has pleaded innocent to all charges submitted against him. His trial is set to start on September 6. To a degree, what will really be on trial will be the question of whether the US does or does not view Israel as its ally.

    And so the question necessarily arises: If the Bush administration is planning to abandon Israel, who does it think will replace it? Egypt, an economic basket-case run by a dictator who galvanizes popular support by cultivating societal hatred of America? Saudi Arabia, which is now pushing a policy with the International Atomic Energy Agency that will allow it to accumulate small quantities of uranium and plutonium which it could easily transfer to terrorist organizations for the purpose of attacking the US?

    Israel was wrong to sell weapons systems to China. But the damage done to US national security interests has been effectively brought under control. The damage that the US's increasingly hostile position toward Israel is doing to US national security interests will not be so easily contained. The positive consequences for America of its alliance with a strong and secure Israel are enormous and unique. The negative consequences of an abandonment of Israel will be equally vast.

    Why would Singapore or India or any other US ally trust an America that would abandon Israel? And how will the US be more secure if it increases its dependence on Arab regimes that are inherently hostile to it and everything it stands for?
    I doubt Bush will abandon Israel.
    Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way

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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    I doubt Bush will abandon Israel.
    I agree , no matter how many spies are caught , how much US technology is stolen , how many secret WMD programs it has , how much weaponry it sells to countries that he considers a threat to America , how much money it costs tax payers to prop up the State he will never abandon Israel .

    The rationale behind the US-Israel alliance is the fact that Israel is a strong, self-sufficient democracy whose strength and stability, both locally and globally, enhance US national security.
    Is Caroline on drugs or something ? It seems she must be because she writes
    Egypt, an economic basket-case run by a dictator who galvanizes popular support by cultivating societal hatred of America? Saudi Arabia, which is now pushing a policy with the International Atomic Energy Agency that will allow it to accumulate small quantities of uranium and plutonium which it could easily transfer to terrorist organizations for the purpose of attacking the US?
    But they are your allies and you help prop up their rulers .

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    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    "“Every time we do something, you [Shimon Peres] tell me America will do this and will do that... I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.”"

    Ariel Sharon
    Unto each good man a good dog

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut
    "“Every time we do something, you [Shimon Peres] tell me America will do this and will do that... I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.”"

    Ariel Sharon
    I also used that quote here, but I had to take it back because there is no evidence that he really said that.

    America is Israel's friend, but I am not so sure about the other way around. Use and abuse.
    Last edited by Fragony; 06-18-2005 at 10:55.

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    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony
    America is Israel's friend.
    America is Israel's bitch.
    Unto each good man a good dog

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut
    America is Israel's bitch.
    That is what I said I don't understand america's dedication, Israel didn't mind sinking one of their ships or buldozering their citizens. The jewish lobby is either very strong in America or americans are fools, and I don't think americans are fools.

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    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    The Jewish lobby in the US is second only to the gun lobby. No other country on Earth can manipulate the US as well as Israel. Even Americans cannot manipulate America as well as Israel can.

    One day, I swear...

    "I pledge allegiance to the flag, of the United Sates and Israel."
    Last edited by Beirut; 06-18-2005 at 11:19.
    Unto each good man a good dog

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    Senior Member Senior Member Ser Clegane's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Hmm ... the "Jewish lobby" - an argument that is brought forward very often.

    If there really is such a powerful "Jewish lobby" - does anybody know what it actually would be based on?
    According to the CIA World Factbook Jewish and Muslim people each account for ca. 1% of the US population - so voting power does not seem to be the issue here.

    Is it the "Jewish capital" and its economic power in the US?

    I do not have any numbers here but it seems that Arab investors hold quite a significant share in the US economy - adding to that there is the dependency of the US economy on oil from muslim countries.

    I would like to understand what exactly the often mentioned "Jewish lobby" is based on in the US - if there is one - I, quite frankly, do not really know ... it just sometimes seems to have a little bit of an "urban lengend" character.

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    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    America's irreplaceable ally:

    Romania
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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Ser Clegane
    it just sometimes seems to have a little bit of an "urban lengend" character.
    That I have to agree with.

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    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut
    The Jewish lobby in the US is second only to the gun lobby. No other country on Earth can manipulate the US as well as Israel. Even Americans cannot manipulate America as well as Israel can.
    Hmm, really? I thought it was the fundamentalist Christian zealots who were supposed to be running everything in the US, but now we're being run by the Jews.... Im so confused.
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    Standing Up For Rationality Senior Member Ronin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xiahou
    Hmm, really? I thought it was the fundamentalist Christian zealots who were supposed to be running everything in the US, but now we're being run by the Jews.... Im so confused.

    fundamentalist christian zealots support the state of israel.....

    am i wrong or doesn´t it say somewere in the bible that if at the end of the world the state of israel must be in existante or no one is getting into heaven?...i saw a documentary about this source of support some time ago....but can´t remembber the source.....it was stated that the christian right wing were big supporters of israel´s position in the states..
    "If given the choice to be the shepherd or the sheep... be the wolf"
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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronin
    fundamentalist christian zealots support the state of israel.....

    am i wrong or doesn´t it say somewere in the bible that if at the end of the world the state of israel isn´t in existante no one is getting into heaven?...i saw a documentary about this source of support some time ago....but can´t remembber the source.....it was stated that the christian right wing were big supporters of israel´s position in the states..
    When the country of Israel is established the messias will come and he will convert all jews to christianity, no kidding

    it is a reborn christian thing.

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    Standing Up For Rationality Senior Member Ronin's Avatar
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    Wink Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony
    When the country of Israel is established the messias will come and he will convert all jews to christianity, no kidding

    it is a reborn christian thing.

    uhmm......born again christian´s.....


    i´m somewhat familiar with the fenomenon.....that´s like.....extra strenght crazy right?
    "If given the choice to be the shepherd or the sheep... be the wolf"
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    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Ok, I think I get it now... the fundamentalist Christians who run the US are in cahoots with the Jews and are their "bitch" because they believe that state of Israel is necessary for their salvation.

    It's all so perfect, yet so insiduous....
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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronin
    uhmm......born again christian´s.....


    i´m somewhat familiar with the fenomenon.....that´s like.....extra strenght crazy right?
    Born again christian is a strange thing, they want to get back inside but reject oral sex! Head first gentlemen, it takes a lot of effort to be reborn.

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    Mad Professor Senior Member Hurin_Rules's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Christian interpretations of the bible do indeed state that the conversion of the Jews to Christianity will mark the onset of the last days and final judgement. In the Middle Ages, popes protected Jews, and one of the reasons was that they believed that if there were no Jews around, the prophesies of the last days could not be achieved. This belief continued in an unbroken line into modern times. It was still around when Cromwell decided to let some Jews back into England, and it is still around in many evangelical denominations today.

    Is the whole Jewish cabbal thing exaggerated by Arab media? Surely. But Jews and Israel do have power in America disproportionate to their population. For one, the Jews in America tend to be far wealthier than their Arab counterparts, even when the odd oil-rich sheik is included, and far more prominent in the civil service and public interest organizations. Second, powerful Jewish lobby groups like Bnai Brith combine with disproportionate Jewish representation in the Film, television, newspaper and other forms of media:

    http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/jewishlobby.shtml

    So no, there is no single, all-powerful 'Jewish lobby,' but Jews do have a degree of influence on American media far out of proportion to their population. Combine this with the religious views of the evangelicals and the US military's strategic alliance with Israel, and you have a nation of Israel that has much more power over the USA than one would expect.
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    probably bored Member BDC's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    China can't attack America. It's entire economy relies on exports to the US and the rest of the world, and none of its 'allies' are going to help it if the US attacks are they?

    Plus the country would fall apart if the leadership was distracted with a war. The distant parts would rebel and it'd just become a messy civil war again.

    Who cares about the so-called Jewish lobby. You'd think they all had a group mind and acted as one by the way it's described.

  19. #19

    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    they act as one because it's all being directed by a massive conspiracy.

    It's all outlined in the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion".

    Or Jews are actually bees in disguise.

  20. #20

    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    "“Every time we do something, you [Shimon Peres] tell me America will do this and will do that... I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.”"

    Ariel Sharon
    Could you give the time and place where he said that and to whom he said it?

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    Member Member sharrukin's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    This is all I could find on it.

    "The quote is attributed to Kol Israel radio. Attributed by the Independent Palestinian Information Network and it seems to come from a press release from the pro-Hamas group, the IAP (Islamic Association for Palestine).

    In a May 10, 2002 column ("Now Isn't the Time for Bush League Moves"), nationally-syndicated columnist Georgie Anne Geyer included these allegations against Prime Minister Sharon and Israel's supporters in America.

    Finally, Geyer's syndicate disseminated the following Editor's Note which appeared on June 14 in the Chicago Tribune and Sarasota Herald Tribune and will likely be published by other papers that ran Geyer's May 10 column."

    Editor's note: Georgie Anne Geyer's May 10 column included a quote from Ariel Sharon, 'I control America.' This quote was widely reported in the Palestinian press but cannot be confirmed in independent sources. Geyer and Universal Press Syndicate regret not having attributed the quote more specifically.

    "Extensive Nexis and Internet searches have found that no mainstream news organization reported as true the fabricated quotation.

    Kol Yisrael confirmed that no such broadcast occurred."

    This is somewhat paraphrased.
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."
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    Member Member Efrem's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    MWHAHAHAH

    You'd better watch out Bireit the Vaste jewish conspiracy is now out to get you!!!

    Next we may even babtise your children!!

    Better get together another progrom soon or who knows what we devil worshipers will get up to!
    Viva La Rasa!!!

  23. #23

    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Figures.. Check your sources before posting palestinian propaganda please!

  24. #24
    Tree Killer Senior Member Beirut's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Hmmm, I could have been mistaken. Seems he might have said "We control America" as opposed to "We the Jewish people control America."

    I regret my possible error and say that I feel much better about him now. I feel like giving him a big hug to celebrate his humanitarianism. Really-really.

    Mind you, given Sharon's history of directly participating in the killing of women and children, I have to admit to not feeling that bad about painting an ever so slightly skewed portrait of him.
    Unto each good man a good dog

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    Jillian & Allison's Daddy Senior Member Don Corleone's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    There's no suggestion, from any independent verification, that he said any such thing: that Israel controls America or that he personally controls America. Beirut, one of these days you're going to have to learn that while hyperbole can be a useful tool in particular situations, employing it into your coherent view makes your coherent view unpalatable and you lose fence sitters who might have agreed with you.

    As far as America being Israel's bitch, well, yes, it is certainly a one-sided love affair. But what do they really have to offer? It would be nice if they didn't steal US state secrets we decided not to share with them, but as there's very few of our allies, Israel included, that we do not spy on, it would be a bit hypocritical to cry foul too loud.

    What DOES anger me in these situations is when they attempt to dictate to us how to deal with American citizens caught collaborating. Johnathan Pollard committed multiple counts of treason. The fact that he did it to aid an ally and not an enemy is why he should be incarcerated for the rest of his natural life (as opposed to facing a firing squad). When Laura Bush went over there last month, and the ever so grateful Israeli's booed and protested her over Pollard, that DID make my blood boil. How we treat Pollard is none of their
    F%#@&NG business and it implies we have no right to sovereignty when they take their interest in Mr. Pollard to that level. Mrs. Bush should have promptly called her trip short and told Sharon "When you're ready to treat me like the first lady of the United States, I will consider returning". Shame on her and her husband for disrespecting the office by laying down and 'taking it with a smile'.

    Also, as long as Israel continues to sell our weapons systems to China, they need to be placed under technology control. I don't think Singapore, Japan, South Korea or India are particularly pleased with this new development, or the United State's decision to turn a blind eye to it. Either Bush has decided that China is not a strategic threat, or Israel wields entirely too much power within this administration. There's no 3rd alternative on that one.

    And this is from somebody who actually supports Israel as one of our closest allies. I just wish they'd start acting like it...
    "A man who doesn't spend time with his family can never be a real man."
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Mind you, given Sharon's history of directly participating in the killing of women and children, I have to admit to not feeling that bad about painting an ever so slightly skewed portrait of him.
    That is an unproven allegation Beirut .
    And it will remain unproven since the main witness (A Lebanese colonel who led the massacre oops security operation) who claimed to have evidence of Sharons complicity had the misfortune to walk into a bullet just before he was due at the war crimes tribunal .
    Now , what were Ariels comments about that little assasination ?

    Edit , my mistake , it was a bomb not a bullet .
    Last edited by Tribesman; 06-19-2005 at 14:13.

  27. #27
    dictator by the people Member caesar44's Avatar
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    Smile Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    Quote Originally Posted by Beirut
    The Jewish lobby in the US is second only to the gun lobby. No other country on Earth can manipulate the US as well as Israel. Even Americans cannot manipulate America as well as Israel can.

    One day, I swear...

    "I pledge allegiance to the flag, of the United Sates and Israel."

    waow "the jew control the world" all over again ...............
    oh america , the big bad israel is cotroling you
    america be ware israel is going to eat you
    tommorow you should accuse israel to blast your WTC
    loby shmoby suddenly bush is zionist ah ?
    "The essence of philosophy is to ask the eternal question that has no answer" (Aristotel) . "Yes !!!" (me) .

    "Its time we stop worrying, and get angry you know? But not angry and pick up a gun, but angry and open our minds." (Tupac Amaru Shakur)

  28. #28

    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    you do realise the Jews are using MTV to destroy the Western World

  29. #29
    Scruffy Looking Nerf Herder Member Steppe Merc's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    caesar44, Beirut's a Canadian.

    While I don't think there is any big conspiracy for Isreal to control the world, I do not think we ought to support a country that has commited so much state sanctioned murder and destruction. I'm not saying we should cut off all communication or anything, just stop selling them weapons and stuff.

    Oh, and move them from our "friend" list to "neutral" list. That'll teach em.

    "But if you should fall you fall alone,
    If you should stand then who's to guide you?
    If I knew the way I would take you home."
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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: America's irreplaceable ally

    "...with countries such as Singapore, India, Australia, Japan and Thailand, which will all play key roles in containing China in the coming cold war in the Pacific."

    Well 3 of those countries are members of the British Commonwealth.

    Singapore, India and Australia.

    Nor has it been Israel propping up those countries and getting their economies more technologically advanced. Pakistan certainly didn't get a hand up from Israel and it has been exporting nuclear technology.

    Singapore is its own business and technological powerhouse and that is definitly a fusion of all the cultures that make up Singapore and a strange cross of benign dictatorship / democracy that it is.

    India is a massively poor nation yet it gleefully spends billions on nuclear weapons. Its high tech industry is massive and this has more to do with outsourcing of banks and IT companies then influx of weapons technology.

    Australias arms industry peaked at the boomerang. I don't think its modernisation is too far behind the rest of the World barring travelling to work on Kangaroo back.

    I think the 'facts' in this article ignore the larger picture. The friendship that the US has with these other countries is just like that it has with Israel, based on mutual benefit and trust. These are obviously enhanced with Commonwealth countries.
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
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    Pape for global overlord!!
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    Squid sources report that scientists taste "sort of like chicken"
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    The rest is either as average as advertised or, in the case of the missionary, disappointing.

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