Shifting Alliances and Shifty Allies

[Beirut]

But, I would say Canada is one of our better allies, and the Canadian people are some of our best friends in the world. They may irritate the hell out of us sometimes, but isn't it always the best friends that provoke the biggest reaction? If Uruguay came out and denounced US foreign policy, who cares... but when Canada does, there's a lot more sting to it. Precisely because we are so close.

Wisdom.

[sharrukin]

Tell that to my right-wing Republican buddy in Texas who campaigned for Bush during the last election.

He knows I'm a Liberal and I know he's a Conservative. But both of us are smart enough to see past our political differences and focus instead on the far more important things that we have in common.

And your statement sounds dangerously close to "America is Bush and Bush is America."

I swear I heard a statement like that somewhere before...

This may be close. Not exactly a wise path.

Hess closes with the sycophantic chant, "Hitler is the Party, Hitler is Germany, Germany is Hitler". The whole room starts to sing arousing Nazi song.

We in Canada have a healthy contempt for the boobs we elect! I certainly hope no one is judging our nation based on them?

[Productivity]

Name one other nation who, in 24 hours, can unload 10,000 United States marines or soldiers, anywhere on earth.

No other nation has 10,000 United States Marines.

On the other hand, there may be other nations that have an equivalent amount of their own armed forces...

[Pindar]

Pindar-san,

Would like to reply but been fighting flames, now off for a weekend of shopping of cots, baby blankets and the other requirements.

In short I am using the criteria of what was happening at the time.

Nor is your nation look like it is going to do the "babysitting" long term, if it is not prepared to look after the child till it is eighteen it shouldn't of got knocked up in the first place kind of answer.

OK, we can pick this up if you're interested later on. If you wish to to so, I would like you to consider: what legal distinction occured during the Taisho Period as opposed to Meiji that qualified the nation as a democracy and then what was the legislative change that ended it with the coming of the Showa Period?

[Tribesman]

Before any more comments are made on this article about an opinion poll .
Would it not be a good idea if we knew what the actual questions that were asked in the poll are , and which answers to which questions the author of the article used to write this piece .

[Ironside]

but China is still an important issue in Europe (or maybe only in France)

Maybe, we don't hear much about China here atleast.

[Efrem]

Seeds need soil.

Democracy needs a lower and middle class that is pushing for more political clout instead of just leaving it to the upper class.

This requires that the middle class has enough economic clout and ability as does the lower class.

Try and name a viable democracy that doesn't have an active middle class?

Not many in the mix.

Yes thats because Democracy creates an active middle class, Aus didn't have a middle to speak of when we became a democracy, yet look at us now. It seems almost a chicken and egg debate, but by implanting a democracy we leave a chicken.

I seem to remember Iraqis risking life and limb to vote yet many people had siad they didn't want or weren't ready for a democracy. With time and effort and unfotunatly sacrafice from the western world, the entire world can become democracy's and that is as near to utopia we will ever get.

[sharrukin]

I seem to remember Iraqis risking life and limb to vote yet many people had siad they didn't want or weren't ready for a democracy. With time and effort and unfotunatly sacrafice from the western world, the entire world can become democracy's and that is as near to utopia we will ever get.

It takes more than voting to make a democracy. The citizens of Soviet republics got to vote, there just wasn't a wide selection of candidates. Wanting power through the ballot box does not indicate democratic intentions. A true democratic spirit will be demonstrated in Iraq when the west has gone home and the enemies of those in power are at the mercy of the majority. That is the true test of democracy. That phase hasn't even begun in Iraq.

[Tribesman]

That phase hasn't even begun in Iraq.
That phase will not even begin in Iraq under the current rules as simple majority rule is not applicable under the proposed constitution .

[Papewaio]

Yes thats because Democracy creates an active middle class, Aus didn't have a middle to speak of when we became a democracy, yet look at us now. It seems almost a chicken and egg debate, but by implanting a democracy we leave a chicken.

I seem to remember Iraqis risking life and limb to vote yet many people had siad they didn't want or weren't ready for a democracy. With time and effort and unfotunatly sacrafice from the western world, the entire world can become democracy's and that is as near to utopia we will ever get.

Wrong a hundred years ago Australia had a fairly well off working class, look at the farmers, shearers, gold miners and other workers of the land. Also the British influence. So we had monetary and cultural heritage.

Australia started off as a democracy because we where already part of one. The independance we gained was because of a growing wealth of the citizens of the nation and hence the economic and education and cultural elements where already in place.

[Papewaio]

OK, we can pick this up if you're interested later on. If you wish to to so, I would like you to consider: what legal distinction occured during the Taisho Period as opposed to Meiji that qualified the nation as a democracy and then what was the legislative change that ended it with the coming of the Showa Period?

I would say it would be the western influence, affulence and social trends that happened during that time period.

[Papewaio]

The idea that you can like the American people but hate Bush flew out the window last November really.

Even after the Iraq war, he was elected again. I guess it would be fine to say "We dont have a problem with 48% of you.", but the majority re-affirmed his policies in the voting booth.

Dude even if we vote for a leader here in Australia, it doesn't mean we kiss his butt. I voted for Howard, it doesn't stop me taking the p!ss out of him at every opportunity.

Get used to the idea that in a robust democracy the leaders are going to get heckled just like professional sports players do as well.

I also think it is a failing in a democracy when we treat our leaders like absolute rulers. They are there to do their best for their countries, if they are not doing the best then they should be critisized, hopefully constructively.

[Pindar]

I would say it would be the western influence, affulence and social trends that happened during that time period.

This doesn't answer my question. Western influence is not a legal category.

The Basic legal provisions in all their oligarchic glory did not change during the Taisho Period. What did change was the Emperor was a loon. This weakness on the part of the nations' sovereign allowed for some unsteadiness (encroachment of some communist groups etc.) but it is an error to assume democracy was suddenly born.

Let me note a few of the provisions of the 1889 Constitution of Japan that was in force until the end of WWII to give you some of the flavor of Japanese law:

Article 1. The Empire of Japan shall be reigned over and governed by a line of Emperors unbroken for ages eternal.

Article 3. The Emperor is sacred and inviolable.
Article 4. The Emperor is the head of the Empire, combining in Himself the rights of sovereignty, and exercises them, according to the provisions of the present Constitution.

Article 13. The Emperor declares war, makes peace, and concludes treaties.

Article 33. The Imperial Diet shall consist of two Houses, a House of Peers and a House of Representatives.

Article 34. The House of Peers shall, in accordance with the ordinance concerning the House of Peers, be composed of the members of the Imperial Family, of the orders of nobility, and of those who have been nominated thereto by the Emperor.

(The House of Peers was by appointment only, as noted and had veto power of any lower house action.)

There was no universal suffrage in Japan. Japanese who were allowed to vote had to have a certain income level as determined by tax roles. Thus, only the upper tier of society were allowed participatory rights.

The Meiji Reformers looked in many ways to Bismarck's Germany as a model and thus tried to create a strong monarchist approach with a degree of participation, but kept control centralized. This standard did not change until after the WWII.

[Papewaio]

Having a monarch does not negate a democracy or are you stating that Britain, Australia, Canada and New Zealand are not democracies?

The Japanese people where the ones pushing more for social and democratic reform. Democracy is as much a grassroot as lead from the top change. The Taisho period was a cumulation of what was already happening.

[cegorach]

[QUOTE=sharrukin]It takes more than voting to make a democracy. The citizens of Soviet republics got to vote, there just wasn't a wide selection of candidates.

Fake elections without any meaning - bad example, extremely bad.

[Pindar]

Having a monarch does not negate a democracy or are you stating that Britain, Australia, Canada and New Zealand are not democracies?

To the degree a Monarch has power, to that same degree the nation is not democratic.

Japan's Emperor was no figure head, he was the real head of the nation just as the Kaiser, or the Czar. To assume otherwise is antiquated and to fundamentally misunderstand the way Japan operated

The Japanese people where the ones pushing more for social and democratic reform. Democracy is as much a grassroot as lead from the top change. The Taisho period was a cumulation of what was already happening.

To label a country a democracy means the legal dicta of the country must reflect democratic norms i.e.. popular sovereignty. If an individual or even a group opines for democracy that alone does not a democracy make. If that is your standard then every nation in the world is a democracy as there is always someone that can be pointed to. There were no vast democratic movements in Pre-war Japan. There were no significant groups pushing for the ouster of the Emperor.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

No other nation has 10,000 United States Marines.

On the other hand, there may be other nations that have an equivalent amount of their own armed forces...

Well of course they dont have US Marines. But no other nation or even the US army can match the Marines as a rapid deployment force. Its bigger than many nations armed forces and has its own airforce not to mention the US Navy to chauffer it around.

[sharrukin]

[QUOTE=cegorach1]

It takes more than voting to make a democracy. The citizens of Soviet republics got to vote, there just wasn't a wide selection of candidates.

Fake elections without any meaning - bad example, extremely bad.

As an example to indicate that "It takes more than voting to make a democracy" it is a very good example!

[Auctoritas]

Well of course they dont have US Marines. But no other nation or even the US army can match the Marines as a rapid deployment force. Its bigger than many nations armed forces and has its own airforce not to mention the US Navy to chauffer it around.

Actually, the U.S. Army 101st is able to respond and deploy substantially quicker than any existing U.S. Marine Corps asset. The limiting issue for the 101st (and almost all other fast reaction forces as well) is the inherent "light" nature of their equipment and their lack of an ability to sustain combat operations.

The USMC has carved out its niche as a (my quotes) "relatively rapid" response force which is capable of sustaining operations with organic support only, for months at a time.

From a "chauffeur" who knows....

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Actually, the U.S. Army 101st is able to respond and deploy substantially quicker than any existing U.S. Marine Corps asset.

I dont think so. Im sure a force recon team could be dispatched in minutes . Your talking a division. Hardly comparably to the 10000 strong FMF. No other country or armed service again can deploy so large and imposing a force that fast to any point on the globe.

[Auctoritas]

I dont think so. Im sure a force recon team could be dispatched in minutes . Your talking a division. Hardly comparably to the 10000 strong FMF. No other country or armed service again can deploy so large and imposing a force that fast to any point on the globe.

We are probably comparing apples and oranges here.

In a fast response scenario, USMC Force Recon would only be the force of choice if there was an amphibious group in theatre. If they were there, and the operation was small in scope they would certainly be an option.

I can assure you though, there are NO 10,000 FMFs in hot standby to execute tasking.... 2000+ is about the maximum number of USMC you would see available without MASSIVE prior planning; and that's only if an ARG was on scene.