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  1. #1
    Grand Master Member Afonso I of Portugal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Templar Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus
    I've heard so, yes. However, I've also heard some of these ships actually reached the America's. Most importantly, however, it seems this ship contained the order's treasure (see "National treasure"? ). I personally find it hard to believe this were to be the Holy Grail itself. (also, that leaves the question: what ís the Holy Grail, or, better still, is it a person instead of an object?)

    I'd say so too. It would certainly explain why indeed the Portuguese and Scottish kings didn't believe these accusations
    Concerning to the Portuguese, it's true that King Dinis didn't believe those accusations of heresy, and he simply founded the Order Of Christ to replace the portuguese templars and many others knights who fled to Tomar. However, the Kings of Portugal have many reasons to support the Templars, because:
    - Their presence dates back to 1128, when Portugal was just a county of Leon-Castile.
    - The Templars support Portugal's independence in 1143.
    - They were given extensive possessions and castles in frontier land, during the "reconquista".
    - They built the Tomar Castle, one of their major strongholds in Europe.
    (see "Order of Christ" in wikipedia)

    Part of Templar fleet did reached portuguese ports, however the order's treasure seems to have disapeared...or not?
    In fact, the first ages of the Order Of Christ were indeed prosperous and they launched the first great wave of expeditions of the period of discoveries; with templar ships and money? well, there are no conclusive evidences and we just may guess...
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  2. #2
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Templar Thread

    Not with the ships, that's for sure. The Templars got wiped in very early 1300s; the Discoveries started in mid-late 1400s and really only got underway a while late.

    During the time inbetween there were some pretty major advances in European shipbuilding.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Templar Thread

    Templars discover America?

    http://www.templarhistory.com/1578633176.html

    After the Pope officially disbanded the Knight Templar organisation, those remaining fled principally to Scotland and Portugal, two nations who refused to accept the Pope's authority. Most of their confiscated wealth was redistributed to another religious order, the Hospitalliers of St John, thought to be linked with the Vatican.

    The secrecy of the order has intrigued many, as inconclusive evidence points to holy artifacts such as the Holy Grail, and the Ark of the Covenant and whatever else they may have found under the Temple of Solomon. Treasure hunters have tunneled 200 feet deep into the recesses of Oak Island in search of what may be the final resting place of the Templar legacy. Did they discover America before Columbus (who flew the Templars red cross on his sails) and take an instrumental part in the American independence? (Most of the American leaders of the time were Masons) Did the Templars hold an ancient knowledge, and did they find powerful sacred artifacts that caused their swift rise?
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/alabaster/A203554

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    Grand Master Member Afonso I of Portugal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Templar Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman
    Not with the ships, that's for sure. The Templars got wiped in very early 1300s; the Discoveries started in mid-late 1400s and really only got underway a while late.

    During the time inbetween there were some pretty major advances in European shipbuilding.
    Yes that's true, but i didn't say that the templar ships used in 1312 were the same used one century after! their tecnology could be used and improved.

    In Portugal and Spain, the religious-military orders were major sponsors of the first expeditions to overseas, improving shipbuilding. For example, the caravel, was a mercant ship used mainly in the mediterranean, but was readapt with new sails and equipment to navigate in the atlantic.

    I think the huge crosses in sails used by Portuguese (cross of Christ) and Spanish (Cross of Santiago) ships in the beginning of the discoveries could be a sign of their sponsor or a sign to be recognized by fellow christians in distant lands.
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    "What does not kill us makes us stronger" - Friedrich Nietzsche.
    "Lord, protect me from people who love and trust, because I take care of my enemies" - Voltaire.
    "I can not agree with any of the words you say but defend to the death your right to say them" - Voltaire.
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  5. #5
    Master of useless knowledge Senior Member Kitten Shooting Champion, Eskiv Champion Ironside's Avatar
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    Default Re: Templar Thread

    For example, one of the order's memebers confessed new members were made to defile the bible and spit on the cross during their inauguration. This was supposed to prepare them against Muslim torture, he said. This explanation sounds highly dubious to me.
    As all confessions came out of torture and was then later denied, those confessions are of questionalbe quality.

    About them who fled to Scotland, they merged with the Hospitaliers there, the Hospitaliers got even a name change to the Templars of St John or something like that.

    I think the huge crosses in sails used by Portuguese (cross of Christ) and Spanish (Cross of Santiago) ships in the beginning of the discoveries could be a sign of their sponsor or a sign to be recognized by fellow christians in distant lands.
    It worth noticing that the reconquista was still more of less active at the time. Grenada fell 1492.
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