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Thread: Help Bush

  1. #1
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Help Bush

    There were enough threads about Bush and the things he is doing. Many members said that he was wrong others said he was right. I guess the argues are clear now.
    I miss alternative solutions. What would you do if you were President of the United States? How would you fight terror and solve the Iraq problems?
    Please only positive suggestions. No: I'd stop doing ...

  2. #2
    Bringing down the vulgaroisie Member King Henry V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Do nothing with Iraq. Some places just aren't ready for democracy. Does anyone really think that the Iraqis are better off now than when Saddam Hussein was in power? Which would you prefer: a quiet life with enough food, electricity, gas and hospitals but no right to vote or express yourself politically? Or the right to vote and express yourself (sometimes at the risk of one's life) but in a highly dangerous and volatile situation, where even going to the market is a risk?
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Help Bush

    I would fight terror by killing each and every individual convicted of carrying out acts of terror, I would also if possible do it in such a way that they would be denied their spiritual afterlife. The next country that I found to be funding terrorists organisations I would annihilate, and I mean the whole country. I wouldn't make any excuses about WMD or corrupt regimes, I would simply issue the warning and then act. Along with the stick you would need a carrot, this would be improved trade agreements, aid packages and/or military and political support for countries willing to ally against the terrorists.

    Of course this wouldn't work in this day and age, but you did ask.

  4. #4
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by King Henry V
    Do nothing with Iraq.
    Do nothing is not an option anymore. Going out of Iraq would only increase the trouble, don't you think so?

  5. #5
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Ja'chyra
    Of course this wouldn't work in this day and age, but you did ask.
    Why wouldn't it?
    So what would you do this day?

  6. #6
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    I would speed up the creation off Iraqi Army and Police Forces.When that would be done.I would withdraw from Iraq as soon ass possible.If that would create problems inside Iraq.I would bring it up in UN.So it would be legimite to International community to send there peacekeepers.
    Other thing what id do is that i would stop chasing Al Qaida and Osama Bin Laden with my own troops.Instead i would promise such high fees for their heads that any deacent mercenary could not say no to it.
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

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    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by kagemusha
    I would speed up the creation off Iraqi Army and Police Forces.When that would be done.I would withdraw from Iraq as soon ass possible.If that would create problems inside Iraq.I would bring it up in UN.So it would be legimite to International community to send there peacekeepers.
    Other thing what id do is that i would stop chasing Al Qaida and Osama Bin Laden with my own troops.Instead i would promise such high fees for their heads that any deacent mercenary could not say no to it.
    Isn't Bush doing both - creating Iraqi army and police and promising head fees?

  8. #8
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    I would just speed them up.I agree with US that you cant just runaway from Iraq and leave it like its now.But the key in my post was the peacekeepers.Because i think people of Iraqi will keep thinking Coalition forces as conguerors,not liberators.
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  9. #9
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Maybe the US and the rest of the free world have to start a new Marshall Plan for Iraq. This will increase the wealth in Iraq at once. People must feel that life is better now.
    Also Bush has to insure that in the end Iraqi key industry (=oil) is not dominated by US companies.
    I would also start an information / propaganda campaign. Support free press and TV stations. Built my own station. Just cannot leave this to AlJazera (right spelling).
    Bush has to solve the Palestina problem. This is one key to the whole problem. He has to raise pressure at both sides. And he has to give the Palstinians some perspective for the future. This may mean more money.

    To the terrorist? I do not have the real solution. I would send all my CIA etc. to identify the terrorists and their shelders. Then I would get them. Demand them from the ountries they live in. Maybe their should e an international law and court for them, just like the one they had at Nuremberg.

  10. #10
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    I like your approach.
    About that Court of Law.There is one at Haque but if im right The US doesnt regognice its authority.How weird is that?
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  11. #11

    Default Re: Help Bush

    How I would combat terrorism.

    First I would kill Bush - he makes more terrorists than he kills.

    Then I would cut the military spending of the world by 50% - those money, in turn, I would use to send aid, food, housing etc. to poor countries / regions. That I would keep doing for 200 years

    =

    problem solved.
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  12. #12

    Default Re: Help Bush

    I would "combat" terrorism by trying to find the reason why terrorism occurs and try to fix it with diplomacy and negotiations. In my opinion noone blows himself up just to kill some people and thus cause fear. There is a reasonable motive behind this unreasonable action and thus it's important to actually study their motives, find out what they want and attempt to reach a compromise, that suits both sides the best.

    About the Iraq issue my answer would be to eventually try to bring the Iraqi government, the US government and the Terrorist leaders to a negotiation over the future of Iraq and continue onward based on the decisions of the negotiation. This would be the start on how I would handle things in Iraq.
    Last edited by AggonyDuck; 06-27-2005 at 16:01.
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  13. #13
    Member Member Productivity's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by kagemusha
    I would just speed them up.
    That's extremely easy to say, but do you seriously think that they aren't allready trying to get them up as quickly as possible? Would you prefer they sacrifice quality and get mass desertions within the first month of putting them on the streets?

  14. #14
    Humanist Senior Member Franconicus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Sjakihata
    How I would combat terrorism.

    First I would kill Bush - he makes more terrorists than he kills.
    Killing Bush would definitly create more terrorist than you kill. Maybe 200 million more!

  15. #15
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by dgb
    That's extremely easy to say, but do you seriously think that they aren't allready trying to get them up as quickly as possible? Would you prefer they sacrifice quality and get mass desertions within the first month of putting them on the streets?
    I know its easy to say.But well im also very happy i didnt create this mess.In what other thing you would concentrate?
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  16. #16
    Member Member Productivity's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by kagemusha
    In what other thing you would concentrate?
    I don't know, but I certainly know I wouldn't keep pushing resources into it once I hit serious diminishing marginal returns.

    Quote Originally Posted by kagemusha
    I know its easy to say.But well im also very happy i didnt create this mess.
    Maybe I'm miserading it, but the idea of this thread seems to me to be about not taking cheap shots like "I didn't create the problem", and rather have a serious discussion about what to do.

  17. #17
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    How I would combat terrorism.

    First I would kill Bush - he makes more terrorists than he kills.

    Then I would cut the military spending of the world by 50% - those money, in turn, I would use to send aid, food, housing etc. to poor countries / regions. That I would keep doing for 200 years

    =

    problem solved.
    You mean created. You really are clueless. Doing all you say dosent effect Bin Laden and his type in the least. There are poor people all over the world and he sure aint one of them and they dont use terrorism.

    I would "combat" terrorism by trying to find the reason why terrorism occurs and try to fix it with diplomacy and negotiations.
    OK all we have to do is all convert to Islam otherwise your wasting your breath.

    I would fight terror by killing each and every individual convicted of carrying out acts of terror, I would also if possible do it in such a way that they would be denied their spiritual afterlife. The next country that I found to be funding terrorists organisations I would annihilate, and I mean the whole country. I wouldn't make any excuses about WMD or corrupt regimes, I would simply issue the warning and then act. Along with the stick you would need a carrot, this would be improved trade agreements, aid packages and/or military and political support for countries willing to ally against the terrorists.
    This is the best solution. From all my studies about arabs and the middle east it seems the only thing they respect is strength.

    However this is problably a more likely answer.

    Maybe the US and the rest of the free world have to start a new Marshall Plan for Iraq. This will increase the wealth in Iraq at once. People must feel that life is better now.
    Also Bush has to insure that in the end Iraqi key industry (=oil) is not dominated by US companies.
    I would also start an information / propaganda campaign. Support free press and TV stations. Built my own station. Just cannot leave this to AlJazera (right spelling).
    Bush has to solve the Palestina problem. This is one key to the whole problem. He has to raise pressure at both sides. And he has to give the Palstinians some perspective for the future. This may mean more money.

    To the terrorist? I do not have the real solution. I would send all my CIA etc. to identify the terrorists and their shelders. Then I would get them. Demand them from the ountries they live in. Maybe their should e an international law and court for them, just like the one they had at Nuremberg.
    What if said countries refuse to hand them over do we go to option number 1?
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  18. #18
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Beeing serious.In my mind the only thing US should try to do is to get UN back to the process.Tell me if im wrong but i believe that 99% of the combatants captured in Iraq are Iraqs own people.If someone would occypy my country,i would fight back.Now you could ask me why anyone would fight for Saddam Hussein.I dont think they are fighting his cause.Did people in Soviet Union in WWII fight for Josef Stalin?
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  19. #19
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Tell me if im wrong but i believe that 99% of the combatants captured in Iraq are Iraqs own people
    OK your wrong. This has been one of the sticking points on calling this an insurgency as many of the fighters are from the surrounding nations and AQ. Their killing Iraqis mostly . So who are they fighting the US or the people of Iraq?
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  20. #20
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    So im wrong.Maybe its larger misunderstanding here in Europe,but i like to separate US war on terror from war on Iraq.I support war on terrorism.But i dont support occupation of an country by another country without UN resolution.I think terrorist are groups of individuals who should be dealt as criminals.If they operate locally they should be judged according the laws of the country were they are captured.If internationally.They should be judged and punished at military tribunal at Haque.
    The problem with terrorists is who should have the right to judge who is an terrorist.I think we can all agree that members of Al Qaida are terrorists.But if i ask you are members of IRA,ETA or Tczezheen separatist terrorists i think there will be many answers.
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  21. #21
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    But i dont support occupation of an country by another country without UN resolution.
    Number one. We are not occupying Iraq. Number two the UN is worthless, get over it.

    I think terrorist are groups of individuals who should be dealt as criminals
    Well thats what most on the left believe. I guess we could have treated Hitler and the Nazis as a criminals also.
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  22. #22
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny
    Number one. We are not occupying Iraq. Number two the UN is worthless, get over it.
    Im sorry, but i dont understand.About UN what is your alternative?

    [QUOTE=Well thats what most on the left believe. I guess we could have treated Hitler and the Nazis as a criminals also.[/QUOTE]

    I dont know if we have a common definition of the left.Maybe its difference in our political culture.About the Nazi leadership they were treated like criminals and most of them were judged and hanged at Nurnberg.
    Last edited by Kagemusha; 06-27-2005 at 18:06.
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  23. #23
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Im sorry, but i dont understand.About UN what is your alternative?
    An organization of democratic nations.

    About the Nazi leadership they were treated like criminals and most of them were judged and hanged at Nurnberg.
    Did we send the police to arrest them?
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  24. #24
    probably bored Member BDC's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    I'd smother the insurgence with dollar notes and free tvs.

    And cable. That's the important bit. No one will blow themselves up if they have got caught in a soap and want to see how xxx ends up next week.

  25. #25
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny
    An organization of democratic nations.
    Did we send the police to arrest them?
    So who would judge what nation would be democratic?I┤l throw you an example:Would Pakistan be included or Saudi-Arabia.They are US allies.And not very democratic at all.

    About the Nazis i would characterize them as international Terrorist on novadays terms and if we are talking about what country made biggest effort destroying them.The answer would be Soviet Union.My country fought both Nazis and Soviet Union in WWII.
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  26. #26
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    So who would judge what nation would be democratic?I┤l throw you an example:Would Pakistan be included or Saudi-Arabia.They are US allies.And not very democratic at all.
    The members would be decisded upon by the members I think we all know what countries are truly democratic.

    About the Nazis i would characterize them as international Terrorist on novadays terms and if we are talking about what country made biggest effort destroying them.The answer would be Soviet Union
    There was no soviet union during WW2
    Besides Russia was as big a terrorist state if not more so than Germany.

    Thats why
    My country fought both Nazis and Soviet Union in WWII.
    Did your country fight them with your police?
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  27. #27
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Where do you get that police thing?I havent talked about police in this whole thread.And no we didnt fight them with police. My country has little over 5 million people and we have over 5 hundred thousand men in reserves.Im Infantry 1st sergeant my self,in that reserve.
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  28. #28
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    Where do you get that police thing?I havent talked about police in this whole thread.
    Right here
    I think terrorist are groups of individuals who should be dealt as criminals.
    Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way

  29. #29
    Shadow Senior Member Kagemusha's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    What i meant they should punished in court of law like any other people.How to catch them, would you prefer chasing terrorists inside US with Army?That could be rather messy.Wouldnt you like to use maybe FBI and SWAT teams for the job?
    Ja Mata Tosainu Sama.

  30. #30
    Very Senior Member Gawain of Orkeny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Help Bush

    would you prefer chasing terrorists inside US with Army?
    Its against our law to use the army for these purposes within our borders.

    Wouldnt you like to use maybe FBI and SWAT teams for the job?
    We do

    Im speaking of International terroism here. Clinton and the left consider it still a police matter not a military one as conservatives and Bush do.
    Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way

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