Valor bonus for Axmen?

**deleet frans** · 07-08-2005, 16:01

Greetings. I'm new to MTW by way of RTW. Playing as the Danes, I have Norway (+1 Vikes) and Lithuania (+1 Woodies). Both Axmen. What building line do Axmen fall under in general? Swords? Would a Master Swordsmith line give me +2 valor Axmen? Everybody knows Vikings, but +1 Woodies with a church to stiffen

their morale are a cheap and nasty garrison force/shock troops. Try 'em out.

**littlebktruck** · 07-08-2005, 16:14

Hmm...if the building requirement is a fort, then it would seem that you would get the bonus from the highest building of that line, that is, a fortress. Seems a little strange, but that's the best I can think of.

**deleet frans** · 07-08-2005, 16:20

What about other Axmen?

**Martok** · 07-08-2005, 17:48

Originally Posted by deleet frans

What about other Axmen?

What other axemen? Are you talking about the various Viking units the Danes get?

**BAD** · 07-08-2005, 18:28

I guess he means, like Varangian Guard (should be the Master Spearmaker), Abyssinian Guard (should be Master Swordsmith), Huscarles (should be Master Swordsmith), Viking Landsmen you get with a keep (so maybe like woodsmen it's the Fortress), Druzinha Cavalry (should be Master HorseBreeder), Mamluk Cavalry (should be Master Horse Breeder).

Hope those are correct anyways. Seems pretty logical. But you never know. =/

**deleet frans** · 07-08-2005, 19:10

The fort line doesn't give val bonus does it?

**EatYerGreens** · 07-08-2005, 19:25

Forgive my cynicism but it would be an awful shame to go to the huge expense (not to mention time) in building to fortress stage only to find out afterwards that there is no valour bonus at all!

On the development chart, axemen are listed under 'peasants, etc.' and, to me, that's all they are. Cheap and cheerful garrison troops, to repel potential invaders, or to boost province loyalty so as to support high taxation but they are not fantastically effective on the battlefield. Even in huge numerical advantage, I have found their morale can be brittle under a low-star general versus better quality troops.

You might be tempted, as I was, to use a low-rated general specifically for garrison duties, so as to free up the best ones to fight elsewhere. However, using a high-rated general gives them the valour bonus you seek anyway. That seems to be the cheaper option.

I think that the AI responds primarily to numbers of defenders, more than quality, when assessing whether to attack you or not. It certainly benefits from using autocalc when AI factions fight each other but what that means is that by your being able to build a large garrison on the cheap, all you do is guarantee that it brings a truly massive army when it wants to attack you and they won't be able to put up much of a resistance. You're far better off spending the money on developing more robust troop types. Treat the axemen as a stop-gap to give you the time to do this development, then gradually demobilise them, when the time is right.

**Martok** · 07-08-2005, 17:47

Originally Posted by littlebktruck

Hmm...if the building requirement is a fort, then it would seem that you would get the bonus from the highest building of that line, that is, a fortress. Seems a little strange, but that's the best I can think of.

I think you're right, although I'd never really considered it before either. I may have to start a new Danish campaign tonight and do a little experimenting. I'll try to let you know what I find out.....