Al Qaeda

[Proletariat]

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english...ent_457925.htm

Qaeda says will kill Egypt's Iraq envoy
(Agencies)
Updated: 2005-07-07 08:42

An Al Qaeda death sentence hung over Egypt's hostage envoy to Iraq on Wednesday as the new Iraqi government appealed to embassies not to desert Baghdad after a series of attacks on senior diplomats.

Egypt's Ihab el-Sherif, snatched four days ago, appeared to have fallen into the hands of al Qaeda's Iraq wing when it issued photographs of his personal documents. The group, which has beheaded previous captives, then issued a statement on a Web site entitled "Sharp sword against the infidels' ambassador":

"The sharia court of al Qaeda Organization in Iraq has decided to hand the apostate, the ambassador of Egypt, which is allied to Jews and Christians to the mujahideen to ... kill him," said the group, led by Jordanian Abu Musab al-Zarqawi.

I just don't get it.

[Ser Clegane]

These guys are not killing for a cause anymore - the killing has become their cause...

[The_Doctor]

Egypt is not fighting the west, so they are a target.

[CBR]

Egypt's goverment is considered to be corrupt and pro western so has to be fought.

edit: Ayman al-Zawahri was part of the Egyptian Islamic Jihad group who's goal was to overthrow the Egyptian government.


CBR

[Don Corleone]

NPR was saying it was because Egypt was one step away from recognizing the Iraqi government. This murder was a warning to the Arab world that any governments that recognize Iraq's government can expect much of the same.

[Proletariat]

Who the hell are these people fighting for if even Arabic blood isn't sacred?
It's complete madness.

[Don Corleone]

This has nothing to do with blood or life. It's about power. As long as there's places in the world that aren't under Islamic fundamentalist rule, these jokers will be running around doing these things.

[CBR]

Who the hell are these people fighting for if even Arabic blood isn't sacred?
It's complete madness.

They are extremists that want an Islamic state. And that means killing other Arabs as they just see them as being corrupted and therefore legitimate targets.


CBR

[Franconicus]

Extremists hate their own countrymen if they work for the 'enemy'. They hate them even more than the enemy.

[JAG]

Who the hell are these people fighting for if even Arabic blood isn't sacred?
It's complete madness.

They are fighting for their own extremist cause, as stated many times by people here at the org, it is not the same as what all the muslim people in the Middle East want, probably not even a majority of what people in the Middle East want. Which is why you should not go around threatening invasion and death for country regimes to 'stop the spread' because it causes more problems.

[econ21]

Who the hell are these people fighting for if even Arabic blood isn't sacred?

How many Iraqis (Arabs) have been killed by Al Qaeda and related insurgents? Far more than the number of non-Arabs killed, I suspect. The "war on terror" is not really about New York, Madrid or London. Al Qaeda's goals are primarily confined to the Islamic world: they want to establish extreme Islamic governments in Algeria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia etc. The West is just being targeted because it supports the existing regimes in those countries. If that support collapses, there's a chance of Iran 1979 type takeovers. The fact that Al Qaeda and fundamentalist Shiite Iran are opposed to each other only underlines the internecine nature of AQs agenda.

[lars573]

Actually there goal is to restore the Caliphate of early Islam. Plus all the areas that are Islamic now.


This is the the caliphate. Add to that the caucasian region of Russia, Pakistan, Sicily, the Balkan states and Turkey, and the centeral Asian stan nations.

[Don Corleone]

You don't really believe they'll stop there, do you?

They want the world under Sharia, with them as the mullahs hearing each case. Nothing less will satisfy them.

[JAG]

You don't really believe they'll stop there, do you?

They want the world under Sharia, with them as the mullahs hearing each case. Nothing less will satisfy them.

Where have they stated they want to take over the world? I never have heard that, quite the opposite. They have stated that if states act like Sweden and don't interfere in the Middle East, then they will not interfere with the west. That clearly isn't acceptable but still it is wrong to state 'they want to take over the world'.

[Franconicus]

This discussion is foolish. Do they want to restore the Kalifat or conquer the whole world? Every scenario is bad. An we should stop them here and now.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Where have they stated they want to take over the world? I never have heard that, quite the opposite

Then you dont read whats posted on these boards. Ive been telling you this since I got here. Would you like me to post Bin Ladens letter to America again? His first demand is that we all convert to Islam.

[IliaDN]

Who the hell are these people fighting for if even Arabic blood isn't sacred?
It's complete madness.

Well as far as I know they fight for true muslims

[Proletariat]

How many Iraqis (Arabs) have been killed by Al Qaeda and related insurgents?

I'm aware, I was asking out of exasperation.

[Steppe Merc]

Are most Iraqis and Iranis Arabic? I know it's nitpicking, but I had always assumed that while some had Arabic blood, there was still a lot of Iranian and Turkish blood...
Just wondering, doesn't really have anything to do with the topic.

[CBR]

CIA world factbook:

Iran:Persian 51%, Azeri 24%, Gilaki and Mazandarani 8%, Kurd 7%, Arab 3%, Lur 2%, Baloch 2%, Turkmen 2%, other 1%

Iraq:Arab 75%-80%, Kurdish 15%-20%, Turkoman, Assyrian or other 5%


CBR

[Don Corleone]

Then you dont read whats posted on these boards. Ive been telling you this since I got here. Would you like me to post Bin Ladens letter to America again? His first demand is that we all convert to Islam.

Actually, yes I would like you to post it again. Might remind people who we're dealing with.

[Steppe Merc]

Ok, thanks. Hmm, I had assumed Iraq would have more Iranian (Persian is one way to call it I suppose, though Persians were just a group of the Iranian stock) blood.
But thanks for clearing that up.

[econ21]

Actually, yes I would like you to post it again. Might remind people who we're dealing with.

I really don't think we should give over any of the Org's space to that piece of work. But Gawain's post did give me cause to look it up:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world...845725,00.html

I would tend to pay more attention to the first half of the letter, listing all the specific grudges he cites as cassus belli. But Gawain is right about the second half, which is a pretty general rant against the West.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Actually, yes I would like you to post it again. Might remind people who we're dealing with.

Your wish is my command

(Q2) (Q2) As for the second question that we want to answer: What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

(1) The first thing that we are calling you to is Islam.

(a) The religion of the Unification of God; of freedom from associating partners with Him, and rejection of this; of complete love of Him, the Exalted; of complete submission to His Laws; and of the discarding of all the opinions, orders, theories and religions which contradict with the religion He sent down to His Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Islam is the religion of all the prophets, and makes no distinction between them - peace be upon them all.

It is to this religion that we call you; the seal of all the previous religions. It is the religion of Unification of God, sincerity, the best of manners, righteousness, mercy, honour, purity, and piety. It is the religion of showing kindness to others, establishing justice between them, granting them their rights, and defending the oppressed and the persecuted. It is the religion of enjoining the good and forbidding the evil with the hand, tongue and heart. It is the religion of Jihad in the way of Allah so that Allah's Word and religion reign Supreme. And it is the religion of unity and agreement on the obedience to Allah, and total equality between all people, without regarding their colour, sex, or language.

(b) It is the religion whose book - the Quran - will remained preserved and unchanged, after the other Divine books and messages have been changed. The Quran is the miracle until the Day of Judgment. Allah has challenged anyone to bring a book like the Quran or even ten verses like it.

Pretty much says it all

complete submission to His Laws; and of the discarding of all the opinions, orders, theories and religions which contradict with the religion

You cant even have a contrary opinion. You must submit totaly to his brand of Islam. Who are they killing in Iraq, other Muslims because their not radical enough.

Entire Letter

[Don Corleone]

Gawain's almost right. The first thing he says is praise be to Allah.

The second is, whoever fights on their side is justified, because they do it in the name of Allah. Anyone who doesn't believe in Allah is a friend of Taghut (apparently the Arabic name for Satan) and deserves whatever they get.

He then goes into a screed about how he's pissed about how people are resisting Islamic fundamentalism: Russia in Chenchnya, America in Israel/Palestine, America & Israel in Lebanon, India in Kashmir, et al. Essentially, let us do whatever we want, wherever we want, or we'll continue to kill innocents.

After a lot of babbling along these lines, he claims that Gitmo really ticked him off. Couldn't have been that high a priority, because he'd already ranted for 2 pages before he mentioned it.

Then he answers the question "What does Al Queda want from the West, in order to stop the violence". Answer number 1 was convert to Islam. Answer #2 is adopt Sharia.

Doesn't sound to me like he, or they, are in this to be peacefully left alone.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Well Jag and others keep saying we should try to understand why they do what they do and I keep telling them I understand it only too well. Hes not vague here. The problem is you all dont think he means what he says. His actions speak otherwise.

[Tribesman]

I just don't get it.
Who does ?.....Its all mad .
"The sharia court of al Qaeda Organization in Iraq has decided to hand the apostate, the ambassador of Egypt, which is allied to Jews and Christians to the mujahideen to ... kill him,"
But there is some reasoning in the madness (though I don't think reasoning is the right word) .
Egypt was the first arab/Muslim nation to formalise relations with the new Iraqi Governmnt and the first to appoint an ambassador . Then their is the peace treaty and recognition of the State of Israel . Then there is the massive funding that Egypt recieves from the West to keep their President in power while he bans political opposition and imprisions any politicians that upset him .
To the fundamentalists these are all signs that Egypt is an enemy and must be attacked .
As the fundamentalists are basically insane and aim to spread terror everywhere , then what better way to spread terror than to show that they can strike anyone anywhere .
So its all mad and beyond reason , but there is some reasoning in the insanity .

[King of Atlantis]

These guys are just plain out scary.

[Don Corleone]

Tribesman,
I completely agree with your assessment. When you stop looking at their actions as though they're bent on political or monetary gain, and consider "Gee, if I wanted to subjugate the word to my particular brand of religion, how would I go about it", their actions make a lot more sense. No political body would ever be your true ally. They would fear you, as a destablizing force, and you would hate them, because they would be corrupt... focusing on temporal power and not 'the cause'. Scary fact I learned today... over 80% of the mosques in the USA receiving funding from Wahabist families back in Saudi Arabia.

[BDC]

These guys are just plain out scary.

Yes.

*shudder*

People like this still exist in the 21st century! Why didn't they all die out with the Crusades...