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Thread: Alcohol... good or bad?
The question of this poll / thread is: Would the world be a better place without alcohol? I'd recommend reading this introduction before voting.
Now this might seem like a rather bizarre and prohibitionist question, but I got the impression from reading the "What kind of animals are we thread" (before it turned petty) that many people view alcohol in a fairly evil light.
In Britain, alcohol abuse is at a ridiculously dangerous level. Friday and Saturday nights are now danger zones in most town and city centres, especially around 11pm when most pubs close and again later on when the pubs close. Such a high density of people with no control over themselves due to alcohol consumption and who are clearly out to impress is a very dangerous combination. It is not hard to find fights. There also tends to be a lot of vomit around. I don't so much mind this, as I am perfectly capable of handling myself in such a situation and I have quite a high alcohol tollerance level, however, many people are put in danger by being surrounded by drunkards.
Alcohol is also often used in the abuse of women. Women are deliberately made drunk by sleazy scum-bags and can also have their drinks spiked with date-rape drugs when they are not at their most attentive. This doesn't just happen to women either. Alcohol is also a common factor in spousal (and child) abuse, when one partner staggers home drunk and behaves in a violent and threatening manor to their family.
Alcohol can also be addictive to those who believe they have nothing in life or feel they have no way out. Such people often cannot lift themselves out of a downward spiral because they waste all of their available money on more alcohol to shut out the horror of their lives. It can also cause brain damage, especially when used by young people whose brains are not yet fully developed.
Therefore my question again is: would the world be a better place without alcohol? Now obviously this doesn't mean the complete eradication of the chemical organic compound group in nature or for industrial and medical use before some smart-ass tries to score a cheap point with that one. I mean, when all factors are weighed and considered, does it really make the world better? Does it ever really make us happy? Now this isn't a civil-rights issue or a nanny-state issue. This is working from the hypothetical scenario that alcohol had never been invented/discovered as a drink of pleasure rather than a 'should we ban alcohol tomorrow' perspective.
I voted for the retention of alcohol, because I believe in moderation it is plesant and occassionally and under the right circumstances an excess of it can be what is required. That said, I haven't drunk any in a month now but that's because I'm in training.
Now this might seem like a rather bizarre and prohibitionist question, but I got the impression from reading the "What kind of animals are we thread" (before it turned petty) that many people view alcohol in a fairly evil light.
In Britain, alcohol abuse is at a ridiculously dangerous level. Friday and Saturday nights are now danger zones in most town and city centres, especially around 11pm when most pubs close and again later on when the pubs close. Such a high density of people with no control over themselves due to alcohol consumption and who are clearly out to impress is a very dangerous combination. It is not hard to find fights. There also tends to be a lot of vomit around. I don't so much mind this, as I am perfectly capable of handling myself in such a situation and I have quite a high alcohol tollerance level, however, many people are put in danger by being surrounded by drunkards.
Alcohol is also often used in the abuse of women. Women are deliberately made drunk by sleazy scum-bags and can also have their drinks spiked with date-rape drugs when they are not at their most attentive. This doesn't just happen to women either. Alcohol is also a common factor in spousal (and child) abuse, when one partner staggers home drunk and behaves in a violent and threatening manor to their family.
Alcohol can also be addictive to those who believe they have nothing in life or feel they have no way out. Such people often cannot lift themselves out of a downward spiral because they waste all of their available money on more alcohol to shut out the horror of their lives. It can also cause brain damage, especially when used by young people whose brains are not yet fully developed.
Therefore my question again is: would the world be a better place without alcohol? Now obviously this doesn't mean the complete eradication of the chemical organic compound group in nature or for industrial and medical use before some smart-ass tries to score a cheap point with that one. I mean, when all factors are weighed and considered, does it really make the world better? Does it ever really make us happy? Now this isn't a civil-rights issue or a nanny-state issue. This is working from the hypothetical scenario that alcohol had never been invented/discovered as a drink of pleasure rather than a 'should we ban alcohol tomorrow' perspective.
I voted for the retention of alcohol, because I believe in moderation it is plesant and occassionally and under the right circumstances an excess of it can be what is required. That said, I haven't drunk any in a month now but that's because I'm in training.
Originally Posted by :
I've always had a firm belief that, to truly have a good time, you need to be fully aware of what you're doing.
Actually this was one of the motivations behind me posting this thread. I was thinking in bed the other night (damn no lovin' and insomnia) about all the best times of my life and nearly all of them I was sober for. Then I thought about a lot of the worst times of my life and my biggest mistakes and for a lot of them, I was drunk.I've always had a firm belief that, to truly have a good time, you need to be fully aware of what you're doing.
I think alcohol is often just an easy way to a good time - a get out clause.
I agree with you that moderation and self control is the key.
** sips glass of 2001 Chianti Colli Senesi in dignified fashion **
I also agree with you about the dangerous degree to which binge drinking has taken over our town and city centres here in the past few years.
I lived in Manchester for twelve years and used to regularly go to the many clubs and bars there and always had a great time - same when I lived in Liverpool. I never saw any trouble despite all my small-minded stay at home Welsh friends going on and on about how rough the cities were (never having been there of course).
I came back to South Wales in 2003 and was truly gobsmacked as to what went on in the drinking areas of Swansea. There is one famous street that when I left was the banking centre of the city - now it is all bars and restaurants. Now there is nothing wrong with that per se - Wind St on a sunny Friday/Saturday night with couples and families enjoying a meal or an evening drink is lovely, but come 2 - 3am the place is (pardon my vernacular) a sh*thole.
Gaggles of seriously drunk women who can barely talk, agressive bunches of louts who have come to Swansea for a 'good fight' have taken over the place. Not nice
But what can be done? I personally believe that education is critical and unless teenagers are brought up to respect alcohol and the lovely, lovely effects it has then there is no hope really. Yes, I used to get p*issed in my local at 17 and 18 but I was sent home at 11.30 with a boot up the arse from the landlord.
** sips glass of 2001 Chianti Colli Senesi in dignified fashion **
I also agree with you about the dangerous degree to which binge drinking has taken over our town and city centres here in the past few years.
I lived in Manchester for twelve years and used to regularly go to the many clubs and bars there and always had a great time - same when I lived in Liverpool. I never saw any trouble despite all my small-minded stay at home Welsh friends going on and on about how rough the cities were (never having been there of course).
I came back to South Wales in 2003 and was truly gobsmacked as to what went on in the drinking areas of Swansea. There is one famous street that when I left was the banking centre of the city - now it is all bars and restaurants. Now there is nothing wrong with that per se - Wind St on a sunny Friday/Saturday night with couples and families enjoying a meal or an evening drink is lovely, but come 2 - 3am the place is (pardon my vernacular) a sh*thole.
Gaggles of seriously drunk women who can barely talk, agressive bunches of louts who have come to Swansea for a 'good fight' have taken over the place. Not nice
But what can be done? I personally believe that education is critical and unless teenagers are brought up to respect alcohol and the lovely, lovely effects it has then there is no hope really. Yes, I used to get p*issed in my local at 17 and 18 but I was sent home at 11.30 with a boot up the arse from the landlord.
I cant decide.Personally im not sure how it have effected my life.Ive had fun when drunk,but sober as well.I have done stupid things under influence of alcohol,but so i have when sober.I still believe that any alcoholl or drugs arent doing anything,but people ar. 
Originally Posted by :
I don't drink, myself. I've always had a firm belief that, to truly have a good time, you need to be fully aware of what you're doing. It would be criminal to prohibit other people drinking themselves stupid, however; it doesn't hurt me none unless they get behind the wheel of a car or some such afterwards.
I agree, I don't drink either.I don't drink, myself. I've always had a firm belief that, to truly have a good time, you need to be fully aware of what you're doing. It would be criminal to prohibit other people drinking themselves stupid, however; it doesn't hurt me none unless they get behind the wheel of a car or some such afterwards.
I believe people drink alcohol so they can release themselves from responsibility and social pressures. Or something like that.
Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube:
I don't drink, myself. I've always had a firm belief that, to truly have a good time, you need to be fully aware of what you're doing. It would be criminal to prohibit other people drinking themselves stupid, however; it doesn't hurt me none unless they get behind the wheel of a car or some such afterwards.
Yeah, I used to think like this-I didn't drink, wanted all my faculties available. I recently went on holiday, however, had a bit to drink most nights, and had the most fun I've had for a long time. I'm not normally very good at starting conversations-it's not a problem, I'm just a quiet person-but it works against me in social situations. I feel that a bit of alcohol helped to alleviate that, allowing me to enjoy myself more. So no, I don't think the world would be a better place without alcohol-like anything else, it's fine in moderation.I don't drink, myself. I've always had a firm belief that, to truly have a good time, you need to be fully aware of what you're doing. It would be criminal to prohibit other people drinking themselves stupid, however; it doesn't hurt me none unless they get behind the wheel of a car or some such afterwards.
Plus, beer tastes goooooood. Well, some beer does.
Originally Posted by :
I wouldn't be able to tell from that depth, I've never been Drunk. I've had alchohol before, didn't like the way it tasted, and probably didn't drink enough to have any effect anyway. Speaking as someone who's never been intoxicated, but lives in a town full of perpetually intoxicated people, I just don't see the appeal. There are few things that truly disturb me, and not having full control over my own mind is one of them; yet that seems to be exactly what alchohol does.
Are you me?I wouldn't be able to tell from that depth, I've never been Drunk. I've had alchohol before, didn't like the way it tasted, and probably didn't drink enough to have any effect anyway. Speaking as someone who's never been intoxicated, but lives in a town full of perpetually intoxicated people, I just don't see the appeal. There are few things that truly disturb me, and not having full control over my own mind is one of them; yet that seems to be exactly what alchohol does.
Originally Posted by Martinus:
I believe people drink alcohol so they can release themselves from responsibility and social pressures. Or something like that.
Very true - after a difficult split with my partner I drank too much but had the sense to see that forgetting in that way was not helping.I believe people drink alcohol so they can release themselves from responsibility and social pressures. Or something like that.
But also, is someone has no other release in their lives after a hard/bad/stressful day, is there really any harm in a glass of something that just lets you relax that little bit more and maybe (as it has done with me) slowed your brain down enough to stop you constantly going over and over and over something in your head and actually sit back, smile and be thankful for what you've got?
Cheers everybody
Alcohol destroys brain cells. 
It is bad...
I will never touch a drop of it again.
I will never touch a drop of it again.
Originally Posted by Gelatinous Cube:
In your case, I would begin to wonder; who is the person talking more freely, and letting himself loose? You, or the beer?
Does it really matter? If I was getting completely totalled on a regular basis, I can see where you'd be coming from, but I just like to become chatty-I still know what's going on, who I am, and I can remember it in the morning. I agree that drinking yourself into a stupor is a bad plan.In your case, I would begin to wonder; who is the person talking more freely, and letting himself loose? You, or the beer?
Originally Posted by Sigurd Fafnesbane:
It is bad...
I will never touch a drop of it again.
Someone has a hangover methinks It is bad...
I will never touch a drop of it again.
Socially it's great, it's great all round. Until you get into a fight/destroy something/make lots of noise late at night/throw up/get hung over.
Originally Posted by :
Socially it's great
This is a good point.While fun with others, I don't see why you would drink more than one or two on your own. If you're doing that, then you may have a problem.Socially it's great
Drinking alone is definately a sign of alcoholism.
Agreed.
Alchohol is not good for the mind, it disturbes concentration, and it is not good for your thought. But, it is good when taken in moderate quantities.
Would the world be a better place without alcohol? IMO, it is a pointless question. If there was no alcohol, other recreational drugs would be in more widespread use. The question kind of misses the point of the debate, that is would the world be better if people didn't have to get intoxicated and escape from their lives.
Undoubtedly, yes. For me, alcohol is pure escapism, like reading a book or playing a video game, even listening to music. I write this as I still nurse a sore head from last night, so I have thought about this. Undeniably, some of the social consequences of drinking, violence, addiction etc. are terrible, especially in Briatin at the moment but I believe it is just hiding a deeper malaise of disrespect and callousness, as mentioned in the other thread. Wishing away alcohol is unrealistic, humans have taken drugs probably since we stopped being apes (and sometimes we regress again when we use them) so perhaps it is something embedded within the human psyche and that we just have to accept.
Edit: Naturally, I voted Gah! too drunk to vote.
Another thing, the poll choices seem somewhat biased. If somebody votes no, it isn't necessarily because they believe that it makes the world a better place. :)
Undoubtedly, yes. For me, alcohol is pure escapism, like reading a book or playing a video game, even listening to music. I write this as I still nurse a sore head from last night, so I have thought about this. Undeniably, some of the social consequences of drinking, violence, addiction etc. are terrible, especially in Briatin at the moment but I believe it is just hiding a deeper malaise of disrespect and callousness, as mentioned in the other thread. Wishing away alcohol is unrealistic, humans have taken drugs probably since we stopped being apes (and sometimes we regress again when we use them) so perhaps it is something embedded within the human psyche and that we just have to accept.
Edit: Naturally, I voted Gah! too drunk to vote.
Another thing, the poll choices seem somewhat biased. If somebody votes no, it isn't necessarily because they believe that it makes the world a better place. :)
*BP is too drunk to type propernly*
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems! 
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems!
Beer is carbonated, in that case G.C. you are drinking rubbish commercial beer.
I don't see why you would drink more than one or two on your own. If you're doing that, then you may have a problem.
BKS , possibly the problem may be that some people don't turn up on time
I don't see why you would drink more than one or two on your own. If you're doing that, then you may have a problem.
BKS , possibly the problem may be that some people don't turn up on time
Alcohol is overall bad. That does not mean that I support prohibition, but is does make many people into idiots and it does kill in drunk driving accidents. That said if people were able to regulate their consumption alcohol would still be bad, but not a problem.
Love da booze!
Love da broads!
But only one of them is best in moderation.
Love da broads!
But only one of them is best in moderation.
Actually my views on drugs is a bit split. On one hand drugs, including alcohol, creates violence and crimes, on the other hand, it is a part of our hertiage to consume substances for relaxation.
Just like good food, we need to stimulate our selves to be happy. Unfortunately, the controlled use of alcohol doesn't really seem to work for everyone.
Just like good food, we need to stimulate our selves to be happy. Unfortunately, the controlled use of alcohol doesn't really seem to work for everyone.
People hurt themselves every day by eating to much. Even vitamins are bad more you in excess.
moderation is the key of life.
moderation is the key of life.
One thing that I've found is that in drinking alcohol you don't really lose control. You don't become a different person. The effect is biochemical, much akin to the biochemical effect of being happy or sad or excited. Alcohol affects you, but you're still you.
MUSHROOMS, on the other hand, are a different story. But I'll leave that one to those more experienced.
DA
MUSHROOMS, on the other hand, are a different story. But I'll leave that one to those more experienced.
DA
GAH!
It is so subjective to people, it is too hard to say yes or no.
To one person who can control their drink and have fun with it, whilst it helping them socially it is great.
To another who can't control their drink.. Well we all know what can happen and it is clearly not in the best interest of all.
For that reason you cannot simply state it as good / bad.
Cigarettes however is a no brainer, because there is no redeeming qualities to them, they simply suck.
It is so subjective to people, it is too hard to say yes or no.
To one person who can control their drink and have fun with it, whilst it helping them socially it is great.
To another who can't control their drink.. Well we all know what can happen and it is clearly not in the best interest of all.
For that reason you cannot simply state it as good / bad.
Cigarettes however is a no brainer, because there is no redeeming qualities to them, they simply suck.
"Alcohol- The Problem and then Solution to all of life's problems"
-Homer J. Simpson
But I have to agree, taken in moderation alcohol is good. Over here sometimes drinking a Cold One during a hot after noon, whilst relaxing on the beach is great. However, if I'm up for some serious drinking I'll head over to a beach Cantina or Bar with a few of my buds.
-Homer J. Simpson
But I have to agree, taken in moderation alcohol is good. Over here sometimes drinking a Cold One during a hot after noon, whilst relaxing on the beach is great. However, if I'm up for some serious drinking I'll head over to a beach Cantina or Bar with a few of my buds.
Originally Posted by JAG:
Cigarettes however is a no brainer, because there is no redeeming qualities to them, they simply suck.
I think you have misunderstood cigarettes. They don't suck, you are supposed to suck them........ Cigarettes however is a no brainer, because there is no redeeming qualities to them, they simply suck.
I couldnt vote because I dont believe alcohol makes us terrible or better people-yet im not undecided.
Ive always viewed alcohol as an escape from reality for people.
I used to drink a fair bit but it lead to nothing good. Sure I wasnt my shy self, but the "friends" i made didnt enjoy my company unless i was intoxicated.. they werent real friends.
Suddenly I found myself spending a whole lot of money with a rather pathetic group of people doing things I would never do sober with people I would never do those things with, and then ending the night throwing up all over someone elses house or lawn.
A lot of people around here my age seem to live for that, but it seems to me they are just trying to escape their own lives.. i dont know though, thats the way it was for me.
Sure, trying to make friends and have a good time is harder being shy panzer instead of drunk panzer, but those friends i do make and those good times(that arent forgotten the next morning) are all the more better.
However, i dont judge anyone that drinks. Good for them for going out and having a good time.
Ive always viewed alcohol as an escape from reality for people.
I used to drink a fair bit but it lead to nothing good. Sure I wasnt my shy self, but the "friends" i made didnt enjoy my company unless i was intoxicated.. they werent real friends.
Suddenly I found myself spending a whole lot of money with a rather pathetic group of people doing things I would never do sober with people I would never do those things with, and then ending the night throwing up all over someone elses house or lawn.
A lot of people around here my age seem to live for that, but it seems to me they are just trying to escape their own lives.. i dont know though, thats the way it was for me.
Sure, trying to make friends and have a good time is harder being shy panzer instead of drunk panzer, but those friends i do make and those good times(that arent forgotten the next morning) are all the more better.
However, i dont judge anyone that drinks. Good for them for going out and having a good time.
Originally Posted by King of Atlantis:
People hurt themselves every day by eating to much. Even vitamins are bad more you in excess.
moderation is the key of life.
You are wise beyond your years my friend.People hurt themselves every day by eating to much. Even vitamins are bad more you in excess.
moderation is the key of life.
Originally Posted by JAG:
Cigarettes however is a no brainer, because there is no redeeming qualities to them, they simply suck.
Umm, not if they are used in moderation. If you consider all the extra food we eat, then smoking suddenly doesn't seem so bad. Cigarettes however is a no brainer, because there is no redeeming qualities to them, they simply suck.
I like smoking once in a while. I never do it regularly, but when I'm with friends it's more enjoyable just because of the company.
Originally Posted by PanzerJager:
Suddenly I found myself spending a whole lot of money with a rather pathetic group of people doing things I would never do sober with people I would never do those things with, and then ending the night throwing up all over someone elses house or lawn.
Sounds familiar. That sort of thing is soooo rampant where I live. For some time I wanted to be just like them just to fit in, and then I realized what a huge waste of life and brain cells it was.Suddenly I found myself spending a whole lot of money with a rather pathetic group of people doing things I would never do sober with people I would never do those things with, and then ending the night throwing up all over someone elses house or lawn.
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