The brittish muslims

[Radier]

This has maybee been brought up before but I didn´t find a thread about it, so here we go: YouGov interviews brittish muslims (526 muslim adults).

* 6% think the britts deserved the bombs in 7/7.

* 24% symphatices with the bombings.

* 18% feel no loyalty at all with Brittain.

* 32% think "Western society is decadent and immoral and that Muslims should seek to bring it to an end"

* 1% said they could take to violence to bring down the western society. That may not seem much, but it is around 16 000 persons in Brittain alone.

* 27% would not call the police and warn if they found out someone is planning an act of terrorism.

* 53% would not call the police if an Iman spread hatred propagande against the west.

Theese numbers are frightening. Muslim extremists shall immediatly be sent out from Europe. In fact, I wouldn´t care if all the muslims where thrown out... They become more and more, and soon western Europe will be majority muslim to...

I say like the Checkian president Vaclav Klaus: A multicutural society feeds terrorism.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../ixportal.html

[Sjakihata]

Statistics... Im sure I could ask questions that would all have 100% in them or any number I wanted.

This inst really helpful, and quite far from reality I suspect.

Oh, and you my friend is a racist :)

[Ser Clegane]

Please argue the issue - just calling people "racist" becomes inreasingly lame...

[Sjakihata]

ha, I knew a mod would say it.. I also suspect that the mod would understand, but let me quote:

In fact, I wouldn´t care if all the muslims where thrown out...

While the poll only say low percentages, this guy wants all of them out = racist. To blame a few faults on an entire race.

[R'as al Ghul]

While the poll only say low percentages, this guy wants all of them out = racist. To blame a few faults on an entire race.

I agree, but it seems en vogue recently to post racist comments.
Actually I expected this thread to be closed after your first response.

[Ser Clegane]

While the poll only say low percentages, this guy wants all of them out = racist. To blame a few faults on an entire race.

I have to disagree with this interpretation. Actually Radier's statement seems to have more to do with xenophobia than with racism (i.e., he fears the impact that an increasing muslim population might have on the society in his country).
This is not necessarily the same as racism and I think that the careless use of the buzzword "racist" is counterproductive to meaningful and civilized discussions.

[Sjakihata]

I agree, I perhaps misused the word. Maybe because I didnt know any other english word that covered what I meant.

But I certainly know this trend - political parties use scare figures and scare tactics to frighten the people - who in turn vote for said parties, since the offer a solution, throw 'em out. While this may not be racist in the old form, I still think it is connected with racism, ignorance and the fact that you are afraid, all in all a deadly combo. (Just look at the jews, back then... only offered as an example, nothing to do with the thread or its poster)

note to self: remember to use disclaimers more

[lancelot]

I do looovee the way the word racist gets thrown about these days-far too liberally.

You know what scare tactics I dislike? Its not the politcal type, its the type that have explosives with them...like the people who are blowing up our rail network.

[Radier]

I have to disagree with this interpretation. Actually Radier's statement seems to have more to do with xenophobia than with racism (i.e., he fears the impact that an increasing muslim population might have on the society in his country).
This is not necessarily the same as racism and I think that the careless use of the buzzword "racist" is counterproductive to meaningful and civilized discussions.

Increasing muslim population? Hell the most common name In Malmo is Muhammed! They are allready to many... You can barely walk the muslim ghettos here without being robbed/beaten...

And Sjakihata don´t worry. I have been illegaly called a rascist before... Not that I see muslims as a race, but what do I, a stupid xenophobist, know? Whats wrong with questioning religions? If there where a religion in Africa for example saying we shall kill women, would I be a rascist if I criticised thet to? Just curious, you also think that christians are a race? And if we can´t rely on statistics made by a respectable newspaper, what then shall we trust? Feelings?

I maybee over-reacted when a said all the muslims shall be thrown out, but deep inside I really wouldn´t have cared if they disappeared...

[Ser Clegane]

Increasing muslim population? Hell the most common name In Malmo is Muhammed! They are allready to many... You can barely walk the muslim ghettos here without being robbed/beaten...

Do you have any numbers on the percentage of muslims im Malmo?

Just asking as surprisingly here in Germany the regions were people complained most about immigrants and voted far right are the regions that actually have a very low percentage of immigrants in the population.

[R'as al Ghul]

I have to disagree with this interpretation. Actually Radier's statement seems to have more to do with xenophobia than with racism (i.e., he fears the impact that an increasing muslim population might have on the society in his country).
This is not necessarily the same as racism and I think that the careless use of the buzzword "racist" is counterproductive to meaningful and civilized discussions.

It seems I've overreacted here, too. (provoked by other posters of the recent past). I apologize.

[Radier]

Do you have any numbers on the percentage of muslims im Malmo?

Just asking as surprisingly here in Germany the regions were people complained most about immigrants and voted far right are the regions that actually have a very low percentage of immigrants in the population.

Around 25% muslims last time messured... 85% or 95% (I don´t remember) of them are unemployed. I am serious when I say the worst areas in all of Sweden lies in the immegrant parts of Malmo and Stockholm. Just this very weekend three women got attacked and raped in Malmö. One was 81 years old... The ethnical Swedes are constantly fleeing the city for each year. Las year I think there was 19 000 who left the region. The situation is not good at all.

The Swedish Democratic party (nationalists and anti-immegrants) have their strongest support in the southeastern parts of Sweden and cities with alot of immegrants. Here where I live (middle of Sweden, easter coast), on the country, hardly noone are supporting them. Just stupid redneck nazis here...

[Ser Clegane]

Around 25% muslims last time messured

Hmm ... this would indeed be extremely high. What is the percentage for Sweden as a whole (I assume that it is significantly lower)?
Is there a specific reason that the percentage in Malmo is so high? Do most immigrants arrive in Malmo and just stay there?

I agree that it is rather unhealthy for a society if you face the development of ethnic/religeous ghettos. This is not multicultural in a sense that different cultures live together - this is creating parallel cultures that live separated from each other in the same country/city.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

I agree that it is rather unhealthy for a society if you face the development of ethnic/religeous ghettos. This is not multicultural in a sense that different cultures live together - this is creating parallel cultures that live separated from each other in the same country/city.

This isnt only happeneing in Sweden but around the world as these people flee the oppression and poverty of their own lands. But instead of conforming to their new countries they bring the poverty and oppression of ther homelands to their new countries. This IMO is what happened in Kosovo. You guys better not start persecuting them or we will have to bomb you.

[Radier]

Hmm ... this would indeed be extremely high. What is the percentage for Sweden as a whole (I assume that it is significantly lower)?
Is there a specific reason that the percentage in Malmo is so high? Do most immigrants arrive in Malmo and just stay there?

I agree that it is rather unhealthy for a society if you face the development of ethnic/religeous ghettos. This is not multicultural in a sense that different cultures live together - this is creating parallel cultures that live separated from each other in the same country/city.

Finaly an understanding voice. Our "multicutural society" are in fact a society of segregation where immegrants are "forced" into criminal gangs.

For some years ago 5% where muslims. That is maybe slightly higher today... I don´t want all the worlds cultures here in Sweden. If I want Iranian culture I travel to Iran. If I want Mexican culture I travel to Mexico, but just mixing it up in a mess do not work. How would it look like if every country in the world did as we do? It would be no difference in living in the US, Saudi-Arabia, China and so on... Just the same boring multiculti all over...

Immegrants come here to Sweden, mainly from our neighbours countries with similar cultures. These Danes, Germans, Finns, Italians and so on are not even representated in the criminal statistics! It´s the non-europeans that settle in poor areas where their countrymen are living, and ghettos are formed. Since the government can´t just force people to move, these ghettos are getting larger and larger. In Rosenbad, Malmo, 1000 students study in the Rosenbad school. Only two of the students are Swedes. How in earth are the immegrants suppose to learn swedish culture, language and so one when there are no Swedes?

I want Swedish culture in Sweden and Brittish culture in Brittain or else the world would be so boring...

[Lazul]

dude, Rosenbad is something ells, its Rosengård!

allso, actually, immigrants from lets say Denmark and Finnland are usually in the statistics as well but when someone says immigrants most people think of Yugoslavians/ East-European in Sweden.
Now, it is a fact tho, that the immigrants in Sweden arent really doing anyone a favor when they keep beating people up.
From personal experiance I can say that just about every time I see a fight here in Halmstad... a "immigrant" is involved. Now its no big news that most immigrants do NOT commit crimes, its just that its the once that do that are visible, the once that are shown in the media.

[mystic brew]

hmmmm.

Those numbers do seem worrying, to be sure.

However, some of the numbers are a little misleading.
What perdcentage of everybody would call the police if they found anyone preaching hate.

I've left a church in my time after hearing the preacher comment that it was justifiable to kill gays... Didn't report it. The bystander effect is large.

[Tribesman]

For some years ago 5% where muslims. That is maybe slightly higher today...
Try 3.9% And what about all those damn Roma ? cheeky little buggers they are , you finally recognise their language after nearly 400 years and they all start flooding into the place from the Balkans .

Anyway wasn't this "survey" used to start another thread already .
But what the hell , I might as well repeat it hear
* 24% symphatices with the bombings.
Entirely misleading
"whether or not you feel the bombings were justified , do you have any sympathy with the feelings and motives of those who carried out the attacks"

Since the bombers they caught are saying that it had to do with the Iraq war then as that counts as a "feeling or motives" of the bombers , and the vast majiority of people in Britain oppesed the war then either the 526 people they asked are lying or they didn't understandd the question
* 18% feel no loyalty at all with Brittain.
No that is 10% the same result would arise from any sample of "british" people
* 27% would not call the police and warn if they found out someone is planning an act of terrorism.
73% would call the police 12% would call the local authorities , 3% wouldn't tell anyone

They become more and more, and soon western Europe will be majority muslim to...
Yeah right , so tell me what sort of percentage has France or Britain got after a long history of immigrations ? Are they even after such a long history any where near a Muslim Majority , or is it a small minority ?

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Yeah right , so tell me what sort of percentage has France or Britain got after a long history of immigrations ? Are they even after such a long history any where near a Muslim Majority , or is it a small minority ?

Well I know that it tripled between 94 and 2003.

France is home to some six to seven Muslims, the largest Muslim minority in Europe.

It seems that Muslims are the Blacks of France if not all of Europe.

PARIS, June 19, 2005 (IslamOnline.net) – French prisons are teeming with Muslims, a phenomenon chaplains and sociologists blame on marginalization and towering poverty and unemployment rates among the Muslim minority.

“It really harms the image of Islam and Muslims in France that prisons are teeming with Muslims,” Mamdo Sango, a Muslim chaplain, told IslamOnline.net.

Iranian-French researcher Farhad Khosrokhavar said in his recently published book Islam in Prisons that Muslims make up some 70 percent of a total of 60,775 prisoners in France.

LINK

Sounds very familiar does it not? Are you guys racists over there?

[Radier]

dude, Rosenbad is something ells, its Rosengård!

allso, actually, immigrants from lets say Denmark and Finnland are usually in the statistics as well but when someone says immigrants most people think of Yugoslavians/ East-European in Sweden.
Now, it is a fact tho, that the immigrants in Sweden arent really doing anyone a favor when they keep beating people up.
From personal experiance I can say that just about every time I see a fight here in Halmstad... a "immigrant" is involved. Now its no big news that most immigrants do NOT commit crimes, its just that its the once that do that are visible, the once that are shown in the media.

Oh I messed that up... Of course it´s Rosengård

I heared on the radio that the most criminal immegrants are from northern Africa west of Egypt. Second worst are those from South America. Third worst are middle eastern people. No offence, just facts here...

My personal experience is also that immegrants are far more criminal than Swedes. My expensive bicykle was taken by two guys named Achmed and Muhammed (never got it back). My cousins boyfriend nearly got himself killed by a syrian gang. My cousins friend got raped by arabs. My fathers two classmates nearly got raped by middle-eastern people. A guy at work was nearly stabbed to death by Roma... Immegrants tend to be heavely over representated!

I strongly disagree with the last part. The media sucks at report crimes here in Sweden. If the criminal are from eastern europe they allways report which country he/her came from. But have you ever heard on the news that they say" The man comes from Turkey". No, never. The media is close to being rascist.
It´s the same when they report crimes from Stockholm. They say Täby, Lidingö and so on, the rich swedish northern parts, but when something happens in Rinkeby or Tensta they allways say "southern Stockholm". That realy pisses me of. They shall tell the truth and treat people equal wathever their homeareas are...

I say kick the criminal immegrants out, and let the good ones stay... But sadly, many consider me a rascist when I think so...

[Tribesman]

France is home to some six to seven Muslims, the largest Muslim minority in Europe.
Only six or seven , I thought there were more than that just in some of the soccer teams

[lancelot]

This IMO is what happened in Kosovo. You guys better not start persecuting them or we will have to bomb you.

LOL! Classic.

Gawain-you have just cheered me up!

[King Ragnar]

I completely agree with raider throw them out of our country, multi-cultural societies dont work, if they did, then how come near were i live (newcastle), there is a whole housing estate for jewish people, surley if multi-cultural societies work would all the jewish people be living with native British people, another point backing the fact taht mulit-cultural societies dont work is Rwanda, look what happened there.

[King Ragnar]

sorry double post

[A.Saturnus]

edit: I just hope the thread gets closed soon.

[Devastatin Dave]

edit: I just hope the thread gets closed soon.

Why, seems like a civil discussion to me?

[A.Saturnus]

Why, seems like a civil discussion to me?

Well, you haven´t seen my post before I editted it
No, I just think it will lead nowhere.

[Devastatin Dave]

But whats wrong with discussing the problems of another culture unwilling to assimulate into a new culture? You don't view this as a problem? Now I'm not saying that anyone should have to completely loose their identity, but I would like them to learn language of their new home and try not to burden the native residence with uncompomising attitudes or former cultural practicies, ie blowing up subways and crowded buses, chopping off heads, etc.

[Papewaio]

What is the opposite of a multi-cultural society?

Mono-cultural.

Virtually no such thing in the world.

What is a British Native? So you are going to give back Britain to the Celts and all the Saxons onwards can leave?

[Don Corleone]

Actually, the Celts arrived to find it already populated. The Britains were an actual people, I'm not even sure they were indigenous, or whether they displaced a hitherto unnamed people....

I used to get into trouble for saying this, because it's so politically incorrect, but when you come right down to it, everybody in the USA is an African-American. It's all just a question of when we left the mother continent and which route we took.