Three Kings = Very Poignant War in Iraq Movie

[Navaros]

there is an old movie called Three Kings. it's about the first Gulf War. it's from 1999.

it's a very poignant movie. it portrays the USA as sort of good, and sort of evil. and same with Saddam's Iraqi army too. it shows some Iraqis who are supposed to be evil, and some who are sorta of good and have very legitimate reasons for hating the USA and hence understandably do bad things to US soldiers

it's the best war movie i've ever seen.

it has a lot of deep messages in it that show the USA in both a good light and a bad light at the exact same time

the acting is stellar all around. the script is top-notch. the visual style is very engrossing.

one of the most ironic things is that in the movie a solider is criticizing the USA to his CO for abandoning the Iraqis right after Bush Sr. told them to fight against Saddam, and then the CO replies with something like: "what do you want us to do, occupy Iraq and have another Vietnam on our hands?!" which of course is now what we have today, although the makers of the film did not know that at the time they were making it

have any of you seen Three Kings? if so, what are your thoughts and how do you think it is possible that an entire White House administration could be so stupid as to occupy Iraq when even Hollywood could see that occupying Iraq was a horrible idea. and they saw that way before 9/11

[Lazul]

I agree... wait, hmm I agree with Navaros... odd... well anyway I agree its a very good movie! and like you said the script is superb!

[Es Arkajae]

I thought it was a poor movie.

It couldn't seem to make up its mind whether it was a comedy, war movie, action or drama-war movie*.

The ending was also far from satisfying, I was led to believe it was going to be some kind of modern day 'Kelly's Heroes', instead I got a wishy washy film that wasn't funny enough to be a comedy and didn't have enough real battles and 'military stuff' to qualify it as a decent war film.


*Saving Private Ryan was a 'Drama-war movie', Battle of Britain and Tora, Tora, Tora were 'proper' war movies.

If that definition is still unclear then heres a good rule of thumb, if the movie involves copious amounts of "war is hell!" sentiment or lots of male crying then its likely a drama-war movie.

On the other hand if it contains copious amounts of pathetic prose, boring moralising and lots of male crying then its probably 'The Thin Red Line'

[PanzerJaeger]

I wonder if we're thinking of the same movie.. with Ice Cube and Clooney?

I didnt think it was very good... the acting and plot were somewhat weak. Its been a long time since I saw it, but I wasnt impressed.

Its a typical hollywood setup, some bad dudes who are really good at heart have to choose between their own greed and the lives of innocents.. a la Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom.

I didnt see much deep in that movie either.. it seemed pretty topical. They just ran around from one bad situation to another, always narrowly missing danger, blah blah blah.

A good war movie in english is Saving Private Ryan.. thats got a lot of deepness, or if you can understand German, get Stalingrad or Das Boot - the subtitles dont do them justice at times. Those two titles are amazingly complex and deal with warfare in a completely different way.

Art is all opinion oriented, i just didnt like the movie that much.

[Navaros]

I thought it was a poor movie.

It couldn't seem to make up its mind whether it was a comedy, war movie, action or drama-war movie*.

The ending was also far from satisfying

i love almost all the jokes in that movie. they are mostly very hilarious and the best part is that the jokes in the movie are not done in a silly way which ruins the atmosphere in so many other movies

seems to me that it was a war movie with a lot of clever humor tactfully infused into the script

i loved the ending. it was great how the antagonist role played an ironic part in how things turned out in a somewhat good way. how can you not like a funny twist like that

[Lazul]

I thought it was a poor movie.

It couldn't seem to make up its mind whether it was a comedy, war movie, action or drama-war movie*.

The ending was also far from satisfying, I was led to believe it was going to be some kind of modern day 'Kelly's Heroes', instead I got a wishy washy film that wasn't funny enough to be a comedy and didn't have enough real battles and 'military stuff' to qualify it as a decent war film.


*Saving Private Ryan was a 'Drama-war movie', Battle of Britain and Tora, Tora, Tora were 'proper' war movies.

If that definition is still unclear then heres a good rule of thumb, if the movie involves copious amounts of "war is hell!" sentiment or lots of male crying then its likely a drama-war movie.

On the other hand if it contains copious amounts of pathetic prose, boring moralising and lots of male crying then its probably 'The Thin Red Line'

hmm so you cant handle emotions and realism then? War is perfect place to squeez in some philosofy and thinking like Thin Red Line.
People cry in war, or how would you react if your leg was blown of?

Go watch Rambo III or something.

[Es Arkajae]

hmm so you cant handle emotions and realism then?

I was unaware you were dyslexic Lazul, I certainly don't recall mentioning anything against all emotions and realism.

War is perfect place to squeez in some philosofy and thinking like Thin Red Line.
People cry in war, or how would you react if your leg was blown of?

Oh and you also missed the word 'copious'?, you should probably see your optometrist.

Go watch Rambo III or something.

No I'll watch 'Battle of Britain', 'Tora, Tora, Tora', 'Guns of Navarone', 'Gettysburg', 'Zulu' etc.

You know war movies which are able to occasionally get across the horrors of war without dwelling on them and beating you over the head with an anti-war message. they also manage to remain entertaining, unlike SPR which after the initial beach landing becomes boring IMO

[Navaros]

I wonder if we're thinking of the same movie.. with Ice Cube and Clooney?

I didnt think it was very good... the acting and plot were somewhat weak. Its been a long time since I saw it, but I wasnt impressed.

I didnt see much deep in that movie either.. it seemed pretty topical. They just ran around from one bad situation to another, always narrowly missing danger, blah blah blah.

A good war movie in english is Saving Private Ryan.. thats got a lot of deepness, or if you can understand German, get Stalingrad or Das Boot - the subtitles dont do them justice at times. Those two titles are amazingly complex and deal with warfare in a completely different way.

narrowly escaping danger? dude there's very little of that in the movie. this movie has hardcore violence and torture in it. and a whole lotta gruesome deaths.

the violence is just not filmed in the same way as in Saving Private Ryan

i find Three Kings to be a much deeper movie than Ryan because in Ryan the dialogue itself didn't seem to have any relevance that goes beyond the immediate situation the soldiers are in. whereas Three Kings presents a highly relevant and easily understandable social commentary

like Tom Hanks, i too didn't care about the crybaby named Ryan. i did however, care alot about all the characters in Three Kings

[PanzerJaeger]

Hmm, well Ill have to watch to movie again - its been a long time.

As to what Lazul and Es Arkajae were talking about: Anti-war is certainly a genre in film making and usually emphasizes the most horrible things about war, while neglecting a lot of history and such. This can be taken to extremes sometimes with so much crying and emotional pontification it becomes tiresome and unbelievable.

Just because someone doesnt like that kind of movie doesnt mean they are Rambo lovers.

[Sjakihata]

What's wrong with Rambo?

[Lazul]

Rambo 1 was ok, 2 was silly 3 was... stupid.

Rambo, his friend and some dudes on horses beat a Russian army... fat chance haha

[Ronin]

Rambo 1 was ok, 2 was silly 3 was... stupid.

Rambo, his friend and some dudes on horses beat a Russian army... fat chance haha

exactly....that last scene throwns the entire third chapter in the crapper....

2 guys in a ditch against an entire russian army and what is Rambo´s comment?..."...'em!"...please....

i like an action movie as much as the next guy...but in a war movie reality can´t go completely out the window.

[IrishMike]

Guess what. Another rambo is comming out for out enjoyment to.

Anyways, I liked three kings, it was pretty cool all in all. Heck, I like any war movie if its got some decent war scenes in it. Only eception is Druids, that was painful to watch.

[RabidGibbon]

Some of the talk about different types of war movies - ie: the Saving Private Ryan vs. Tora Tora Tora type of picture reminded me of a autobiography of George Macdonald Fraser I read, about his experiences in Burma during WW2 "Quartered Safe out Here" (Think like Vietnam, except with cumbrian accents).

Anyway the point was that war is rarely like as shown in the movies because in the movies people want to see emotion - but in that era at least, and soldiers in general didn't want their buddies to see them showing fear, angsting over the wrong and right of wars and pouring their hearts out over the enemy they'd just killed. They were all scared, they all wanted to go home, but none of them wanted the rest of their squad to see that. However in a movie people want to see what the characters are thinking/feeling and the best way to show that is ethier damn fine acting (Hard) or have them speak it out loud (easier).

For my money, Three Kings was a good movie, but the happy ending seemed a bit tacked on. I fell asleep during Saving Private Ryan, and was annoyed that the loud bangs kept waking me up.

Also Stalingrad and Das Boot are kick ass movies, even though I don't speak german.

[Tricon]

Three Kings was a decent movie. I got plenty of entertainment from it. That's good in my book. I don't think it was meant to bring the horrors of war to our attention.
Have to agree that Stalingrad and Das Boot are really REALLY good war movies.

If you're into depressing war movies. watch "Nothing new on the western front". There are a couple of versions out there. Both very good. Its about WWI btw.

[Husar]

I also liked Three Kings, but I think Bravo Two Zero and Black Hawk Down are even better, especially Black Hawk Down has a lot of combat going on, and I´m kind of oversatisfied with WW2 themes, may it be games or films, I just begin to dislike it, if I see a game about WW2, I just don´t care anymore.

[Kaiser of Arabia]

It was ok, for a war movie though, I like Stalingrad.
I think Panzer may agree with me there.

[PanzerJaeger]

Yea, a great movie that doesnt get much exposure over here.. just like Der Untergang. I had to go to a nasty little theater down town where they show foreign films to see it - but it was worth it.

[dgfred]

I also liked Three Kings, but I think Bravo Two Zero and Black Hawk Down are even better, especially Black Hawk Down has a lot of combat going on, and I´m kind of oversatisfied with WW2 themes, may it be games or films, I just begin to dislike it, if I see a game about WW2, I just don´t care anymore.

Das Boot is awesome! Black Hawk down, I also read the book, was good
and really showed the frustration caused by such a sorry situation- both
tactically and politically. The operation/rescue were poorly planned and
executed. It really pissed me off.

[Blodrast]

loved Das Boot too !! gotta get me Stalingrad, though.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

If you're into depressing war movies. watch "Nothing new on the western front". There are a couple of versions out there. Both very good. Its about WWI btw.

I seriously hope you mean "All Quiet on the Western Front" - and see the original.

"Nothing New on the Western Front" does have a nice sound to it, though.

[Reverend Joe]

I don't think you can really put a lot of these movies together.

Saving Private Ryan just seemed, to me, to be a straight-up depiction of World War 2, albeit rather limited to the Americans. It just follows a single squad of soldiers as they progress through their campaign, and finally get destroyed in a battle they can't possibly win. It is hard for me to watch, but it is a good realistic war movie.

Three Kings isn't really a war movie; it is sort of its own kind of animal. It is somewhat anti-war, but it is also simply a way of viewing both sides of a conflict much like the one we are embroiled in right now. You may leave it feeling that it was pro-war, in that we should have done more, or anti-war in that we should have done less.

Stalingrad (which, by the way, is the single most depressing war movie I have ever seen) is more like Apocalypse Now to me. It starts out in an ordinary war situation, but from there the whole thing gets wierder and wierder, finally ending with the surrender of the Sixth army wothout the viewer even realising this has happened until we see Paulus and his staff amrching away with their hands up. Even then, the soldiers don't seem to relaise what has happened, and they keep trying to break out. Still, it is one of the best war movies I have ever seen.

[Navaros]

Three Kings isn't really a war movie; it is sort of its own kind of animal. It is somewhat anti-war, but it is also simply a way of viewing both sides of a conflict much like the one we are embroiled in right now. You may leave it feeling that it was pro-war, in that we should have done more, or anti-war in that we should have done less.

yes! what you said here is exactly the point i was trying to get across of why Three Kings is a masterpiece of a movie. because philosophically speaking, Three Kings depicts war in a much more realistic way than most other movies. other movies which usually tend to present things in the overly-simplistic cliche of of having "Americans are the 'saintly good guys'" and "non-Americans are the 'evil bad guys'"

[Lazul]

If you want realism, no overdone dramatics or lame hero-tales then I suggest you watch "Framom främsta linjen", its a movie about Swedish speaking Finns during the war against the Russians.
Framom främsta linjen is one of the most realistic war movies ever and it is shown plain and simple how it happened... seeing as Harry Järv himself, whom the movie is based on was on set to help. Even what the soldiers are saying is almost 100% correct.

see it!