Did Atomics or Soviets end WWII?

[Gawain of Orkeny]

If the bombs hadn't been dropped it is likely that the Japanese would have surrendered anyway, not because of the Russians. They sped that up of course, but Japan was down and out because of the lack of strategic meterials. She was exhausted and as mentioned earlier the Emperor finally began to act and not just sit silently as he was 'supposed' to.

You dont know the Japanese then. They even tried a coup to stop the surrender. These peole did not think like westerners any more than arabs think like westerners today. This is where many go wrong using their ideas and ethics as the base for all others.

[Kraxis]

You dont know the Japanese then. They even tried a coup to stop the surrender. These peole did not think like westerners any more than arabs think like westerners today. This is where many go wrong using their ideas and ethics as the base for all others.

A minority within the military attempted that. Do not lump them together like that.
The Japanese would do his duty, and not ask questions. They are, and I don't like to say it really, like ants. For the common good, not the idividual.

But even the militaristic military was finally softening up, especially the airforce and navy, of course their old enemy the army wanted the long fight. It could even be argued that they wanted the fight because the other two wanted the peace, it was that bad between them. And even in the army it was a minority that really wanted it.

[Kagemusha]

I think we all have to remember that Japan was still in its Impearilistic phase in WWII .They were fanatics,but you dont hear anything about Japanese Holocaust camps.Because there were non.After Russo-Japanese war they just thought that they could win a fight against any Superpower.And if someone thinks that Japanese main islands would have been peace of cake,.I would like to see some evidence.

[Papewaio]

I think we all have to remember that Japan was still in its Impearilistic phase in WWII .They were fanatics,but you dont hear anything about Japanese Holocaust camps.Because there were non.

Ah dude I think you should reassess your statement that the Japanese didn't have Holocaust camps. They treated POWs pretty poorly and on par with German Holocaust camps.

The sacking of NanKing is as brutal as anything done in Germanys deatj camps, over 300,000 civilians slaughtered. Japanese soldiers took bets on what sex an unborn child was then opened up the mother killing both to find out who one the bet. etc

When the Japanese defeated Singapore they bayoneted hospital patients.

Then there was the death marches where if a prisoner fell down they were executed.

Burma railroad.

Nerve agents where tested on the civilian population.

The list is pretty long. And if you bother to find out what the Japanese did it is as every bit as evil as the German Nazis.

==== EDIT ====

It may be pointless to try to establish which World War Two Axis aggressor, Germany or Japan, was the more brutal to the peoples it victimised. The Germans killed six million Jews and 20 million Russians; the Japanese slaughtered as many as 30 million Filipinos, Malays, Vietnamese, Cambodians, Indonesians and Burmese, at least 23 million of them ethnic Chinese. Both nations looted the countries they conquered on a monumental scale, though Japan plundered more, over a longer period, than the Nazis. Both conquerors enslaved millions and exploited them as forced labourers — and, in the case of the Japanese, as prostitutes for front-line troops. If you were a Nazi prisoner of war from Britain, America, Australia, New Zealand or Canada (but not Russia) you faced a 4 per cent chance of not surviving the war; [by comparison] the death rate for Allied POWs held by the Japanese was nearly 30 per cent

Japanese war crimes

[Redleg]

We had a pretty long discussion on just this issue in the backroom - but more along the lines of the ethics - but in essences the Atomic bombs ended the war.

Instead of retyping all of the information here is a link to the previous discussion. Its a 7 page politicial discussion - that got pretty heated - but the facts are there

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...3&page=2&pp=30

[Gemenii XIII]

The atomic bomb was a political engagement and had little to do with ending the war for the sake of saving allied lives. The americans knew that after the soviets "liberated" most of europe, they would turn to Japan for political control of the country. Japan and Russia have been in a conflict prior to WWII (russo japan war in 1908), in which the soviets lost the Hokido island to the japanese. WWII gave the soviets the perfect reason for attacking Japan. To cease Soviet expansion, the americans dropped 2 atomic bombs on Japan in order for it to surrender before the Soviets invaded. This was the main reason for the bombs of Japan. It was a political move by Harry S Truman. In the long run, the atomic bombs caused more good than harm for Japan as it is the second largest economy in the world. A feat that would be impossible had the soviets invaded.

[Redleg]

The atomic bomb was a political engagement and had little to do with ending the war for the sake of saving allied lives.

And you would be incorrect in that assessment.

The americans knew that after the soviets "liberated" most of europe, they would turn to Japan for political control of the country. Japan and Russia have been in a conflict prior to WWII (russo japan war in 1908), in which the soviets lost the Hokido island to the japanese. WWII gave the soviets the perfect reason for attacking Japan.

Yes indeed the Soviet Union entered into the Pacific War for terrority gain - and a promise made by Stalin in 1943.

To cease Soviet expansion, the americans dropped 2 atomic bombs on Japan in order for it to surrender before the Soviets invaded. This was the main reason for the bombs of Japan.

It was actually a secondary reason one that is rarely discussed within the history circles in the Unied States - the primary reasons can be found at this site

http://www.trumanlibrary.org/whistle...arge/index.php

It was a political move by Harry S Truman. In the long run, the atomic bombs caused more good than harm for Japan as it is the second largest economy in the world. A feat that would be impossible had the soviets invaded.

The soviets were not going to invade Japan - they were after many other things - but doing a sea invasion was not part of their plan.