Problem with Christianity

[Byzantine Prince]

Ok I was sitting down watching I heart Huckabees and thinking hard about philosophy and I just realised something I think is important.

Ok as a disclaimer, I am not in any ways trying to bash Christianity, just trying to communicate an theory I just made up about the history and theory of it.

Ok here we go. I think the fatal flaw in christianity is that the Bible is not necessarily a philosophical text. Ok now let's talk about the history. For ages the church and Christians in general have been pretty mean and even evil people, even in a christian context. How do we explain all the lynching, the murders, the war, the executions, the slavery that has been commited in the name of christ? A person who taught love and to treat everyone as he would like to be treated. How could people blatantly ignore that?

How can we as a Christian society be capitalists? Jesus himself was a socialist I'm sure.
Seriously though aren't the christian conservatives in the US being a tad hypocritical about following god's message and at the same time supporting a government that would ban homosexuality, give capitalism, which is let's face, greed! more tax breaks. Or how about letting the poor and needy die by destroying social security and privatizing health care, which is already is in the US. Is this really what Jesus was talking about. Or how about the Pope, a mear *man* being given so much wealth and power and so much attention for the sake of god or jesus. Look at Jesus, he taught humility, the was nothing modest about the pope's inaguration. These are Christians?!?! These people make me sick, they are even lower then sychophants!

Hell even Nitzsche makes Jesus out to be a great person even though Jesus... well didn't believe in God because technically he WAS god wasn't he. Hm. Interesting, so I can only assume that if Jesus lived today he would be an existentialist socialist guy just like god. Hell I can quote JAG "I am God". JAG is Jesus! OMFG!!!

Well so I guess the question is, is JAG god?

[AntiochusIII]

To be fair, many of the Christian (devout ones) posters here condemn the Vatican for its corruption.

Edit: Yeah, this thread is quite a fat bait for flaming. I smell BBQ...

[Papewaio]

When a footballer makes a mistake do you blame the individual or the rules and spirit of the game?

[KafirChobee]

Please lock this thread. It has no purpose except to incite the believers into a fury of Gods Will. And condemn the rest of us to hell.

Me thinks.

Also, it has been done, over and over and over again. Either we believe, or we don't. If we do, God blesses us. If we don't Satan does. So? What is the point?

[Byzantine Prince]

A) PAPE I have not idea what you're talking about

B)This is not about Muslims, so let's try and forget about them

C)Kafeer, this thread is great and will not be closed. And no we are not going to hell for not believing in God. Jesus didn't believe in god for example.

[Redleg]

C)Kafeer, this thread is great and will not be closed. And no we are not going to hell for not believing in God. Jesus didn't believe in god for example.

Now that is funny and shows a lack of understanding of the Bible.

[Sigurd]

You do strike at something important and I am sure the intent of this thread is not to discuss that which is to follow: The origin of the church.
At least that was what I thought of when reading your remarks. The latter part of your remarks is just a rant which ended in an unserious question which could very likely result in spam…

Ok BP, you got me thinking of the origin of the Christian church and whether it was Jesus’ intent to let it survive. As you indirectly pointed out, the infant church was peace loving, pacifist and evangelical. What changed that?

I would say the organisation that Jesus and his Apostles founded did not survive. And that a bastardisation was organised at a later point; the remnant of which survived and branched off to the 250+ Christian denominations that exists today.

Ever since Eusebius sought to prove the survival of the church the church history has been the same; to give a clear and comprehensive, scientifically established view of the development of the visible institution of salvation founded by Christ.
To describe it – not to question it. ...
Church history requires unquestioning acceptance of the basic propositions that the church did survive. There are endless writings about the infant church, but not one questions the notion that the early church does not consider its organisation as infant but rather as an old failing woman. ...
One writes about the unquenchable light through storm and shadow, yet does not question why Jesus himself insisted that the Light was to be taken away. In fact Jesus announced in no uncertain terms that his message would be rejected by all men(1). That he would soon leave the world to die in its sins and seek after him in vain(2). The light was soon to depart, leaving a great darkness in which no man can work while the prince of this world would remain, as usual, in possession of the field(3). ...
This bodes ill for the interval between the ascension and the parousia; it was to be a bad time and a long one(4). What is more it begins almost immediately, the apostles themselves calling attention to all the fatal signs and marvelling only that it has come so soon(5).

A short while the early church enjoyed the leadership of apostles as nomadic preachers and overseers of the small churches in the Mediterranean area, each of which was lead by a bishop.
The apostles where finally all killed by the opposition to the early church. Who would take the mantle of the empty positions of the apostles?
The bishops gathered with the intent to sort out this predicament of the church. Clementine (the bishop of Rome) would not take the mantle of general leadership as he proposed that such authority lay within the tomes of the apostles (6).
The esoteric knowledge of the church was lost and there were no guidance. This knowledge was later claimed by the Gnostics.

The fact is the early church was an eschatological one or in other words a doomsday church. And it ended as predicted with the apostles. They (the church) were all to be martyrs and would all face the fate of its founder and his apostles; death. And the earth would dwindle in unbelief and led by the prince of darkness until the return of Him who would destroy his enemies; the time of reconciliation or judgement. The enemies of the church exploited every inconsistencies and absurdities in its position and made merry over “Jesus the King who never ruled” they never played up what would be the biggest joke of them all – the feverish, hourly expectations of the Lord who never came. This is according to Robert Eisler: “The most astonishing of all historical paradoxes”.

[edit]: Be advised that I started my response when this thread only had one reply...
[edit II]: Added italics and colour to quoted material from the book When the Lights Went Out by Hugh W. Nibley.

(1)Matthew 17:12; 21:37-39; 23:31-37; Mark 12:6-8; Luke 17:25; John 1:5, 10-11; 3:11-12, 19, 32; 5:38, 40-47; 7:7; 8:19,23-24, 37-38,40-47; 15:22-25; Acts 3:21
(2)Matthew 9:15; Luke 9:41; 13:25-27; 17:22; John 12:33-36; 13:33; 14:30; 16:16; Acts 3:21
(3)John 9:4-5; 14:30; Recognitiones Clementinae 3.61(PG 1:1208)
(4)Matthew 13:30, 39-43; Mark 12:9; 2 Thessalonians 2:8; Didache 16
(5)John 17:25; 1 Peter 5:8; 1 John 3:1
(6) Recognitiones Clementinae xxx

[IliaDN]

Ok I was sitting down watching I heart Huckabees and thinking hard about philosophy and I just realised something I think is important.

Ok as a disclaimer, I am not in any ways trying to bash Christianity, just trying to communicate an theory I just made up about the history and theory of it.

Ok here we go. I think the fatal flaw in christianity is that the Bible is not necessarily a philosophical text. Ok now let's talk about the history. For ages the church and Christians in general have been pretty mean and even evil people, even in a christian context. How do we explain all the lynching, the murders, the war, the executions, the slavery that has been commited in the name of christ? A person who taught love and to treat everyone as he would like to be treated. How could people blatantly ignore that?

How can we as a Christian society be capitalists? Jesus himself was a socialist I'm sure.
Seriously though aren't the christian conservatives in the US being a tad hypocritical about following god's message and at the same time supporting a government that would ban homosexuality, give capitalism, which is let's face, greed! more tax breaks. Or how about letting the poor and needy die by destroying social security and privatizing health care, which is already is in the US. Is this really what Jesus was talking about. Or how about the Pope, a mear *man* being given so much wealth and power and so much attention for the sake of god or jesus. Look at Jesus, he taught humility, the was nothing modest about the pope's inaguration. These are Christians?!?! These people make me sick, they are even lower then sychophants!

Hell even Nitzsche makes Jesus out to be a great person even though Jesus... well didn't believe in God because technically he WAS god wasn't he. Hm. Interesting, so I can only assume that if Jesus lived today he would be an existentialist socialist guy just like god. Hell I can quote JAG "I am God". JAG is Jesus! OMFG!!!

Well so I guess the question is, is JAG god?

What about muslims for example? Nowadays many crimes are made by people who claim themselves to be muslims.

[AggonyDuck]

Ok here we go. I think the fatal flaw in christianity is that the Bible is not necessarily a philosophical text.

What I find is strange is that you claim that the fatal flaw in christianity is that the Bible is not a philosophical text, but yet you don't have an argument why this would be a flaw. I would honestly say that your claim is false, because the bible is a philosophical book, that basically revolves around Jesus' teachings. In my opinion if the bible can't be considered a philosophical text, then a lot of the dialogues written by philosophers can't be considered philosophical either. Anyways I'd like to hear your argument why the Bible is not a philosophical book?

Just as note, that what I refer as the Bible is actually the new testament.

[AggonyDuck]

For ages the church and Christians in general have been pretty mean and even evil people, even in a christian context. How do we explain all the lynching, the murders, the war, the executions, the slavery that has been commited in the name of christ? A person who taught love and to treat everyone as he would like to be treated. How could people blatantly ignore that?

Because they're humans in good and bad...For ages the humans have been pretty mean and evil people. All those lynchings, murders, wars, executions etc. are not caused by Christianity, but by humans who claimed that they believed in it. Remember that religion is a mighty tool in the hands of someone who knows how to manipulate the people who believe in it.
It's also a very easy way to justify things and the perfect excuse at times.
What I'm trying to say is that the blame for those horrendous acts goes to the humans who commited them, not to Christianity.