An other "Next TotalWar Game" thread

[Bartix]

I think it should be Fantasy!
I think it should be no-franchise fantasy!

Then all CA must focus on is game play.
And all players must focus on is game play.
And all modders must focus on is game play.

It is hard enough (down!) to get a game history-correct or fun to play.

Those mods who focus on game play only, getting to abstracted from realism in RTW setting. Those who focus on realism only get little fun.

BI demo may be hint that they are thinking away from realism more, because units light up "level up" style when gain experience.

So this it what I think. all stats, weapon, region, faction, culture, mount, everything just designed for best possible game, not for correctness to be dissected.

I like history and learning and that as much as next man, but I like most a fun game!
And Total War Type Game is great!! potentially!!

[Afro Thunder]

You're gonna get yelled at...

[scorillo]

a WW1 total war it will be a great idea....followed as a expansion WW2...i'm bored (and i think i'm not the only one here) of these ancient and medieval total wars

[bubbanator]

I think that WWI and WWII would be fantastic ideas for the next Total War Games.

WWI has more countries that played major roles in the conflict. But WWII would have several countries that didn't have much of an effect in the war. These would be a real challange to play as.

However it would be difficult to get all areas of the world into it. It would probably just have to be the European theatre. In Civilization 2 there was a mini campaign for WWII. That had America starting out with several cities in the east coast. That was the edge of the map. Something like this could be implimented into a WWI or WWII total war game.

Gameplay on the battle map would be difficult to perfect though...

[rs2k2]

I think it should be Fantasy!
I think it should be no-franchise fantasy!

oh man...my flying pegasus cavalry just totally destroyed your dragons. of course, elephants oops, i mean dragons, would run amok easily...

nope sorry...just doesnt cut it for me

[econ21]

If the next TW game is going to use the RTW engine, as has been reported, I would imagine that it will be in a largely pre-gunpowder era. However, given that they have covered the ancient and medieval era, it's not obvious to me what era is left.

I hope CA don't move into fantasy, because - despite the complaints - I think they make the most fun historical wargames around. (They aim at mass market strategy games, but IMO are historical wargamers at heart and leave enough of the hardcore stuff in their games to satisfy that niche, at least after modding).

[Ianofsmeg16]

If the next TW game is going to use the RTW engine, as has been reported, I would imagine that it will be in a largely pre-gunpowder era. However, given that they have covered the ancient and medieval era, it's not obvious to me what era is left.

I hope CA don't move into fantasy, because - despite the complaints - I think they make the most fun historical wargames around. (They aim at mass market strategy games, but IMO are historical wargamers at heart and leave enough of the hardcore stuff in their games to satisfy that niche, at least after modding).

What about Napoleonic times, that can and is being implemented on the RTW engine, all they'd need to do was get the gunpowder animations which is basically just smoke, then ta da!

For fun reasons, i want a World War: Total War, it would be awesome, but hard to make.

[econ21]

What about Napoleonic times, that can and is being implemented on the RTW engine, all they'd need to do was get the gunpowder animations which is basically just smoke, then ta da!

Yeah, I guess. The "Lords" modders did it with MTW afterall. The Napoleonic era is certainly the most obvious era for another TW game, in terms of the suitability of the strategic situation - multiple Great Powers - and mass appeal. The commerical waters have been muddied a little by Cossacks 2 and Imperial Glory, although neither can hold a candle to a TW game IMO.
Being my favoriate era, I'd be happy to see the Napoleonic era selected.

But I rather fear that a Napoleonic Total War would be very ahistorical - with a RTW engine, I suspect battles would degenerate into rapid, melee scrummages. In reality, formation was everything and death by bayonet accounted for something like less than 1% of fatalities. If these fears are realised, I guess modders might be able to tweak it into something more historical.

[Viking]

I think that WWI and WWII would be fantastic ideas for the next Total War Games.

WWI has more countries that played major roles in the conflict. But WWII would have several countries that didn't have much of an effect in the war. These would be a real challange to play as.

However it would be difficult to get all areas of the world into it. It would probably just have to be the European theatre. In Civilization 2 there was a mini campaign for WWII. That had America starting out with several cities in the east coast. That was the edge of the map. Something like this could be implimented into a WWI or WWII total war game.

Gameplay on the battle map would be difficult to perfect though...

I think there would be too little diversity between the factions in a WWI/II TW, IMO.
Personally I`m hoping for a Persia: Total War or something like that for TW4. I like the balance between realism and gameplay TW has right now, although the gameplay could be improved quite a bit, without changing to fantasy.

[King Mon]

i wouldnt buy a world war 1/2 game, i prefer swords to guns guns are just to easy...

[Ianofsmeg16]

Yeah, I guess. The "Lords" modders did it with MTW afterall. The Napoleonic era is certainly the most obvious era for another TW game, in terms of the suitability of the strategic situation - multiple Great Powers - and mass appeal. The commerical waters have been muddied a little by Cossacks 2 and Imperial Glory, although neither can hold a candle to a TW game IMO.
Being my favoriate era, I'd be happy to see the Napoleonic era selected.

But I rather fear that a Napoleonic Total War would be very ahistorical - with a RTW engine, I suspect battles would degenerate into rapid, melee scrummages. In reality, formation was everything and death by bayonet accounted for something like less than 1% of fatalities. If these fears are realised, I guess modders might be able to tweak it into something more historical.

Yeah, they should bring back Historical Campaigns, then one of them could be you acting out as Richard Sharpe fighting in the Penninsular war!

Also i thing the Lordz have cracked gunpowder for RTW aswell
Another thing i'd like to see...a more personalised feel to the units, basically just being able to name units "the Scots Greys" or the Famous "78th Highlanders" not just Line infantry or Heavy cavalry all the time

A Knights of honour-style camp map, with different levels
Level 1: Overview of the World: Huge map but only has province details and cities on it
Level 2: Continent Map: RTW Map at the moment, more detailed than lvl 1 with armies, spies and diplomats etc.
Level 3 : Country Map: Extremely detailed map with villages, towns and cities that all play a different role in running your country, also add Churches, farmhouses and Manor houses (another thing from KOH) onto this level
Battle map: Battle maps should be un-restricted or at least huge, ecompassing everything you see on level 3 into the battle map e.g. If you Can see Plymouth, Dartmoor and the severn estuary on Level 3 then all of that should be incorperated

Far more complex diplomacy system, e.g. Denmark would no just Spontainiously attack Britain if they had an alliance, it would ally with say France, wait for Britain to attack france then slowly break ff from britain.

Just my thoughts...anyone agree?

[Afro Thunder]

If they do make a WWI or WWII Total War game, we'd better have turns that last a shorter amount of time than 6 months. Imagine, just 12 turns and the war is already over!

[bodidley]

The effectiveness of firepower and its accuracy at varying ranges, plus the effects of cavalry and artillery, add in a splash of misconceptions, and you have some serious balancing problems for the Napoleonic era. It would be difficult to effectively simulate any game with the Total War engine in an era where seeing a target means hitting a target, so World War games are unlikely. I'm not so sure most Total War fans would take to a fantasy game, or that CA could compete with the LOTR games. An early gunpowder game, say 1450-1700, might work well with the engine. A "Shogun II" or a "Medieval II" might not be entirely out of the question either.

[IliaDN]

a WW1 total war it will be a great idea....followed as a expansion WW2...i'm bored (and i think i'm not the only one here) of these ancient and medieval total wars

IMO that is hard to do in TW style; if a good one it might be something like Panzer General - but it won't be TW than - ... maybe you just try another game .........

[RTW King]

I don't think WW One: Total War would work. If you didn't want to be accurate and sit and watch soldiers sitting in trenches, you would have 60 tanks charging the 100 enemy riflemen, or your machine gunners marching up to the enemy in formation then opening up fire on each other. As much as it would be funny, I don't think it would work on a total war engine.

[The Stranger]

yeah i'd like that but to keep the TW spirit up we should get a Thebe's total war and a Hyksos invasion followed by Neantherthaler Total war followed by a Homo Sapiens Invasion but a WWI TW would be cool. but no fantasy please

[IliaDN]

I don't think WW One: Total War would work. If you didn't want to be accurate and sit and watch soldiers sitting in trenches, you would have 60 tanks charging the 100 enemy riflemen, or your machine gunners marching up to the enemy in formation then opening up fire on each other. As much as it would be funny, I don't think it would work on a total war engine.

Agreed.

[Zawath]

It's the conquest of America for sure. That's where the Age of Empires series is going and Total War will surely follow.

[Nelson]

An early gunpowder game, say 1450-1700, might work well with the engine. A "Shogun II" or a "Medieval II" might not be entirely out of the question either.

I agree but I would push the time up to 1850 or so. Rifled weapons wouldn’t suit TW at all. Once firepower is lethal enough to inhibit mounted cavalry action, a popular aspect of the games will disappear. Anything up to the mid 19th century might work. Massed rifled musketry is the end of the line for shock. Smooth bore muskets still permit charges and melee. I’d like to see the 30 Years War, ECW era.

Wouldn't it be fun to assault or defend a Vauban style fortress using TW? How cool would that be?

Of course, an updated Shogun could never fail to please.

[The Stranger]

yeah i agree with nelson.....but i still dream of a WoWaTW

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I agree with the general "poo-pooing" of a fantasy choice.

The problem with most such games is that they degenerate into a total rock-paper-scissors model of fighting. *TW tends that way, but has just enough reality blended in to keep it from being too "perfect."

On the other hand, I'd love to see CA open up the AI to modding -- even if they forced modders to clear it through them before releasing it. I suspect that the talent pool available here, in RTR, and EB would provide a lot of value in this context.


As to another in the TW series, I think you could do: Early Gunpowder, Napoleonic, Crimean War, South American Rebellion, and even US Civil War renditions within the basic framework of the engine. While one person noted that the rifled muskets of the US civil war made cavalry pretty secondary -- true -- they still fought in formations rather than in the open order that characterized subsequent conflicts. The formation component is critical to the engine.

If you want WW2 stuff, play Advanced Squad Leader. Mastering the rules shouldn't take more than a month or two.

SF

[Crusader4thepeople]

Yeah, they should bring back Historical Campaigns, then one of them could be you acting out as Richard Sharpe fighting in the Penninsular war!

Dont forget the battles in india, then it would be the pefect historical campaign, a shame they dropped them in rome.

Anyway Napoleonic total war would be great, but theyd need to make the close combat only a last ditch effort, with the formations beeing much more important, with special formation for some factions (like the french column) or faction spanning special attack like platoon fire and the ability to name units and more officers. The only problem i could see is the unit size, if each unit is a regiment you need a unit to be up to 1000 men strong or battalions up to 500. Anyway nap TW or MTW2 would be best

[The Stranger]

and a chaos thingie were when chaos strucks people start to aim at random targets and smoke alot of smoke limiting sight and increasing own casualties

[magnum]

Napoleonic seems to me as a likely choice, but personally I'd like to see them move to a different map (Europe for the last 2.) Possibly China/Asia or India or South America.

While I would love to see a modified TW engine applied to the US Civil War, I just don't see it as a Total War game as far as it compares to the previous Total Wars. More of a start of a spin-off series that would take advantage of much of the coding and work that was done by the Total War group.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I'd like a Napoleanic Wars one...or even a North America colonization one.

[JimBob]

A game based around the Warring States in China would be cool, maybe an Islamic conquest game, centered in the Middle East, with Southern Europe, North Africa, Persia, Spain, North India, maybe even into South East Asia. 700-1100 maybe. Or a Czar total war, try to conquer Russia.

[AntiochusIII]

A game based around the Warring States in China would be cool

Seconded. Look for new TW? Look for the East!

However, may be there are more periods than the warring states to choose from. I don't want this to become the game of Qin-conquer-like-that-bloody-cheating-(snip)-Rome-of-this-TW. Besides, we needs the Mongols! At least in an expansion, that is. I mean, the Huns are replacing the Mongols in BI for now but really, it's a CA tradition of sort...

All major Chinese dynasties have periods of full-scale war followed their fall. The Zhou gradually declined into the Warring States; the legendary Qin empire fell sharply and a civil war between the rebel forces saw Liu Bang rises as the new emperor of imperial China; The Western Han period had been interrupted by a temporary fall and universal chaos, until the dynasty restored its grip; the Eastern Han's fall brought out the famous Three Kingdoms period - followed by centuries of chaos until the rise of the Sui/Tang dynasty and the height of Chinese culture. The age of the Five Dynasties, Ten States followed the Tang and precedes the Song. The Song didn't even establish themselves completely. The age, a cultural and technological flowering as it was, had never seen complete peace; the Jin dynasty (not exactly Chinese, but..) took over Northern Song only to be replaced by the Mongols, who ended all. Well, after that it's inconvenient for TW engine to do.

And somebody said Chinese history was quite peaceful. :-P

A supreme dynasty rose and fell and followed by Total War followed by another supreme dynasty forged out of the blood and iron.

Besides, where else would you get a proper Mongol Invasion expansion pack to follow the full game?

[IliaDN]

Fantasy is not bad idea, but IMO TW will lose some it's historical fans.

[HarunTaiwan]

China or Age of Discovery...this could even be world-wide to include China.

Great apsect of this age is rapdid tech progress.

[Muska Burnt]

i said it before ill say it again i want to see sctw....south central total war and the expansion biggie invasion