Refinery Outages and Gas

[Gawain of Orkeny]

This goes right nack to the hypocisy thread. For ever thirty years the left has oppossed increased drilling and new refineries or atomic powerplants. For these same amount of years those of us on the right have been saying this could happen . Well now it has . Talk about not being prepared. All these years weve been operating at the limit of what was being produced yet made no real attempt to address the issue. In fact we did all we could to facilitate the problem. Releasing the strategic oil supply wont help as the refineries cant refine it. I swear I didnt no this was going to happen when I started that thread.

How is it every gas station has jumped up 50 cents a gallon overnight? This is a supply and demand problem and always has been. The problem for the most part has been an artificial short supply. If we had built the refineries that we asked for and started drilling in the artic and off the coast we wouldnt have the problems we have today. But of course its all Bush's and the conservatives fault.

This is not directed at you Red I know you didnt bring politics into this.

[Red Harvest]

Yes, it does go back to hypocrisy, but not like you think. Where would you put a refinery? The oil is offshore. You are going to build anything new along the coast if you build it. And in fact, that is where capacity is being added. The refineries inland where the oil is depleted have mostly shut down or are not expanded.

So your are looking at a few regions along coasts doing the bulk of the refining and will still be if new ones are built. If any one of these regions takes a major hit, supply will be cut. That's how "market efficiencies" tend to work, gigantism and infrastructure is favored over dispersed production.

I will also point out Gawain, that refineries have not been the limit (until the storm) because crude prices and gas are *now* moving idependently. They were not before, which is economic proof of what I was saying. I'm not sure of the percentage of refining that is out (on a bbl/day basis) but is looks like over 10% to me.

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

At least you can take solace in the fact that you still only pay about half as much as us Europeans.

[Aenlic]

For ever thirty years the left has oppossed increased drilling and new refineries or atomic powerplants. For these same amount of years those of us on the right have been saying this could happen .

What, exactly, does nuclear power have to do with a current gasoline shortage? Or drilling for that matter? Nothing. The only part of your statement that has any relevance to the issue was the part about refining capacity. And I agree with you on that part. You also failed to mention that the left has been screaming about the need for conservation and sensible consumption and reducing demand all that time as well. And the right has been sticking their collective head in the sand and ignoring the whole issue of consumption. Typical of supply-sider insanity, I suppose.

Do you suppose, thinking about it just a little, that the fact that this country consumes more than twice what it produces has anything at all to do with the problem? That we consume more than three times more than the next highest oil consumer? That if we lowered our demand to just the same as the next highest consumer, then we'd actually produce a 25% surplus and be able to export oil and have a positive trade surplus?

Nah. It's much easier to blame it all on supply of oil. After all, the oil companies make their profits from our consumption, not our conservation.