This is just ridicolous

[Zarax]

The pic is self-explanatory:



The king did not gain a vice in battle, after that he gained 1 command and 1 dread (swift justice).
Don't mind the troops, I was just doing some quick rebel mop-up

[ToranagaSama]

Your point is unclear.

What I note is the whippy General. What's up with the -2 Valour??? w/o losing a single bodyguard?

[Zarax]

That was the point... That, and the subsequent assault (with no losses!) made me see pretty much everything can happen in MTW.

That's the most surprising campaign I've ever played...

[Ironside]

That was the point... That, and the subsequent assault (with no losses!) made me see pretty much everything can happen in MTW.

That's the most surprising campaign I've ever played...

Did he have 8 valour in the beginning of the battle?

[Del Arroyo]

Maybe he was given demerits for running down the poor fleeing routers???? Maybe this is not chivalrous????????

Very weird.

[Zarax]

Did he have 8 valour in the beginning of the battle?

Exactly, I ca't really figure how it happened..

[Budwise]

I KNOW I KNOW. When you get a vice after battle, it still goes into effect DURING BATTLE. Don't quote me but doesn't SWIFT JUSTICE GIVE YOU A NEGATIVE VICE for either moral or valor. I dunno which. Well, it will go into effect the second you push that KILL CAPTIVES button.

If I am wrong, than I don't get it either - this is all I came up with.

[Budwise]

OH OH OH, I GET IT - your screwing with us. I BET YOU HIT THE ROUT BUTTON WITH YOUR GENERAL DURING THE BATTLE. If you hit that button, you still get the negative vice (Good Runner -3) but you will get a +1 for the kills you got with your general. SO THEREFORE AT THE END OF THE BATTLE, YOUR GENERAL WILL HAVE A -2 FOR VALOR!!!!!!

[Zarax]

OH OH OH, I GET IT - your screwing with us. I BET YOU HIT THE ROUT BUTTON WITH YOUR GENERAL DURING THE BATTLE. If you hit that button, you still get the negative vice (Good Runner -3) but you will get a +1 for the kills you got with your general. SO THEREFORE AT THE END OF THE BATTLE, YOUR GENERAL WILL HAVE A -2 FOR VALOR!!!!!!

No, the only thing I really did was withdrawing the artillery (NOT routing) once they exhausted all ammo, plus I didn't kill the prisoners in battle but after it.

[Del Arroyo]

I bet Noraku sucked his soul and made it part of his own...

[Budwise]

No, the only thing I really did was withdrawing the artillery (NOT routing) once they exhausted all ammo, plus I didn't kill the prisoners in battle but after it.

Could you please check and see if hes a good runner. It may be a fluke but I wouldn't doubt if it gave it to you without routing. I think this has happened to me once or twice.

I found that it doesn't matter unless you kill them AFTER you see the stat screen that you posted.

[Zarax]

As I stated in the first post, after the battle he gained swift justice and 1 command, with no other vices.

[Budwise]

As I stated in the first post, after the battle he gained swift justice and 1 command, with no other vices.

Yeah, I read that - but I thought you might have missed it. Sorry

[Zarax]

Yeah, I read that - but I thought you might have missed it. Sorry

No problem

Anyways, loosing 2 valour didn't seem to hurt him, as he made an excellent performance in the following castle assault (will post about it later)

[antisocialmunky]

That sometimes happens for some strange reason. It's probably a bug with the recomputing of valour gained.

[ToranagaSama]

Never seen such a thing happen in all my years playing Total War.

You sure you didn't Rout him by mistake or something.

Do you have a REplay?

@budwise

I found that it doesn't matter unless you kill them AFTER you see the stat screen that you posted.

Am I mistaking your meaning? It doesn't matter if you kill the Captured during the battle or after, you still get the +dread.

The thing is that, if killed during the battle, I *believe* it will have effect *during* the battle.

Need to give your General a little boost in effect? Got a couple hundred *captured*? Kill em!! So, the theory goes....

[Zarax]

Never seen such a thing happen in all my years playing Total War.

You sure you didn't Rout him by mistake or something.

Do you have a REplay?

Unfortunately I don't have a replay, however he lost the 2 valour points just before the end battle screen appeare...

[dgfred]

Never seen such a thing happen in all my years playing Total War.

You sure you didn't Rout him by mistake or something.

Do you have a REplay?

@budwise



Am I mistaking your meaning? It doesn't matter if you kill the Captured during the battle or after, you still get the +dread.

The thing is that, if killed during the battle, I *believe* it will have effect *during* the battle.

Need to give your General a little boost in effect? Got a couple hundred *captured*? Kill em!! So, the theory goes....

My theory is to kill them during the battle to freak their army out, I don't
know if it really has any effect though .

[Knight Templar]

Have you maybe checked logfile of the battle?

[antisocialmunky]

Never seen such a thing happen in all my years playing Total War.

I see it on a regular basis with my super high level royalty.

With the King, or your Doge in this instance, I think it's sometimes has to do with the extra men that get autospawned for the king. Their valour gets reaveraged after the battle and a few valour points are taken off because the spawned guard is spawned with less valour.

[EatYerGreens]

Have you maybe checked logfile of the battle?

I was going to recommend this myself but I don't mind being beaten to the wire.

What I'd suggest looking for is to see if you can find the record for the unit(s) you sent him to attack and find out if any men in that unit (most likely the unit leader carrying a vice) had negative valour at the start of the battle.

It could be a glitch in the 'valour transference' thing, whereby it has added the valour of a man killed to that of whoever killed him (likely your king himself) but it has added a negative value. Ouch!

I think a.s.m.'s post is closer to the mark, or it could be a combination of both.

If you can't find anything special about the log for the unit your king attacked, then maybe paste the section covering your king's unit into a reply, so we can pick over it. It should contain columns showing 'pre-battle valour' and 'post-battle valour', which should be revealing, particularly with regard to v0 respawned bodyguards.

[Patron]

Photoshop!!!!

[ToranagaSama]

I see it on a regular basis with my super high level royalty.

With the King, or your Doge in this instance, I think it's sometimes has to do with the extra men that get autospawned for the king. Their valour gets reaveraged after the battle and a few valour points are taken off because the spawned guard is spawned with less valour.

Houston, I think we have a problem....

What version of MTW are you playing?

I forget which, but *respawning bodyguard* went out with either one of the patches or VI itself.

@budwise

What version are you playing?

---

My theory is to kill them during the battle to freak their army out, I don't know if it really has any effect though

Doesn't it say something to that effect in the manual? Pretty sure that's the official word. Probably won't help in a losing battle, but *may* help in a winning battle. Causing the battle to end quicker and thereby you'll suffer fewer losses and kill more of the enemy as they flee from your dreaded presense.

[Zarax]

Thanks for the answers, now I've got a noobish question: Where are the logfiles? are they active by default?

[EatYerGreens]

Thanks for the answers, now I've got a noobish question: Where are the logfiles? are they active by default?

Probably not active by default. Knowing how useful they are, from STW days, they were one of the first things I activated before starting my first MTW campaign.

At the Opening Menu, go to Options and it's the tickbox at bottom of the page.

They are only generated for proper tactical map battles, not autocalc ones.
You'll find them in a folder called 'Logfiles', which is visible in the MTW root directory (your filepath to the MTW root folder may vary).

You will also get logfiles generated for multiplayer battles which are an immense help in post-match analysis of who had what units and which upgrades etc, particularly with the aid of a logfile reader to do the summarizing for you. However, the nitty gritty detail I'm hinting at can only be found by reading the full-length file itself.

Helpfully, the name structure is either "campaign 09-17-05 0924.txt" or "internet_multi 09-17-05 1027.txt" or "custom <timestamp>.txt" and so on, so they sort into neat batches.

The logfile only records the filename of the MAP used for the fight, not which province it was, so the timestamp in the filename comes into its own as a memory jogger in telling them apart. Give me a week or two and I'll have completely forgotten though.

[EatYerGreens]

Houston, I think we have a problem....

What version of MTW are you playing?

I forget which, but *respawning bodyguard* went out with either one of the patches or VI itself.

I'm playing v2.01 and I've seen the faction leader's bodyguard regenerate but only by a handful of men (3 or 4) per turn. Princes and ex-royal general's bodyguards definitely do not regenerate, so they do have to be retrained.

Incidentally, the CA notes in the VI readme address a specific problem whereby an early RK unit undergoing retraining in the year where you transition to High (or High to Late) used to cause the unit to disappear completely, so it seems this issue was well known to many. Now they emerge with a full retinue and a change to the correct unit type for the new era.

[Budwise]

I'm playing v2.01 and I've seen the faction leader's bodyguard regenerate but only by a handful of men (3 or 4) per turn. Princes and ex-royal general's bodyguards definitely do not regenerate, so they do have to be retrained.

Incidentally, the CA notes in the VI readme address a specific problem whereby an early RK unit undergoing retraining in the year where you transition to High (or High to Late) used to cause the unit to disappear completely, so it seems this issue was well known to many. Now they emerge with a full retinue and a change to the correct unit type for the new era.

Hold on there, I had a king that I wanted to kill off for the British and every battle, he would run away alone and I would end up with 4 or 5 Royal Knights when the next turn started. I think it has to be the ruler that gets more. I hated that EXCOMMED King. Stupid king thought he could take out the Danes in a turn and he was wrong. Its not my fault, I told him he couldn't do it with 3 knights but he didn't listen.

[ToranagaSama]

I'm playing v2.01 and I've seen the faction leader's bodyguard regenerate but only by a handful of men (3 or 4) per turn. Princes and ex-royal general's bodyguards definitely do not regenerate, so they do have to be retrained.

Right, I forgot about that. Hmmm....I wonder if -green_generals slows this process down? In any event, by habit i never wait for respawning to occur. I usually take men from my other Knight units to meld with the King. Even more than than, I only occaisonally engage my King in battle. Consequently, I'd forgotten ALL about "respawning", duh!

Incidentally, the CA notes in the VI readme address a specific problem whereby an early RK unit undergoing retraining in the year where you transition to High (or High to Late) used to cause the unit to disappear completely, so it seems this issue was well known to many. Now they emerge with a full retinue and a change to the correct unit type for the new era.

This must be rather rare. I don't recall it occuring, and if it had been to any real degree, the whinning would have gone on and on, and on. I recall a LOT of whinning, but not about this.

I must say that your enthusiasm for the game is quite impressive. Sorta reminids me of me back when MTW was new....