Social Peace

**Ser Clegane** · 09-14-2005, 20:06

Originally Posted by Watchman

In a ridiculously country armed to the teeth

Are you talking about a "ridiculous country, ermed to the teeth" or a "country, ridiculously armed to the teeth"?
Just asking as I would consider the first one a tad offensive...

Otherwise I think you are painting an exaggerated picture here. It seems you are taking parts of the country (e.g., inner cities) and project what you find on the country as a whole.

BTW, just for my understanding, what do you mean by "functional illiteracy rates"?

**BDC** · 09-14-2005, 20:10

Lots of people are illiterate here.

But they aren't immigrants or denied education or anything. They're just lazy.

So probably not a very good example.

**Watchman** · 09-14-2005, 20:31

Eh, forgot a word from there for some reason. Brain fart. Insert "rich" after "ridiculously", and it'll make a lot more sense.

Have you ever been to the United States, Watchman?

Nope. Haven't had a reason. I'm working on comparative statistics, witness statements, broad currents accumulated from various sources, and good old-fashioned deduction here. Why do you ask ?
(And the sarcastic little prick inside me inquires if I would need to travel to Muslim countries to know the treatment of women over there sucks, too ?)

Otherwise I think you are painting an exaggerated picture here. It seems you are taking parts of the country (e.g., inner cities) and project what you find on the country as a whole.

Well, naturally. I'm not about to start comparing New York and East Lubbock, TX, here, nor am I by any stretch of imagination qualified to. What'd be the point ? The US of A is a big place. Anyway, as far as I'm concerned in modern states the equation is "city = about everything". Cities are where the majority of people live and work. Cities are what civilizations live and die by. Cities are where developements happen, and also where the frictions and problems of societies tend to be most starkly visible.

"Functional illiteracy", as far as I understand the term, means being either unable or unwilling to read, regardless of what your literacy level officially is. Put this way: if the sports section of the newspaper is the just about only thing you ever read, then you're essentially "functionally illiterate".

**PanzerJaeger** · 09-14-2005, 20:41

Have you ever been to the United States, Watchman?

Nope.

That make sense. You did not portray the America I live in accurately at all. I am sitting in my house, in a big city, with my doors unlocked and my guns in the safe.

It seems you have taken the problems of the inner city and applied it to America, which doesnt surprise me considering some European media.

Come visit, its not that dangerous. Just stay out of the ghetto.

Oh, and plenty of people read.. lol.

**Watchman** · 09-14-2005, 21:02

*shrug* Good for you. But might I point out it's not the better cases that are the concern, but the worse ? It's rather a small consolation for the inhabitants of the next burned-out "wretched hive of scum and villainy" of a ghetto over that you live in a safe area.

Besides, the thanks for the image go to a far greater extent to the American media...

**Meneldil** · 09-14-2005, 21:10

Originally Posted by PanzerJager

That make sense. You did not portray the America I live in accurately at all. I am sitting in my house, in a big city, with my doors unlocked and my guns in the safe.

Sounds weird, with all the pro gun people here saying they're ready to use their guns to shot every single people stupid enough to ring at their door, or that gun is the only way to protect your freedom (huhu). It would almost sound like there were a dangerous gang of socialist native-afro-latinos in every street of the US

**Watchman** · 09-14-2005, 21:26

That's one thing I've also noticed whenever I debate guns with American pro-gun types. Even besides the rhetoric, what their arguments to a large degree seem to convey between the lines is a palpable sense of fear. *Maybe* they're just trying to present the American society as more crime- and violence-ridden than it actually is to help justify gun ownership, but I somewhat doubt it - that basic idea gets too much flank support from too many unconnected sources to be dismissed so easily.

Plus the well-documented prisoners-per-capita ratio has to be an indication of something...

**PanzerJaeger** · 09-14-2005, 21:33

Sounds weird, with all the pro gun people here saying they're ready to use their guns to shot every single people stupid enough to ring at their door, or that gun is the only way to protect your freedom (huhu). It would almost sound like there were a dangerous gang of socialist native-afro-latinos in every street of the US

Who is saying that?

Europeans seem to feel they are more "worldly" or well read about the rest of the world, but the common perceptions they hold about the US do not back that up. They can only thank the media for the vast, and sometimes outrageous, misconceptions they hold.

Come visit! Its not as you believe it to be. I can almost guarantee you wont be shot at...

**yesdachi** · 09-14-2005, 21:40

Originally Posted by PanzerJager

That make sense. You did not portray the America I live in accurately at all. I am sitting in my house, in a big city, with my doors unlocked and my guns in the safe.

It seems you have taken the problems of the inner city and applied it to America, which doesnt surprise me considering some European media.

Come visit, its not that dangerous. Just stay out of the ghetto.

Oh, and plenty of people read.. lol.

Hey Watchman, PJ makes some really good points.

The majority of the population of the US comes from small to medium sized towns, the big cities are where all the action is and get lots of media but most of us live in boring “little” cities and our ghettos are nothing more than a few blocks of low income housing. I never have to use my gun to suppress the gangbangers so I can drive my MadMax style car thru an urban wasteland to get to work

.

As far as reading goes, how many copies of Harry Potter were sold in the first 24 hours in the US?

You make some good observations, Watchman, but they really don’t apply to the whole of the US only the 1 or 2 cities in about 40 of the 50 states.

The US is a BIG country and very diverse from city to suburb to boonies. I think you would find a visit pretty interesting.

**Watchman** · 09-14-2005, 22:01

Let me put it this way: after Katrina gangs of armed looters became such a problem the National Guard had to be sent in to suppress them so the relief operations could be carried out unhindered.

What, exactly, does that tell you about the country in general ? I can assure you we don't get those kinds of problems around here after natural disasters...

**yesdachi** · 09-14-2005, 22:10

@ Divinus Arma – way to make the best of a tough situation.

Life has not been peaches and cream for me either but I made a personal choice to move out of the dead end town I graduated HS from and go make something of my life. I went into debt up to my neck but it has been worth it.

The choices I made are the same ones anyone could have made regardless of race or financial situation (it actually would have been slightly better to have been poorer, more financial aid available to lower income people for college). Some people choose to stay in a crappy life because they lack your mentioned a-e.

The only people I feel bad for in the US are mental handicapped; we do a poor job of helping them. But anyone else can get a job, there are job finding and training services that are free all over the country, and do something with their lives. There are lots of ways for people to make serious changes in their lives, mentoring programs, big brothers big sisters and the military are all totally easy ways that are very available. I am not sure how to fix some of the social issues we have but I am 100% comfortable saying people can get away from them if they want.

Anyway, cheers for making yours a better life.