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Thread: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

  1. #1

    Default Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    This is the result of replaying a test done back in February in multiplayer of 4 cataphract units abreast (54 men each) frontally charging (using alt to switch to secondary weapon) 4 silver shield pikemen units (121 men each) in a battleline 8 men deep on flat ground. No upgrades were applied to the units.

    With RTW v1.2 the cataphracts won killing 413 pikemen and loosing 97 catpahracts.
    With RTW v1.3 the cataphracts lost killing 51 pikemen and loosing 170 cataphracts.

    It's a dramatic difference to say the least, and I thank Jerome and Intrepid Sidekick for fixing this issue because I think it's important to the gameplay. In RTW v1.3, many cav now die upon contact with the pikes, and the pike units maintain higher morale since they didn't take heavy losses.
    Last edited by Puzz3D; 09-30-2005 at 22:53.

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  2. #2
    Humanist Senior Member A.Saturnus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Very good. Are their stats the same? I would like to know what precisely changed. Is it alone the charge that´s different now?

  3. #3

    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    The charge stat is lowered, but the game mechanics of jumping and charge bonus were also changed.

    RTW version, unit, charge/attack/defend = (armor factor + skill + shield)

    RTW v1.2, cataphract, 15/7/23 = (18 + 5 + 0)
    RTW v1.3, cataphract, 09/7/23 = (18 + 5 + 0)

    RTW v1.2, silver shield pikemen, 7/10/14 = (6 + 6 + 2)
    RTW v1.3, silver shield pikeman, 4/10/14 = (6 + 6 + 2)

    _________Designed to match Original STW gameplay.


    Beta 8 + Beta 8.1 patch + New Maps + Sound add-on + Castles 2

  4. #4
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Not only that but included in the BI descr file you will find a new attribute for the spear called, now brace yourself, 'spear'. That means the unit will have increased resistance to charges to the front when it is cavalry.
    The question is just if it applies to RTW as well, because the filechanges are not visible in the RTW version. But given these results I think so.

    Jumping horses are still in (I falsely claimed otherwise), but it is extremely rare now, and I have yet to see it in a head on charge.
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  5. #5
    Ja mata, TosaInu Forum Administrator edyzmedieval's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Thanks for the test Puzz.

    Finally they fixed the idiotic thing. I lost many battles with Macedon against Brutii, because Brutii had many Equites. They always charged on to my Hoplites and Levy Pikemen, and I always lost.

    Once, I had 2 units of Levy Pikemen. 240 pikemen. Destroyed by 108 Equites. Lost about 100 Pikemen, and they lost about 40 Equites. Damn!
    Ja mata, TosaInu. You will forever be remembered.

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  6. #6
    Provost Senior Member Nelson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    This is excellent news. I need to run out and get BI.
    Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like bananas.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Well, strictly speaking no, you´d just have to adjust the values in the export_unit file.
    As for the "spear" attribute, that exists in plain Rome as well, just whether the Silver Shield pikes have one I don´t know.

  8. #8
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciaran
    Well, strictly speaking no, you´d just have to adjust the values in the export_unit file.
    As for the "spear" attribute, that exists in plain Rome as well, just whether the Silver Shield pikes have one I don´t know.
    Yeah... It is there, it is just not mentioned in the explaination. Rejoice all yee complainers.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  9. #9
    Senior Member Senior Member econ21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Quote Originally Posted by Ciaran
    Well, strictly speaking no, you´d just have to adjust the values in the export_unit file.
    It sounded from the answer to Saturnus's question that the relevant values have not been adjusted - the changes are hard coded and so you do need BI (or the putative patch).

  10. #10
    One of the Undutchables Member The Stranger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    wehjoo...is there a 1.3 patch ...where can i get it...it might make me reinstal RTW

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  11. #11
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cataphracts vs Silver Shield Pikemen

    Quote Originally Posted by The Stranger
    wehjoo...is there a 1.3 patch ...where can i get it...it might make me reinstal RTW
    Not out just yet... Could be that CA is looking at fixing a few BI issues as well, or they simply want people to buy BI when they hear how much better the game is. Yup, the business can be cynical.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


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