oh no... is it really this easy?

[parcelt]

Ok, I just edited the title to reflect the fact that I now seem to be appropriately crushed - as it should be - after starting a new WRE campaign. The financial problems faced by that faction are not as bad as they seem: consolidate your holdings and disband most of those 300+/turn upkeep garrison troops, and your boats. Build some peasants instead (As a sidenote: a good Ironman rule would be not to allow that. Greatly increases WRE's difficulty as you get hammered between a need for garrisons to quell unrests, yet cannot afford them. I am currently restricting myself to 1 peasant unit per city).

But even if that makes your financial problems go away (I made 1k-2k after turn 4), it leaves you weakened. And unlike in my previous campaign, now the hordes hit in full force. It was the Gothes that killed my best remaining troops (remaining after the purging of turn 1, reminded me a bit of what Stalin did right before WWII.... but I'm digressing), after I was so stupid to meet them in the field instead of hiding behind my walls. There is now almost nothing left between them and Rome itself.... great!

I think all this is further proof of the point made above - that BI contains a very high degree of randomness. I am not sure yet whether this in the end will be a good or bad thing: may improve longevity of the game, but can also sometimes lead to boring campaigns. Time (and playing a hell of a lot of campaigns!) will tell.

[Malcolm Big Head]

Randomness

Perhaps I should try the sarmatians again to see If I can hold my initial homeland. Last time the huns sent me packing and when I settled in a rebel territory I realized that I should have scouted the area better because the vandals wanted to stop in for a drink.

[TinCow]

The best way I've found to deal with the Horde stacks is to engage them in night battles in the field. Letting them siege you is dangerous if you can't beat them in a sally, since their multiple stacks can renew the siege before you can repair and refit even if you do beat them. Engaging them in the field without night battles is dangerous since they usually cluster so closely that you have to fight at least two stacks at a time. Thus, attack a night and eliminate on stack at a time.

[Geoffrey S]

An awful lot of people seem to be having easy first campaigns; is there a chance CA built in some kind of difficulty increase after, say, two started campaigns? It just strikes me a lot of people say their first campaigns are walkovers, then start a new one and get thrashed.

Of course, it could just as easily be the random nature of the hordes.

[Kraxis]

An awful lot of people seem to be having easy first campaigns; is there a chance CA built in some kind of difficulty increase after, say, two started campaigns? It just strikes me a lot of people say their first campaigns are walkovers, then start a new one and get thrashed.

Of course, it could just as easily be the random nature of the hordes.

Most people that have a nice campaign don't say much, they just love to play it. Those that experiences a bad one will of course come here to vent their sadness. I believe it is the random factor playing in.

[Conqueror]

Well I just got started on my first campaign (Sassanids). I've only played for a few years, so not far into the game yet. My faction starts in a location where there aren't any barbarians nearby, only the ERE, and I got my back comfortably secured by the map edge to boot. The ERE hasn't attacked me yet and I'm not strong enough to attack them either, so it's been just skirmishes with pesky rebels so far. But those romans are massing their troops near my borders, so I guess it's just a matter of time now. They even made peace with Sarmatians and haven't been attacked by barbarians yet making me their sole enemy for the time being.

[GFX707]

Randomness

Perhaps I should try the sarmatians again to see If I can hold my initial homeland. Last time the huns sent me packing and when I settled in a rebel territory I realized that I should have scouted the area better because the vandals wanted to stop in for a drink.

My first campaign was as the Sarmatians....after thinking it was going to be just like RTW Vanilla I started building up my initial city, ignoring the warnings about the Hun hordes (couldn't see anything on my map after all) and before I knew it there were 6 stacks sieging my city! With only a wooden stockade I managed to hold out for around 10 turns and with my half-stack that was defending the city I must have taken out 2 full stacks....I will tell you though I was pretty impressed with the sheer amount of troops they sent (my first battle was a night battle with 3 full Hun stacks on the map!!!!) and soon I was overwhelmed....uh oh, I thought, game over....but then I got my own horde! Foolishly I used it to fight the Huns in the field (although I eventually beat them) and on bridges and wasted a lot of troops instead of heading West....and I ended up with 2 settlements, one stone walled city (Sirmium) and that other Sarmatae one (Campus Sarmatae I think it was called) and I couldn't get out of debt and had full ERE stacks sieging me every turn....

My second campaign (as Sarmatia again) has gone much more smoothly....I simply uprooted first turn and went straight for Constantinople which I took, then lost, then took again and now (in a cunningly synchronised "settling" maneouvre with which I used 3 horde stacks to take 3 cities at once) I have added a few walled cities to my fledgling nation.....I suppose hindsight like that is cheating though :(

[Garvanko]

I tried posting this on the Franks Guide thread, but the thread doesn't work for some reason. Mods?

Wow! My franks campaign has turned into a real dogfight. The Saxons have been throwing stack after stack at me with no end in sight, and all their armies have units full of 6xp infantry and sea raiders. Battles have been fun, but the balance has been tipped by my newly acquired noble cavalry and heerben infantry.

The Lombardi have broken alliance and attacked Vikus Franki. Full stack. My garrison is full of 3xp peasants, so I hope it can hold in case they attack next turn before my big army can arrive to support.

toggle_fow has revealed a roman empire crumbling in the face of huge vandal and hunnic hordes. The ERE has been kicked off Greece, and are heavily involved in a murder-death-kill scrap with the Sassanids. The WRE can't seem to stop the tide of Berbers, Vandals and just about everyone else. Indeed, all the barbarian factions seem to be doing well and expanding, which should make the later game very interesting. The Vandals look like they'll be passing my way in about ten years. Unfortunately, Im piss-poor, and in no proper shape to take them on alongside the Saxons, WRE and the Lombardi.

Bring it on.

[Garvanko]

That was three hours ago..

Bring it on indeed.

Im a horde now. Lost everything in a sea of rioting, assassinations, multiple attacks on my eastern frontier, and sheer bloody-mindedness. The WRE are back, the Huns and Vandals are rampant, the Lombardi are a growing menace...

And me?

Dear oh dear.

Some said this was easy???

[Kraxis]

I thought my ERE campaign was winding down, now well past 400. I had broken the back of the Sassanids by taking Ctesiphon. I actually suffered a defection of one of my best generals (and governors), one day he simply didn't return to the settlement after an anti-rebel campaign, taking with him the entire army. Now I can see him and a single unit of mercenaries trot by the now weak city of Hatra as a rebel himself. I would kill the lousy traitor if I could!

I was planning to invade the WRE, concentrating an army near Sirmium of forces collected from Dacia, Salona and Sirmium, plus a few from Constantinople (general coming from there).
But as fate would have it, I don't think the invasion will happen for the next ten years, if at all.
The Huns had settled down and become peaceful in Campus Iazyges, but they were then thrown out by a revolt. For some reason they took their hordes and began a mighty trek westwards, and just as they were leaving, the Burgundii ousted the Franks from their last city, far to the east. They then popped out near Campus Iazyges, and teh next turn the Lombardii were also kicked out by the Burgundii (they are becoming rather strong and has a fairly large empire). They are also heading for Campus Iazyges, but a few of their stacks are heading for the Sarmatian city (which was passed over when the Vandals and Huns went by), so now I can expect another horde on my doorstep.

I guess it was my luck that I was planning to invade the WRE and have a strong army ready, but I fear it will never be enough if they don't fight over Campus Iazyges and march on me.

[frogbeastegg]

A question for any kindly CA person passing through, who can spare the time to answer, please.

Is there anything the player can do to ...encourage the AI to take an aggressive line towards the player, as opposed to a more passive one?

For example (many more details, if you want them, can be found here, starting from post number 65) I've started two games as the Saxons, both very hard/medium. The first I was practically ignored; no armies, diplomats, anything came my way, and I was able to expand without opposition. The second, oh how I love my second attempt at the Saxons! The WRE attacked me on turn 4, and has been sending sizeable, well-composed armies my way frequently. My barbarian neighbours are fighting each other and eying my lands in a way which leaves me no doubt they intend to invade. I am very literally fighting for survival with everything I have, and I fear I might be defeated, something I have not felt before in RTW. The odd thing is that I did virtually nothing different in either campaign, until the AI forced me to.

In fact the two campaigns are so different I can hardly believe it's exactly the same game.

So, while I can see myself appreciating the random factor of BI when I've played enough to really see it in action, I would also like to have many more campaigns like my second Saxon one. Is there anything I can do to make that more likely? This second game is ... hmm, it's pretty well everything I want from the game: challenge, unpredictability, a need to work hard, needing to react instead of simply act, a real need to plan carefully and then plan again as my old plans get scuppered by the AI. The thought of not finding another campaign like it really worries me. That first game was almost everything I don't want: easy, boring, challengeless, pervaded by the feeling I was the only faction actually 'present' in the game.

As I play I have this feeling I might not get another game like it, but will instead end up with more like my first one, and that's the only damper on my second Saxon campaign. Well, that and a complete lack of time to play, gah!

I'm really very anxious; I hate the thought of losing the game I'm currently loving.

Amphibian conscience demands I add that the first game might have improved if given another 20ish turns, making 40 turns total. But I only get to play for a few hours each week, often a turn at a time, so those 40ish turns before things get interesting last for a very long time. At which point I lose interest; I’d rather write, read, something, anything, than putter about in that boring, isolated world, night after night, week after week. The lively world of my second game, however, now that has me eating my porridge in front of the PC, and has left me rushing to get to work on time two mornings in a row now. The only reason it won’t be three mornings in a row is that I have tomorrow off.

Or as I find myself posting on a rather frequent basis while relating my second Saxon game: Weeee!

[nameless]

I dunno about easy, I'm playing as the WRE on M/M.

The cities that were about to revolt I pulled out the troops and razed the buildings so when they revolted it was easy to smash and loot the money Any general that had a low loyalty rate I sent into suicidal missions.

I pulled out of England, Illyria, Africa and Gaul. I strengthened by position in Spain because of the gold and silver mines there and it is in a good position for a contingency plan if Rome falls. I disbanded most of my elite troops in favor of the liminate spearmen, Foedetira cavalry, and archers and stationed a small force at the bridge leading into the mainland of Italy with 4 generals.

Mediloam, or the city that is above the bridge in Italy is my "throw-away" city in the event a horde runs by.

All islands I am keeping in line easily. For the time being I started to convert my cities into christian except for Syracuse which would need a large garrison to keep them from revolting so I left them as pagans and built sewers and such to keep them happy.

Later on I started to get at least 3-5K thanks to the gold in Spain and keeping Massila and the nearby city to allow trade between the two provinces.

Then the hordes came, 4 stacks of GOTH hordes assaulted my bridge defenders, outnumbered but I was able to defeat them one at a time. I noticed that if I take out the general their morale falls down like mad and their easy pickings. I basically pulled my troops from the bridge so their out of range from their many horse archers and allowed them to cross the bridge enough for me to flank and surround them. I defeated 3 of the stacks and the GOTHS eventually sat down with me and negotiated with me for peace, they had lost at least 5-6 family members Their remaining stack picked up and headed into france by passing through Massila and then assault the WRE rebels and settled there in Gaul.

I was notified of a Vandal horde coming my way so I quickly rebuilt my forces and being short on cavalry I hired a few mercenaries. I also noticed my general had a loyalty of 1 now because of his many victories(I'm beginning to wonder what's the point of having a general if his victories make him less loyal to me) so I sent him to die against 6 vandal hordes. Using the same tactic of pulling back out of their archers range I used a scorpion to cause panic in their ranks and now they are down from 6 to 2 hordes. This may sound good but I'm losing tons of men as a result of this and they just keep coming

Luckily though the tactic preserves most of my cavalry which is crucial in smashing the enemy's flanks.

Even worse now I have 7 Hunnish hordes coming down on me so I'm planning on building a fort to keep them busy while I replenish my forces. Argh. If this was on H/H I would've been dead by now!

[Jambo]

frog, I'd say stick with every campaign, no matter how easy it may appear to be at the start. I thought my Alemanni campaign (VH/H) was a going to be a breeze after I raced to controlling 10+ of the WRE's settlements without much in the way of resistance. The nice thing about BI is a horde faction can really spice things up and the domino effect can cause havoc...

What then happened was a Goth horde moved through my lands and settled in the two WRE settlements on the very West and North of nowadays France. They were at war with the WRE so I thought no bother. However, their Westernmost settlement proceeded to rebel and all of a sudden the Ostrogoths appeared! Hmm, not good news, and so it proved to be... The same settlement rebelled again, this time returning to the WRE, and now I have a huge horde of Ostrogoths on my doorstep. They then proceeded to sack the 1 remaining Goth settlement thereby creating yet another horde!

Now I have 2 hordes in my lands, of which the Ostrogoths have just laid siege to my poorly defended capital. That's where I stand at the moment, with my once proud 10+ settlement empire now looking incredibly fragile...

[frogbeastegg]

Jambo, as I said:

I only get to play for a few hours each week, often a turn at a time, so those 40ish turns before things get interesting last for a very long time. At which point I lose interest; I’d rather write, read, something, anything, than putter about in that boring, isolated world, night after night, week after week.

I can't get enough time to read and write - no amount of time will ever be enough. Not to mention I also have a pet boyfriend. Every minute spent being bored in BI is a minute I could be using to far better effect, both in terms of results and enjoyment, and I know it. But my second Saxon game I don't have that feeling of waste because I am enjoying myself, I am doing something, and there is more point to it than passing time and waiting in the hopes something vaguely interesting might possibly happen.

[Bulawayo]

Frog, what you should do is to let your dear friends at the .org supply you with the best saved games they have to offer.