Horde Behaviour

[TinCow]

I have recently had an experience with the Vandal horde which has brought some questions to my mind. They came through Alemanni territory and beseiged and captured western Gaul (Bay of Biscay area) from me for their new homeland. After splitting and defeating their two remaining horde stacks over several seasons, I laid siege to the city and re-captured it, massacring the 15k population to boost my heavily depleated treasury. The Vandals instantly returned to horde status with 6.5 stacks and on the next turn moved south toward the WRE Rebel held Iberian peninsula.

My questions concern how hordes are generated and where they go. The horde appeared just north of my city the instant I captured it, before I could massacre the population. However, I was still able to enjoy the rapine of a 15k population. If the horde left before I entered the city, shouldn't I have found a nearly empty city? If they left only after the massacre, shouldn't they have had far less than 6.5 stacks? It seems wrong that I can massacre an entire city population and still have that population generate a horde.

Also, while the army that took the city is strong, it certainly cannot stand up to 6.5 stacks. The western of the two southern Gaulic cities is very near to this horde as well and lightly defended. However, the horde made no attempt to re-take the city they were generated from nor to attack my nearby settlement. Clearly they have AI requirements that make them move a certain distance before attacking. How far does this move have to be? What exactly prevents them from attacking me, e.g. time limit or distance? Are they 'banned' from attacking my entire faction for a while or only the local cities near where they were generated?

Feel free to use this thread to discuss horde behaviour beyond these questions as well. I don't expect firm answers to these things, but I thought it would be an interesting discussion.

[Doug-Thompson]

... However, the horde made no attempt to re-take the city they were generated from nor to attack my nearby settlement. Clearly they have AI requirements that make them move a certain distance before attacking.

Well, it will be interesting, all right. My second Hun campaign ended when I took the one and only city of a faction on the second move. The went into a horde and immediately beseiged their old town.

There's been a strong random element in horde behavior. If there's a pattern, it's well concealed. Be very valuable to know if there is one.

[Zatoichi]

Captain Fishpants said this and more in the thread https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...t=54966&page=2

"Hordes generally go for the richest and least defended nearby target - quite reasonable behaviour, if you think about it. However, the AI does know which regions are on its 'victory conditions' list and will aim towards those areas, given a chance."

Which sheds some light on the issue. Some of the 'inactive horde' posts I've seen could be the result of the 'donkey with 2 carrots' scenario, whereby they can't establish which target meets the above requirements when they have an equal choice.

Or it could be something else entirely!

[TinCow]

Captain Fishpants said this and more in the thread https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...t=54966&page=2

"Hordes generally go for the richest and least defended nearby target - quite reasonable behaviour, if you think about it. However, the AI does know which regions are on its 'victory conditions' list and will aim towards those areas, given a chance."

Ah, so this theoretically creates an interesting tactic. If 'rich' is a major factor in target analysis for the horde AI, the human player should always massacre the last town to ensure that it is no longer considered 'rich' enough for the horde to besiege. They may well have ignored the town I took from them because of the decent sized (though defeatable) garrison combined with the fact that it had just been ravaged. I know that the northern-most Iberian city (WRE Rebels) has not been sacked so far in this game and is large and prosperous.

Doug, do you remember what your occupation/enslavement/etc. choice was for the city that the horde re-took from you?

[Doug-Thompson]

Doug, do you remember what your occupation/enslavement/etc. choice was for the city that the horde re-took from you?

Yes, the blue Roxalani (sp?) faction, which is just north of the Black Sea, in what would now be the Ukraine. It's directly south of the Hun starting province.

There was nowhere else for them to go, really except for some poor barbarian hovels in the wilderness.

[TinCow]

Yes, the blue Roxalani (sp?) faction, which is just north of the Black Sea, in what would now be the Ukraine. It's directly south of the Hun starting province.

There was nowhere else for them to go, really except for some poor barbarian hovels in the wilderness.

Did you occupy the city, enslave it, eradicate it or sack it? I'm trying to determine if sacking/eradication is a good method to prevent the spawned horde from simply taking the city right back.

[Kraxis]

Hordes like to go towards their victory areas, also tehy don't like to be in an area where they have been kicked out. In this case that meant they would head for Iberia (in an attempt top get to Carthage).

[Orda Khan]

As Huns, I also took the Roxolanni town. I sacked it and massacred the inhabitants. As I was also driving the Sarmatians, Vandals and Goths before me, I kept track of the Roxolanni horde because it was a threat to my rear. It moved north westerly and did some damage to the Alemanni. I was also in Alemanni territory. Roxolanni moved on to threaten the Franks, meanwhile the Alemanni attacked me ( I was neutral to them ) and were wiped out by my Huns. The Roxolanni are currently laying seige to the Franks, the Goths resettled in northern Italy and are under seige from Sarmatians and the Vandals, who settled in Campus Iaziges ( plus still some Vandal hordes ) have tried to settle an old score with me......to no avail
I am really enjoying the unpredictability the hordes have brought to the game

......Orda