Prisoners to have the right to vote

**English assassin** · 10-11-2005, 15:28

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Prisoners shouldn't be allowed to vote
Does that mean prisoners who are convicted or prisoners in detention ?
For example , anyone have any thoughts on someone like Saddam being allowed to vote ?

Well I don't know about Iraq but in the UK prisoners on remand can vote, because they haven't been convicted of anything.

**Redleg** · 10-11-2005, 15:51

Originally Posted by English assassin

Well I don't know about Iraq but in the UK prisoners on remand can vote, because they haven't been convicted of anything.

Well one of the few times I watch television news - on CNN they are announcing that Iraq has ruled that Saddam and several prisoners being held but not convicted will be allowed to vote.

**Tribesman** · 10-11-2005, 16:01

on CNN they are announcing that Iraq has ruled that Saddam and several prisoners being held but not convicted will be allowed to vote.
Theres a word missing there Red , several "Thousand" .
Which way do you think Saddam will vote ?

**Duke Malcolm** · 10-11-2005, 17:09

So, they want prisoners to vote, and murderous ex-dictators to vote, but not the poor, demonised hereditary peers?

**Soulforged** · 10-12-2005, 05:13

Originally Posted by King Malcolm

So, they want prisoners to vote, and murderous ex-dictators to vote, but not the poor, demonised hereditary peers?

They're all in the same group, marginals. Marginalized by the rich in ancient times and mainteined that way by the capitalist regime.

**bmolsson** · 10-12-2005, 12:43

Originally Posted by Ser Clegane

I cannot quite follow this logic here - If a society goes as far as to decide to put a minority to jail - and does that just based on the trait that defines them as a minority - do you seriously think it would matter whether the members of this minority maintain theit voting rights while in jail?

If this society goes as far as putting people to jail for being member of a minority, they could just as easily decide to remove their voting rights for the very same reason.

Whether the loss of voting rights is an automatism that is linked to the jail sentence or whether the removal of voting rights is decided on in a separate act does not really make much of a difference in such a society.

Assume that the minority is a political faction or a political opinion, then you might see what I mean.

**Ser Clegane** · 10-12-2005, 13:18

Originally Posted by bmolsson

Assume that the minority is a political faction or a political opinion, then you might see what I mean.

Well - if you go as far as throwing people into jail for their political opinion, I think you are way past the point of having to worry whether prisoners should be allowed to vote or not.

**Arcanum** · 10-12-2005, 13:20

bmolsson: I agree to a very small level, I do not think that any state or country would be able to simply block a minority, political faction or standing that is not against the law just from the beginning, at least not without severe problems internationally and nationally. But there surely might be cases in which single persons are put to jail for beeing in a minority that is potentially against a certain political party...

Ehm, anyway, I do not think that prisoners in general should be allowed to vote, neither would I allow individual prisoners to vote, simply because it complexes the system unnecessarily.

When they are over with their jail time, then they are free to vote, but allowing single prisoners via private estimation of psychologists or because of just minor criminal actions - for which they wouldn't be sent to jail - to vote, is against my ignorant understanding.

Feel free to take me out.

**therother** · 10-13-2005, 01:04

You can find the Judgement here. Interesting reading, if you filter out all the legalese; there is plenty of stuff in there for both sides of the argument.

On the issue of stripping all inmates of the vote, regardless of the duration of their sentence (with a few exceptions like contempt of court or non-payment of fines), I think the Government is on very dodgy ground. Given that roughly 50% of the prison populace are there for 4 years or less, it would seem that automatically stripping such people of the vote is unfair and anomalous, e.g. someone sentenced to 3 months on mid-February 2005 for a petty offence didn't get to vote in the General election, but someone who committed the same offence, but was sentenced a few days earlier, did. Also someone who sentenced for a more serious crime in September 2001 and received a sentence of 3.5 years, did not lose the right to vote in any GE.

**Xiahou** · 10-13-2005, 01:17

Originally Posted by Ser Clegane

Well - if you go as far as throwing people into jail for their political opinion, I think you are way past the point of having to worry whether prisoners should be allowed to vote or not.

Ever feel like you're talking to yourself?

I made that point on page 2, and I see this is your second attempt- that line of argument is just silly, as you've pointed out.

**bmolsson** · 10-14-2005, 03:24

Originally Posted by Ser Clegane

Well - if you go as far as throwing people into jail for their political opinion, I think you are way past the point of having to worry whether prisoners should be allowed to vote or not.

Assume we have a law against drinking alcohol. The younger generation is against this law and drink anyway. All youngsters caught are arrested, punished and have their voting rights removed.
A referandum is announced to determine if the law to drink alcohol is to be abolished or not. The alcohol drinkers are not permitted to participate.
Democracy doesn't work anymore.

Simple actually. Stop thinking Stalin and Ayatollah in all democratic issues....