WW2 German allies at the eastern front

[Franconicus]

Does anaybody have information about non German troops fighting the Soviets in WW2. I know that there was

Hungarians
Romanians
Italians
Finish

a Spanish division (=Blue Division?)
French troops
SS troops with soldiers from the Balticum
volunteers from the SU (Russian and non-Russian)

Does anybody have more details about numbers and where they fought?

[Kagemusha]

Franc,What would you like to know about the Finish troops?

[InsaneApache]

Was'n't Bulgaria in there as well?

[Kagemusha]

Ok.Lets sttart with the numbers.
Finnish Army in start of the continuation war(that is how we call it in Finland).

16 Divisions(16 348 each)
and 3 brigades
1829 artillery pieces
235 planes
total of 475 000 soldiers
all personnel included 630 000 people
16% of the whole population.

ammo for 50 days
war material for industry for 2-6 months spending.

Also there was one volunteer Battalion In Waffen SS division Viking 1200 men.

[Adrian II]

Does anaybody have information about non German troops fighting the Soviets in WW2. (..) Does anybody have more details about numbers and where they fought?

About 20.000 Dutchmen served in the Waffen-SS on the Eastern Front. In 1940 Hitler had given the order to constitute a 'Germanic' division of the Waffen-SS named 'Wiking' in which non-German Aryans would fight side by side like 'brothers'. Within this division the Dutch were given their own regiment (Standarte) named 'Westland'. They were later reinforced with a volunteer legion, the Freiwilligen Legion 'Niederlande', who were sent to fight (and mostly die, as they should) at the Leningrad front.

After 'Leningrad', most of the remaining Dutchmen were regrouped in the 23rd SS-Freiwilligen-Panzer-Grenadier-Division 'Nederland', and a smaller number were regrouped into the 34th SS-Panzer-Grenadiere 'Landstorm Nederland'.

Most of the survivors ended up among the 10.000 Dutch military collaborators detained immediately after the war. They were released in the early 1950's, but they had lost their citizenship. Some joined the Foreign Legion, others regained their citizenship by fighting with the Dutch contingent in Korea (1950-54).

[Meneldil]

I think around 7.000 french served in "La Légion des Volontaires Français contre le Bolchevisme", created in 1941. Most of them were killed by the soviets in 1944, and the Legion was then replaced by the well known "Division Charlemagne".

[Franconicus]

Meneldil, do you know where they fought?
kagemusha, I guess the Finish fought only in the North, right?
InsaneApache, never heard of Bulgarians fighting with Germans.

What about the Russian volunteers? What about the Hungarian and Romanian?

[Kraxis]

About 15,000 Danish volouteers also joined up. I'm not suer where they went, but supposedly they were primarely members of SS Wiking. Obviously they didn't all join up at once.

[Adrian II]

What about the Russian volunteers?

Take a look at this article about Russian volunteers. The whole Pipes-site is good: you will find many details there, as well as references to books and articles.

[Meneldil]

Well, Bulgarians were - if I recall correctly - the 2nd most numerous allies of the German of the Eastern Front.

Most Russians who fought with the Germans were people from Belarus or Ukraine (I've read the were sometimes called White Russians, dunno if this mean they're ethnically different from the common Russians, or if this was a meant to make a distinction between them and the 'red russians'). They also served as guard in labor, concentration and extermination camps I think.

Dunno where the French fought at first, but they got crushed in Pomerania in 1944. The Division Charlemagne then fought in France and in Germany (some men were still alive during the Battle of Berlin).

[InsaneApache]

Early in the war, King Boris pursued a strict policy of neutrality, not engaging in any alliance with one of the powers. In 1940, Rumania gave in to Germany's and Russia's pressure and ceded territory; in this context, Rumania ceded the SOUTHERN DOBRUDJA to Bulgaria in the TREATY OF CRAIOVA on September 7th 1940.
In April 1941 it was no longer possible for Bulgaria to stay neutral. Bulgaria entered an alliance with Germany and joined in the occupation of Yugoslavia and Greece - Bulgarian troops occupied much of Serb-held MACEDONIA and Greek WESTERN THRACE. King Boris maintained that the Bulgarians were prepared to fight alongside the Germans, but not against the Russians (Bulgaria owed it's independence to the Russians, and sentiment was very pro-Russian). Bulgarian troops were not to be deployed outside the Balkans peninsula.
As the war progressed, Bulgarian troops had to take over occupation duties in previously German-occupied regions of Yugoslavia and Greece, to free German units for the eastern front.
When German officials in 1943 pressed for the deportation of Bulgaria's Jews, the Jewish population of the occupied territories was deported and dealt with; when it came to the Jewish population of Bulgaria proper, public opinion was against it; the Bulgarian church and their King rejected the German demand; Bulgaria's Jewish community, which was interned, was not handed over to the Germans; it survived the war. King Boris died in 1943, succeeded by his son SIMEON, a minor. A REGENCY COUNCIL was formed.
In 1944 Bulgaria's situation became critical as the Red Army closed in. Bulgaria cautiously moved away from it's German Alliance toward neutrality - the country was technically not at war with the Soviet Union. On August 17th Prime Minister BAGRYANOV declared neutrality. Bulgarian forces disarmed the German forces in the country; the USSR was not prepareed to respect Bulgaria's neutrality. On September 8th, Bulgaria declared war on Germany, now as a Soviet ally, with a new government - Bagryanov had resigned. Bulgaria had managed to transfer from a German to a Soviet alliance without a German occupation. Bulgarian forces accompanied Soviet forces on their further campaign, until Germany surrendered.
In fact, Bulgaria's post-war fate had been decided at Yalta, when Churchill suggested to partition eastern Europe into Soviet, American and British spheres of interested.
Formally an Allied Control Commission Bulgaria was established; in fact, the British and Americans left that to the Soviets, spending little attention on Bulgaria.

http://www.zum.de/whkmla/region/balk...gariawwii.html

I knew they were allied with Germany but these guys were outstanding in their successful diplomacy. I'm impressed.

[Kagemusha]

Yes they all except the volunteer battalion of SS Wiking,fought in the North.Here is a map,how the troops were deployed in the start of the war.

We should always remember that Finland fought its own war Allied to Germans and Finlands goal was to retake the land lost in Winter War.For example Finland rejected all actions against Leningrad and its only supply route Lake Ladoga,while her troops were only ten kilometers away from Leningrad when the Attack phase ended.Exeption from this was the German Mountain army and XXXVI Army who attacked Murmansk from Lappland The Finnish IIIrd Army was under those troops and also made the best progress in the area,almost cutting the Strategig Murmansk Rairoad,the importance of that Railroad was that Murmansk was the only over year open harbour in European Russia.But under secret orders given 30.10.1941 by Marshall Mannerheim the Commander of the whole Finnish Armies,the attack was stopped,becouse it didnt serve the best intrests of Finland.

[nokhor]

i know more about the political reasons for the nations joining the axis powers than troop strengths.

i know the hungarians joined to a) fight communism and b) to prevent the romanians having a too strong association with the germans. since all felt the germans would determine the future geographic boundaries in the balkans. but the hungarians were also led at the time by an admiral of a landlocked country who was simultaneously a regent of an abolished monarchy.

i know for most of the war, the germans had to supress the romanian fascists, because the germans used them as leverage against the romanian gov't. [ if you don't what we like, we'll have these guys take over your country.] and the germans felt they could get more political mileage out of a weak monarchy than out of a stronger romanian fascist state.

[TinCow]

I would have to say that while Finland was an ally of Germany, they never really fought 'with' the Germans. Finland was an ally by virtue of a common enemy and not a whole lot more. The single largest non-German contingent on the eastern front were... anti-Stalinist Soviets, mainly from the Ukraine and Baltic states I believe.

The Finns were obviously restricted to the Soviet border regions and only really cooperated significantly with German attacks around Leningrad. The Romanians were largely restricted to operations with Army Group Center. If I remember correctly, the majority of men guarding the flanks of Stalingrad were Romanians. This was one of the significant reasons why the encirclement succeeded... the non-German troops could not hold back the Soviet attack long enough.

Other than Finland and Romania, I do not believe that any other foreign force fought on the eastern front as a cohesive military force with its own command and control structure. French, Danish, Spanish, etc. volunteers, along with the mass of Soviet conscripts/volunteers were all incorporated into the German chain of command and used largely as fodder.

There was even a British contingent fighting on the eastern front called the Legion of St. George (aka Britisches Frei-Korps). It was recruited from amongst rabidly anti-communist British POWs by John Amery, son of an MP. This was an extremely small group (something like 30 men at its peak) and it specifically only fought the Soviets. Like the others though, they were simply yet another unit in the German Army.

[Kraxis]

I believe the Hungarians had their own units on the Eastern Front, and they suffered the highest casualties in %.

[Franconicus]

....But under secret orders given 30.10.1941 by Marshall Mannerheim the Commander of the whole Finnish Armies,the attack was stopped,becouse it didnt serve the best intrests of Finland.

So this is the reason why Germany did not win

Tin Cow: Other than Finland and Romania, I do not believe that any other foreign force fought on the eastern front as a cohesive military force with its own command and control structure.
What about the Italians. As far as I know they fought in the south too. Did they try to cover the German flank at Stalingrad too?

[Kraxis]

So this is the reason why Germany did not win

Tin Cow: Other than Finland and Romania, I do not believe that any other foreign force fought on the eastern front as a cohesive military force with its own command and control structure.
What about the Italians. As far as I know they fought in the south too. Did they try to cover the German flank at Stalingrad too?

Indeed... But after this they were retired to protect their own lands.

[Franconicus]

... and failed!

[TinCow]

A quick fact check showed that the majority of non-German troops protecting the flanks at Stalingrad were Romanian, with a signficant contingent of Italian and Hungarian troops as well. The Romanians largely held the Don south of Stalingrad with the Italians and Hungarians north of it. This is info from a 30 second google search though, I don't have access to the books I trust while at work. If there are still questions about this when I get home later tonight I will post something more concrete.

I must correct my earlier statement though, the Romanians were attached to Army Group South, not Center. To be fair to the non-German troops, they were very poorly supported, equipt and trained. The failings of these forces was more the fault of the Germans who did not care about improving them. I do not believe that any comparative lack of bravely was fundamental to the situation and I think that they are often the undeserved target for scorn by military historians. You get from troops what you put into them. You cannot expect poorly trained conscripts with obsolete equipment to perform like an SS Panzer division.

[English assassin]

I would have to say that while Finland was an ally of Germany, they never really fought 'with' the Germans. Finland was an ally by virtue of a common enemy and not a whole lot more.

Technically (and I am agreeing with you) Finland was not an ally of Germany, she was a "co-belligerent" against the soviet union. There was no alliance of any sort.

[Krusader]

SS-Wiking had many Norwegians & Danes & Swedes as well.

Serbia had a Serbian Volunteer Corps (Srpska Dobrovoljacki Korpus) which at the end of 1944 was transfered to the Waffen-SS. No mention of where they served.

25 July 1941 the Spanish Blue Division became the 250th Infantry Division in the Wehrmacht. It had 18.000 men and sustained 12.776 casualties and was withdrawn from the front in October 1943.
From November 1943 a Spanish 'Blue' Legion was engaged fighting partisans in the northern sector of the Eastern Front.
There were also five Spanish Air Force squadrons serving in Army Group Center.

Slovakia placed a light brigade of 3500 men under German command during Operation Barbarossa. In July 1941 the Slovaks had 40.393 men, 1346 officers, 2011 motor vehicles and 695 lorries under German command on the Eastern Front.

The Italian Expeditonary Corps was commanded by General Zingales and was in 1942 attached to the German 17th Army.

Bulgarian troops was mainly used for garrison duties it seems.

If you want more detailed info, I can find it.

[Franconicus]

I must correct my earlier statement though, the Romanians were attached to Army Group South, not Center. To be fair to the non-German troops, they were very poorly supported, equipt and trained. The failings of these forces was more the fault of the Germans who did not care about improving them. I do not believe that any comparative lack of bravely was fundamental to the situation and I think that they are often the undeserved target for scorn by military historians. You get from troops what you put into them. You cannot expect poorly trained conscripts with obsolete equipment to perform like an SS Panzer division.

Didn't the Romanians serve well by the invasion of Crimea. I guess Stalingrad desaster had several reasons. Mainly the line was too lond and nobody expected an attack. So it was more a fault of the German leaders.

From what I know the SS had not a very good training. There was a lot of fitness and of course only the strongest were taken (at least in the beginning). But the military training was not comparable to the common soldiers. However they had superior equipment, bigger units and a brave spirit. They did not give mercy and new they could not expect mercy. The losses of the SS were very high, too high for well trained soldiers.

[Franconicus]

Was'n't Bulgaria in there as well?

No! Although Bulgaria was allied with the Germans they never declared war to the Soviet. German troops were at Bulgaria but Bulgarian troops never attacked the Russians. However, they declared war against GB and the US
When Germany was about to loose they broke the alliance. They tried to make peace with GB and the US. As this failed they declared the end of their war involvement. German troops had to withdraw from Greece. As the Russians came closer Bulgaria even declared war at Germany. But the Soviets could not be put off and declared war at Bulg. So for a few days Bulgaria was at war with both Germany and Russia. 8 days later the Soviets took Sofia.

[master of the puppets]

In poland there was massive amounts of resistance to the nazis the largest in the war yet when the russians defeated the germans the resistance did not see this as a new peace or freedom, the resistance was redoubled and brought against the russians, unfortunatly most of the few resistors died during these 2 occupations there memory and sacrifice will live on cause i'm proud to be polish .

[Kääpäkorven Konsuli]

From what I know the SS had not a very good training. There was a lot of fitness and of course only the strongest were taken (at least in the beginning). But the military training was not comparable to the common soldiers. However they had superior equipment, bigger units and a brave spirit. They did not give mercy and new they could not expect mercy. The losses of the SS were very high, too high for well trained soldiers.

I wouln't say that their training was poor but different. I mean SS troops were almost always the spearhead of the charge, they were trained to stay only 70-100 meters away from artillery parage, their officers had "follow me" leading style and that kind of little things. They were assault troops if you understand what I mean.

And you should remember that there was two parts in SS: Wester SS and Easter SS. Wester SS Divisions like Das Reich and Wiking were elite and at the last years of war they served as Germany's "fire brigade". Hitler sent them wherever the need was greatest.
More numerous Easter SS was far from elite and seldom better than nothing.

[ShadesPanther]

IIRC Romania captured Odessa and served quite well with Army Group South.

They Guarded the Flanks at Stalingrad along with Hungarian and Italian troops. The Italians were placed between the Romanians and hungarians because they well disliked each other.
They ran from the Soviet Army during Operation Uranus becuase they didn't really have any anti tank weapons and so ran just like the Allies did in 1940.

[Kääpäkorven Konsuli]

Technically (and I am agreeing with you) Finland was not an ally of Germany, she was a "co-belligerent" against the soviet union. There was no alliance of any sort.

But practically Finland was ally of Germany. Yes there was no alliance agreement, but in 1940 Finland allowed germans troops to travel across her lands to Norway.
And Germany saved Finland many times from Soviet occupation

Main reason why Soviet Union had to end the Winter War was threat of France and Britain. But after occupation of France Britain was alone against Germany so there was no threat anymore from west. But Hitler made it clear to Molotov that Finland was under Germany's protection.

During continuation war german troops formed the bulk of defence in norther finland. And finns would't have survived in 1944 when soviets started their massive assault whitout weapons and troops they got from germany.

although patriots keep saying "Finland was not ally of Germany, they were brothers in arms and Finland had own war" the fact is that Finland was supporting third reich, empire of evil as somebody calls it. So if Germany was evil, Finland was evil too.

Sorry about my english, it is difficult to me explain complicated things like this.

Jag har talat

[Fragony]

I think that Finland was more at war with Russia then it was allied with germany. When you defend you take all the help you can get, that is what I would do.

[Tribesman]

http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/war/war.html
A good Finnish site .

[Adrian II]

http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/war/war.html
A good Finnish site .

What about Irishmen fighting on the Eastern front?