Most challenging BI faction

[Tyrac]

What do you feel is the most challenging faction to play from both the locked and unlocked factions?

I just bought BI and went right into WRE VH/VH and the challenge of it has been a very nice improvement over the original RTW. A big thumbs up so far!

[Mouzafphaerre]

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How about Berbers?
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[Drusus Magnus]

I actually found the ERE more difficult than the WRE. When playing the ERE, all the hordes seemed to come my way. Goths, Sarmatians, Vandals, Huns, hell even the Roxolani sent a stack my way. Have to fight off all of that while raising an army to keep the Sassanids from sieging your eastern cities and fight the ERER at the same time. So for me the most difficult faction would be the ERE. When I played the WRE the most challenging part was the Frankish Horde when I took their capital.

[TinCow]

I think it varies a great deal, which is what makes BI great. All factions but the Berbers and Celts can get nailed bigtime by the hordes and those two have their own problems.

[dismal]

H/H Huns campaign - Pretty easy. Learned some lessons about life as a horde.

VH/VH Vandals campaign - Very easy. Applied lessons learned.

VH/VH Saxons campaign has been very difficult.

I think I have turned the corner now with 10 settlements and a solid economy, but it looked bad for a long time.

I had 3 settlements, one of which got sieged by the WRE and one of which got sieged by the Burgundians almost every turn, plus the English channel is filthy with pirates. This went on for decades. Managed a few attempts to go on the offensive, but my underpowered armies tended to get pounded out in the open.

I finally managed to slip a few guys over to Londinium and take it to get some cashflow going. A few turns after that, I took Ebaracum and triggered the emergence of the insanely upgraded Romano-British. Since I extinguished them, I've been able to afford good troops and expand.

[Viking]

After playing WRE, Sassanids, Vandals, Franks and Allemanni, the WRE was the way most difficult and Allemanni the way easiest. I would imagine Berbers being the most difficult because of their poor unit rooster, although I haven`t tried them yet.

[Betito]

How about sarmatia? they gotta move real quick, with the vandals and huns already as a horde, and the lombardii and roxolani eager to fight you (well, al least thats how it has been on my VH/Vh campaign).

I have had some serious troubles trying to settle my people. At the very beggining i let the vandals and huns go. Unfortunately, the huns came back and tried to finish me in the bridge near vicus sarmatae. I destroyed 3 stacks of their army, but i lost about almost a full stack on my own.

Now we(the huns and myself) are struggling ofr the control of the former goths settlements. But now im being forced to face an army full of lombardi bersekers and the rox faction leader...

I cant really complain of the harde missile troops, they do their job very well. But the infantry, on the other side, is absolutely terrible. Basically, the enemy can always count of routing them the very same second they carge them. I just cant trust them to do anything. Right now i dont know if im gonna make it on this campaign... but at least i have learned some lessons about being a horde...

Anyway, campaigns in BI are most definately way harder than RTW, and even MTW(i tell you, Expert/Expert early turks were easier than this), and that can only be a good thing.

[Ziaelas]

I enjoyed playing the Berbers, you have to build armies and take settlements really quickly because of your non-existent economy.

[Dutch_guy]

berbers are the toughest, no good economic sarting position, bad troops.

But a good challenge.

[Silver Rusher]

I don't know about the others, but the Sassanids are easy as hell especially with the Clibinarii Immortals/Cataphracts and the income that soars into orbit as soon as you take Alexandria.

I've only played proper campaigns as the Vandals, Huns and Sassanids so far (they are very fun and addictive to play as, I have played 3 full length hun campaigns already). Out of them the Vandals and Sassanids are extremely easy, but I had I little more difficulty with the huns. I'm guessing Berbers or Celts for the hardest, due to their rubbish starting situations.

[Dutch_guy]

I would say the Vadals would be harder than the Huns, not the other way around.

Why did you find the Vandals easier Silver Rusher and what was your initial approach - expansion wise - with both factions ?

[Silver Rusher]

There are two reasons why the Vandals are easier.

1) After you get rid of the crappy hordes that the Vandals have at the start, your tech tree is much better. You can get all the best cavalry units at the second stable level, and you can build ports.

2) If you take your target province in Spain first it is easier as it is a lot more poorly guarded than Italy and the area around Constantinople. Also, the Vandals only need 10 provinces whereas the Huns need 15.

[Viking]

I'm guessing Berbers or Celts for the hardest, due to their rubbish starting situations.

I`d say the Celts got a perfect starting situation: lots of sea trade, easy pickings with the Romans, take out the Romano-British wiht the Hounds of Culann and the continue your conquest on the Roman mainland.

[Furious Mental]

I'd say the hardest would be WRE. On VH with the ERE you can start making profits pretty much immediately without giving up a single province and comparatively few soldiers, although it pays to replace all those limitanei with peasants (assuming the city is somewhere safe). I tried playing as the WRE on VH several times and had to restart repeatedly simply to get the initial strategy right. Eventually I concluded that the best way to do things is to give up all the useless provinces in France, Germany and Austria-Hungary but keep those on the Mediterannean (and build ports, of course), disband most of the army, and use the remaining troops for opportunistic attacks on nearby enemies (consolidate all your forces from Sicily, Sardinia, Africa and Libya you can pretty much destroy the Berbers. Exterminate for $$$). Oh yeah, and get carriage ballistae at Rome, they're worth it. I also found the Sassanids hard the first couple of times. Then I just concentrated all my Clibinarii and Immortals and attacked Antioch. The ERE sends a big forces your way but even with all their spearmen they can be beaten. Once you take Antioch you get so mcuh money you can retrain all your cavalry immediately, and train more. The great thing about the Sassanids is their heavy cavalry is available with the 2nd or 3rd level stables, and is cheaper than the ERE's, so you can be training cataphracts long before the Romans.

[dismal]

After playing WRE, Sassanids, Vandals, Franks and Allemanni, the WRE was the way most difficult and Allemanni the way easiest.

This was on VH/VH? I have found the Allemanni to be very difficult on VH/VH, but the Vandals on VH/VH were rather easy.

[Viking]

No, it was on VH/M as I dislike the morale bonuses the AI get and that sea battles are hopeless, especially now with all these dang pirates.

If you 'blitz' the Romans the very first turns you`ll earn great amounts of money, and you`ll have completed the campaign in no-time, though it might be bit harder on VH/VH.

[dismal]

though it might be bit harder on VH/VH.

Yeah, I think a bit.

Generally harder to pull off a blitz while your army is running for the hills.

[Viking]

You got the schiltron formation to prevent that from happen.... plus berserkers. I might give Allemanni a try on VH/VH, but I still think it`s going to be easy.

[professorspatula]

Alemanni is probably easy if you are aggressive early on and take risks, but when I played them on H/H, I just found myself in a long stale-mate with the Romans and it was years before I broke the deadlock and could take the town south of the Alemanni capital, and several years before taking the one further south. Every move to take a settlement was countered for such a long time. Once I had 3 settlements, I then ended up being the buffer between the hordes sacking most of western Europe and also the resilent WRE. Progress was incredibly slow. At times it reminded me of the early part of the original RTW Numidian campaign, but not quite as desperate.

As to most challenging faction, it is probably those Berbers when their infantry is rubbish compared to the other factions.

[Tyrac]

Well it looks like the general consensus is the berbers in BI just as it was generally the Numidians in Vanilla RTW.

I have turned the corner in my VH/VH WRE compaign and it is pretty clear to see at this point it is all just a matter of time. The Rebels are almost all retaken from Spain to Gaul and africa is back in my control and 3 different hordes have been eliminated or reduced to a small stack of generals hiding from the legions. So now it is just about building full stacks in rome and smashing stuff. Usually where I start to lose interest. I am thinking about restarting WRE with a few more hard core self imposed restrictions. Mainly I was thinking about not allowing my self any exterminations at all with enslavement being the most radical thing I could do. Not being able to retake cities and exterminate them for cash should put a huge hit on restarting the WRE's economy after the disasters of the massive revolt.

Or I may go and bite the bullet and turn on the berbers and give that a whirl. :)

Also as an aside, is it just me or are the hordes really much less of a threat on the VH/VH setting because the pumped up economies of all the settled nations allows them to attrition the hordes away pretty efffectively?

[Prodigal]

How about sarmatia? they gotta move real quick, with the vandals and huns already as a horde, and the lombardii and roxolani eager to fight you (well, al least thats how it has been on my VH/Vh campaign)

Found the Sam's pretty easy on VH/VH, the Huns sent one minor stack against me which I routed, then turned horde, & went straight for Constantinople. Settled down round there & its been a doddle.

Hardest so far, (I got totally trounced) was WRE, got hit simultaneously by Huns, Goths, & Samartians, in total about 12 stacks in the same place at the same time...I hadn't upgraded any particular troop sites either.

Next ERE although after fending off one or two hordes they seemed to go for easier pickings. Could be made alot more challenging if you decided to ironman it a bit & not hold any bridges.

[econ21]

Could be made alot more challenging if you decided to ironman it a bit & not hold any bridges.

Yes, that's an interesting house rule - especially as ERE who are nicely protected against the hordes by a river. BI has seen the return of the bridge battle to an importance previously only seen in STW. Aside from prejudicing the AI, it doesn't feel historically "right". However, if you don't fight on bridges as Romans, you'll probably rely more on sieges and the AI does not seem to do much better in sieges (at least against stone walls).

[Veresov]

I don't know why everyone thinks the Berbers are difficult. The Berbers have the easiest objectives - Carthage and Egypt. Yeah, the units arent the best, but Carthage usually isn't heavily defended. Take Carthage and the income improves dramatically. Taking Egypt is a bit harder as the Persians are also looking there.

[Tyrac]

I don't know why everyone thinks the Berbers are difficult. The Berbers have the easiest objectives - Carthage and Egypt. Yeah, the units arent the best, but Carthage usually isn't heavily defended. Take Carthage and the income improves dramatically. Taking Egypt is a bit harder as the Persians are also looking there.

Well then, I think the question is what is harder the Berbers?