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Thread: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

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    Mystic Bard Member Soulforged's Avatar
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    Default Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Watching TV last night I noticed how much I didn't know of the lies that are spreaded through the whole world. But now...well let's see...First it's the monumental lie of Mother Tesera, qualified by a columnist (Hitchens) like the worst fraud of modern history. Here's a link to the complete history in various links (because there's to much lies): Mommie Dearest ; India has no reason to be grateful of mother Teresa ; Mother Teresa on Theory and Practice ; Mushroom Award: Mother Teresa. There's a lot more. I'll resume the history:
    "Mother Teresa is the worst fraud of modern history"- said Christopher Hitchens. The columnist has been studying the so called "Angel of Mercy" for a long time. The first thing atributed to mother Teresa, when someone speeks of her, is the merciful and dignified treatment that she gave to her neighbors. And it's the first and worst lie ever about her. In his convents the treatment was, at best, the same offered to cows preapered to be slaughtered. The conditions inside her institutions were detrimental of the human dignity: uncomfortable beds, a single bathroom to all the people (wich wasn't even washed from time to time), in general poor conditions of health and the worst of all, visitors of the "doomed" were not allowed!. This is a direct derivation (perhaps) of the eternal Teresa's worship to suffering. Yes to her suffering was the best way to achieve God, so the people that were already suffering had to suffer more only because she wanted to. She said that the body of the poor habitating her convent should reflect the devastated body of Jesus. The other thing atributed to her is the great expenditure in favor of the poors that she did with the money that she received in form of donations. The thing is really that there's no record of any contributions of this fraud to the poors in no part of the whole world, less in India. But then where's her money? Well she spended great part of it constructing more "convents of suffering", with her name and the name of his mission "Mission of Charity" (?), yes no single moeny was spended to help the poor and cure the poverty in India, all was spended to glorify her own image.
    The last thing are the prizes that she won, of course all her defenders put the prizes above all to "clean" her image. With the Church in the worst of it's moments, i.e. officers commiting rapes, and it's image on the floor, it needed a new christian hero. The best way was to take this old bitch, and turn she in the new charity image. The prizes then came in accordance. The beatification was a logic conclussion of the all this fraud. the Pope even reduced the numbers of "miracles" so she could become a saint.
    Next there's Gandhi. There's nothing to say about his method of freedom fight or his wisdom, but was he really a saint? Of course not there's no saints, "Saint's should be presumed guilty, and proven innocent". But then where's the proof? Strangely the prooves are inside his own book. I'll make this shorter: In his book Ghandi expresses his doctrine. Part of it, as many people of his time, was directed towards intolerance. He called the africans "kaffirs" ("negros" in english, "negros" too in spanish), and inferior race, barbarians, he said that they should be treated as such, he didn't even wanted to have an african by his side, avoiding all chances of encountering one, of course this was a normal thing in his days. Next there's his sexual "problems", he was very promiscous sexualy, but besides that, he loved enemas, yes he loved to had his anus clean. If he had done that to himself only, then there was no problem, but no he wanted to clean other people's anuses, namely his female companions. Yes he forced his companions to use enemas, of course we all know why, don't we? In fact the floor could end bathed in excretation.
    Of course he was no saint, but this is only to desmithify his image. All in the name of the truth sirs. Here are some links: The myth of "Mahatma" Gandhi ; Myth of Mohandas; Enema usage and other things; Mohandas the eccentric; The Gandhi that few know.
    And last, but no least, the allmighty Dalai Lama, wow even Richard Gere follows him he must have something!!!. The truth is NO, he has not the best phylosophy, if you want phylosophers go and read some books, the old ones, those are real phylosophy. As all we know the Dalai Lama is the top of the food chain, at least he was there before China invaded his precious Utopia. All people stangely support his policies, many don't understand that helping him to recover his grounds will be replacing an evil, for a worst evil. In the community of the Tibet, long ago, the people were forced to live and die mantaining the precious lives of the "high class". Speaking bad or looking bad to the allmighty Dalai Lama meant certain death, they tortured the poor wretch, the punishment were from extirping eye balls to decapitations. Of course all the people lived in slavery. China has improved the things a lot, besides it's depotics views of society. But returning the land to this myth will cause worst real problems, the Tibet will fall again under the grasp of another tyrant, worst than any other modern state. But even the states had been helping the man, with money of course, wich is of unknown destiny. The premise is basic, "the enemy of my enemy is my friend", that's how the USA wants to assure an advantage (strategic perhaps) over China, by recovering the Tibet and instaurating a base there, already pacted with the all peaceful Dalai Lama, wich ironically sais no to violence, lies and cheating...
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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Which is quotes?
    Which is your opinion?

    I'm not sure if you are outraged or in agreement?
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
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    Chief Sniffer Senior Member ichi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    But when will the Org look to debunk the myths surrounding our saints, Gawain, Pindar, and that ichi guy.

    When?

    ichi
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    Probably Drunk Member Reverend Joe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    I can tell you that the book you are taking Ghandi's ideas from represents a younger Ghandi, who was still militant at the time. I am not saying he was perfect- but he was still one of the best nonviolent leaders in history.

    By any chance, has the Revolutionary Communist Youths Brigade opened up a wing in Buenos Ares? I met those guys once; they are real marxists, and as such, I hate them. But this sounds like their kind of nutjob rhetoric.

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    Mystic Bard Member Soulforged's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio
    Which is quotes?
    Which is your opinion?
    I'm not sure if you are outraged or in agreement?
    No of them are opinions, all are facts, resumed with my words of course. Sorry if I let my words tell a little about myself too, but I think I didn't commited that mistake now. Of course I'm not in agreement, this is all outrageus, mainly the Teresa subject, it's a pretty damn tenacious image between the common folk you know. I was just trying to post other's people works to desmithify all this people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zorba (or should I say meatwad~;)
    I can tell you that the book you are taking Ghandi's ideas from represents a younger Ghandi, who was still militant at the time. I am not saying he was perfect- but he was still one of the best nonviolent leaders in history.
    I didn't say that. Again if you read one of the links I gave (the one called Myth of Mohandas) you'll see the entire history. Again I like Gandhi's phylosophies, beyond it's clears eccentricism, but I was just trying to bring down the saint, or to tell truth.
    By any chance, has the Revolutionary Communist Youths Brigade opened up a wing in Buenos Ares? I met those guys once; they are real marxists, and as such, I hate them. But this sounds like their kind of nutjob rhetoric.
    Here exist a lot of communist movements, wich identify themselves with Guevara, though many of them are just members-instruments for the heads of the movement, who are the really ones enghlighted with communist theory. One of them is simply called PC (Partido Comunista). I accept that you don't understand marxist, in fact the theory protrayed in his Manifesto, and in various quotes of other books, are flawed, but communism in general takes a principle that is acceptable, more than capitalism (for another discussion). Nutjob rhetoric? What do you mean? To tell you the truth I like only two shows of TV, wich are the only two that I watch regularily, "Penn&Teller's: ********" and "Family Guy", of course I extracted this information from the first, so no the ideas are out there, mainly investigated by unbiased journalists. This is mainly of course work of atheists, if that's what worries you, and liberals or left-wingers (category that I don't like), wich are in better place to leave all the faith behind and see reality by what it's. The works done over both, mother Teresa and the Dalai Lama, were made by american investigators, one of them quotes in my previous post. The work made of Gandhi, if mainly a product of the same indians investigators. All the words posted are words that came out of the same program, not my creations.
    Born On The Flames

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    Arena Senior Member Crazed Rabbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Anybody calling Mother Teresa a 'female dog' had better not do it where I can hear it.

    And let me get this straight: you don't agree with hitchen's article on Mother Teresa?

    Crazed Rabbit
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    Mystic Bard Member Soulforged's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit
    Anybody calling Mother Teresa a 'female dog' had better not do it where I can hear it.

    And let me get this straight: you don't agree with hitchen's article on Mother Teresa?
    How many times I've to say "I AGREE WITH HITCHEN'S", because hitchens sais the truth: that's Mother Teresa was a sadomasiquist, at the best...
    Born On The Flames

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    Robot Unicorn Member Kekvit Irae's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Isnt it Saint Theresa now, or did the Church not canonize her yet?

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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Is there a need to refer to her as a sadist and a bitch?

    I don't think there is a place here in the Org to attack people. Attack the idealogy or their actions.

    Attacking the person is not on, and in the case of such extreme claims one would have to use a less biased source.
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
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    Mystic Bard Member Soulforged's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Papewaio
    Is there a need to refer to her as a sadist and a bitch?
    People get the picture best this way. In any case I didn't know that there was a rule against words like bitch, or directed towards third parties non-patrons, unless mother Teresa is a patron.
    I don't think there is a place here in the Org to attack people. Attack the idealogy or their actions.
    I'm attacking her actions.
    Attacking the person is not on, and in the case of such extreme claims one would have to use a less biased source.
    Less biased? Please give me one...All this sources that I gave are from diferent procedence, and all defend the facts, it's not my opinion is what really happened. Again no part of the statements are my creations, even the ones that appear to be opinions were said in the show.

    I know that many people want to see Teresa as an idol, a saint, the truth is that nobody is perfect. But Teresa...well the actions speak by themselves. Of course when it involves "saints", heros or idols, it's difficult to wipe away faith and see reality.
    Born On The Flames

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    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Soulforged
    I know that many people want to see Teresa as an idol, a saint, the truth is that nobody is perfect. But Teresa...well the actions speak by themselves. Of course when it involves "saints", heros or idols, it's difficult to wipe away faith and see reality.
    Or to see thru propaganda and smear campaigns perhaps? That's certainly what all of your links that I've looked at are.
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    Senior Member Senior Member Ser Clegane's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Soulforged
    People get the picture best this way. In any case I didn't know that there was a rule against words like bitch, or directed towards third parties non-patrons, unless mother Teresa is a patron.
    I'm attacking her actions.
    I disagree - by calling her a "bitch" you are attacking the person, not the action.
    I think the majority of people here are pretty much capable of understanding criticism (or "getting the picture") without you having to resort to a kind of lnaguage that is not a appreciated here.

    Criticizing "heros" is OK - merely slandering them (and calling somebody "old bitch" is slander) gives the impression that you have to resort to offending people to get attention for the point you are trying to make.

    I expect a more civilized approach to such topics

    Thanks

    Ser Clegane

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    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Put it this way... if you are going to kill sacred cows you had better be making some really good steak...
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
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    Master of Few Words Senior Member KukriKhan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by kekvitirae
    Isnt it Saint Theresa now, or did the Church not canonize her yet?
    Not yet. Currently she is "Blessed Theresa", one notch below sainthood. I guess they await the 'miracles test'.

    And the anti-Theresa crowd is in fine company http://www.newkerala.com/news.php?ac...lnews&id=52388 (Warning: 'Bad' language alluded to at the link)
    How does Sharon Osborne even have a opinion on the matter? Oh wait...she's married to a rockstar, right? That 'splains it.
    Be well. Do good. Keep in touch.

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    Member Senior Member Proletariat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    So from this we can deduce that in Soul's world Che Guevara > Mother Theresa.


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    Ambiguous Member Byzantine Prince's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Proletariat
    So from this we can deduce that in Soul's world Che Guevara > Mother Theresa.

    LOL, more like Che Guevara > Jesus

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    Member Senior Member Proletariat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    ...Che Guevara > Nietzche...?


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    Ambiguous Member Byzantine Prince's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    GAH!

    You pwned me.

    But why does soul hate nietzsche?
    Last edited by Byzantine Prince; 11-16-2005 at 14:46.

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    Clan Takiyama Senior Member R'as al Ghul's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    I do remember that the German press published some pieces on Mother Theresa after her death.
    According to these articles, the majority of the donated money she received
    was directly given to the Vatican, instead of flowing into her charity-projects.
    It was perceived as betrayal by many of the donators, who had no idea
    that they weren't helping to improve situations in India but filling the accounts of the Vatican bank.
    Last edited by R'as al Ghul; 11-16-2005 at 14:50. Reason: spelling

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    Member Senior Member Proletariat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Byzantine Prince
    But why does soul hate nietzsche?
    Because he's not Che?

    (Now I've been owned. *sigh*)

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    Member Member Mumu Champion Prodigal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    I really can't be bothered to read all of your first post of horrified outrage, but I would be interested in how it is you think Mother T managed to make a life in the slumbs of Calcutta worse for people. I mean, "toilets seldom cleaned". Have you ever been there? Have you even the faintest idea what conditions are like for some people there today let alone when she started knocking about.

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    RIP Tosa, my trolling end now Senior Member Devastatin Dave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Christopher Hitchens likes to argue different points. He was completely against the first Gulf War but supported this one. i believe he is very intelligent and writes things such as this to see a different angle. Does he really believe this, I don't know but who really knows. I think he's just stirring some curry on this one.
    Maybe we should give him an honorary membership to the Backroom, he'd fit right in!!!
    RIP Tosa

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    Senior Member Senior Member Ser Clegane's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Prodigal
    I mean, "toilets seldom cleaned". Have you ever been there? Have you even the faintest idea what conditions are like for some people there today let alone when she started knocking about.
    Indeed - I thought the "uncomfortable beds" to be a bit strange as well...

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    karoshi Senior Member solypsist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    awesome post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Devastatin Dave
    Christopher Hitchens likes to argue different points. He was completely against the first Gulf War but supported this one. i believe he is very intelligent and writes things such as this to see a different angle. Does he really believe this, I don't know but who really knows. I think he's just stirring some curry on this one.
    Maybe we should give him an honorary membership to the Backroom, he'd fit right in!!!

  25. #25
    RIP Tosa, my trolling end now Senior Member Devastatin Dave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by solypsist
    awesome post.
    I have my moments, and yes, they are very rare!!!
    RIP Tosa

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    Arena Senior Member Crazed Rabbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    How many times I've to say "I AGREE WITH HITCHEN'S", because hitchens sais the truth: that's Mother Teresa was a sadomasiquist, at the best...
    Well that tells me all I ever need to know about you.

    Crazed Rabbit
    Ja Mata, Tosa.

    The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter – all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement! - William Pitt the Elder

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    RIP Tosa, my trolling end now Senior Member Devastatin Dave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by Soulforged
    How many times I've to say "I AGREE WITH HITCHEN'S", because hitchens sais the truth: that's Mother Teresa was a sadomasiquist, at the best...
    So then are you saying your agree with him about the current war as well, or are you just being sarcastic? I'm a little confused. Could you clarify it for a ignorant gringo such as myself could understand?
    RIP Tosa

  28. #28

    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Hey Soulforged, it's very healthy to challenge and de-construct myths, but have you deconstructed any myths of the "Partido Comunista" or Che Guevara's life yet?

    I would tend to believe you are an Atheist when it comes to these three figures or religions, but are you not the most dogmatic fundamentalist fanatic when it comes to Che Guevara?

  29. #29
    A very, very Senior Member Adrian II's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    I wish you would refrain from invective such as ‘bitch’ which only demonstrates your poor command of the subject. She certainly represented the ugly side of Catholic charity, the one that loves poverty instead of the poor, as Hitchens states so well. But unclean toilets in Calcutta? Please, show me a clean one.

    Why not let Hitchens do the talking? He points out inconsistencies (an understatement, really) in her views and charitative work, some of which are no doubt the result of her poor upbringing and primitive surroundings, others of the profound obscurantism cultivated by parts of the Catholic Church and by the former Pope in particular. I hear John Paul and Mother Teresa got on like a thurible on fire. Hence her speedy beatification.
    The bloody trouble is we are only alive when we’re half dead trying to get a paragraph right. - Paul Scott

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    RIP Tosa, my trolling end now Senior Member Devastatin Dave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mother Teresa, Gandhi, Dalai Lama? Please...

    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianII
    the one that loves poverty instead of the poor
    You could say the same thing about most liberals as well. power to the people.
    RIP Tosa

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