u.s. military tribunals in WWII

[Hurin_Rules]

Indeed. Trials, charges, defenders... all things the detainees at Guantanamo have been denied.

[Watchman]

Isn't progress nice ?

[Red Harvest]

Indeed. Trials, charges, defenders... all things the detainees at Guantanamo have been denied.

I agree, they should be tried ASAP. They should be treated in the traditional manner, quick military tribunal and execution of those found guilty of being non-uniformed irregulars. I don't like the idea of warehousing them, creates an ongoing thorny problem. And any who were caught in error would have a chance of being released as they should be. No, they don't deserve a civilian court trial as they were captured in war zones.

If you want to keep some around because they have information or rolled on others, you can work out stays of execution, etc.

[Xiahou]

I agree, they should be tried ASAP. They should be treated in the traditional manner, quick military tribunal and execution of those found guilty of being non-uniformed irregulars. I don't like the idea of warehousing them, creates an ongoing thorny problem. And any who were caught in error would have a chance of being released as they should be. No, they don't deserve a civilian court trial as they were captured in war zones.

If you want to keep some around because they have information or rolled on others, you can work out stays of execution, etc.

Indeed, the precident is there to do just that- try and execute them all. However, I dont think that would make Gitmo critics any happier.

[Tribesman]

No, they don't deserve a civilian court trial as they were captured in war zones.
yeah right . so if someone is arrested in Gambia because they didn't have any evidence to arrest him in Britain he is captured in a war zone eh .

[Red Harvest]

No, they don't deserve a civilian court trial as they were captured in war zones.
yeah right . so if someone is arrested in Gambia because they didn't have any evidence to arrest him in Britain he is captured in a war zone eh .

Don't know what Gambia has to do with this. If they were captured as part of military operations in war zone, they are fair game. Sucks to be them.

[Adrian II]

No, they don't deserve a civilian court trial as they were captured in war zones.

That is just war propaganda.

There are dozens of detainees who were not arrested in war zones. In one of the first cases to reach an American court, this was clearly established. Idir has been deported directly from prison in Bosnia after he had been found not guilty of a terrorist plot. Heaven knows how many more innocents are being tortured in Guantanamo.

Washington Post
February 1, 2005

Judge Rules Detainee Tribunals Illegal

by Carol D. Leonnig

A federal judge ruled yesterday that the Bush administration must allow prisoners at the military prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, to contest their detention in U.S. courts, concluding that special military reviews established by the Pentagon as an alternative are illegal.

U.S. District Judge Joyce Hens Green said that the approximately 550 men held as "enemy combatants" are entitled to the advice of lawyers and to confront the evidence against them in those proceedings.

[..]

Green quoted extensively from the tribunal proceeding against Mustafa Ait Idir, 34, an Algerian living in Bosnia who was accused of plotting with others to blow up a U.S. embassy there. Idir noted that a Bosnian court found no evidence against him and repeatedly but unsuccessfully asked tribunal officials to present their evidence that he was an al Qaeda fighter. He argued he could not prove a negative, and that he would hit a person who claimed he was a terrorist in the face, which prompted the tribunal members to laugh.

The exchange "might have been truly humorous had the consequences of the detainee's 'enemy combatant' status not been so terribly serious and had the detainee's criticism of the process not been so piercingly accurate," the judge wrote.

Link

[Watchman]

And you know, assorted European nations have recently started wondering just what business exactly assorted CIA-linked passenger planes have been on when they've landed on their airfields for refueling...

[Adrian II]

And you know, assorted European nations have recently started wondering just what business exactly assorted CIA-linked passenger planes have been on when they've landed on their airfields for refueling...

We need more Spanish judges.

[Xiahou]

I suspect the SCOTUS wouldve overturned that- since the precident was set in WW2 for it by the same body. But it's moot now since the congress passed a bill allowing them 1 chance to contest their status in the DC courts- then they are left to the tribunals.

[Adrian II]

I suspect the SCOTUS wouldve overturned that- since the precident was set in WW2 for it by the same body. But it's moot now since the congress passed a bill allowing them 1 chance to contest their status in the DC courts- then they are left to the tribunals.

Possible. But Idir and other detainees were not 'caught in a war zone' as the propaganda has it.

[Xiahou]

You don't need to be caught 'in theatre' though- as the Nazi sabateurs found out. It just needs to be proven that they were agents of the enemy forces. In that respect, it may be best for federal judges to be allowed to weigh the evidence of their status- we'll see how it goes. However, if a judge found them to be unlawful combatants, would you accept their lawful execution?

[Adrian II]

However, if a judge found them to be unlawful combatants, would you accept their lawful execution?

Good question. No, I wouldn't. Those caught fighting the U.S. Army in a war theatre should be treated as prisoners of war in accordance with the Conventions and , consequently, in accordance with U.S. military law. Those caught during police operations (which is essentially what the U.S. is now doing in Afghanistan and Iraq) should be dealt with by the local authorities according to the law of the land, provided that law does not violate their basic rights (as was clearly the case with the prisoners discovered yesterday in the secret Iraqi government facility). You are either at war and treat your prisoners as prisoners of war, or you are not, in which case you treat insurgents like criminals.

[Papewaio]

You don't need to be caught 'in theatre' though- as the Nazi sabateurs found out.

It is kind of useful if a spy has been in your country... as it is rather difficult to accuse someone of being a spy when they have not been in your country.

[Red Harvest]

That is just war propaganda.

There are dozens of detainees who were not arrested in war zones. In one of the first cases to reach an American court, this was clearly established. Idir has been deported directly from prison in Bosnia after he had been found not guilty of a terrorist plot.

No, because I'm not referring to those. I'm not discussing the perhaps 10% that might be held taken from outside that zone. I'm talking about the ones in the war zones. You can talk about others if you like, it isn't relevant to my point, I'm referring to the others. This is one of the reasons I would like to keep them segregated and dealt with promptly.

[Devastatin Dave]

Alright, who the hell has hacked into Red's account, he's making sense.