Deported to the Wrong Country...

[Papewaio]

Siblings' plea for stateless brother

Relatives say they're stunned by the Australian Government's treatment of a Melbourne man they say was stripped of his residency and dumped in Serbia where he is now stateless and destitute.

Robert Jovicic says he was deported to Serbia, a country he had never before set foot in, in June 2004 despite having lived in Australia for all but two of his 38 years.

Mr Jovicic has spent the past two nights camped in sub-zero temperatures outside the Australian embassy in the Serbian capital
...

She said that, because her brother had lived in Australia since the age of two, he had always considered himself Australian and had never thought to apply for citizenship.

...

Australia's ambassador to Serbia John Oliver has raised concerns about Mr Jovicic's situation in an email to his family in Australia.

But the Immigration Department has released a statement saying Mr Jovicic had a substantial criminal record and that Mr Ruddock, when he was immigration minister, used his discretion to cancel his visa under the Migration Act.

Also he was born in France not Serbia... its all Europe.

[Byzantine Prince]

Crap like this goes on all the time. Anyone who has lived in more then two countries knows about the problems that arise out of it.

[Red Harvest]

Felt sorry for him until I got to the criminal record part of it. It seems right to deport him, but why not to France?

[bmolsson]

Doesn't he automaticall get a refugee passport for UN or something ??

[BDC]

Also he was born in France not Serbia... its all Europe.

Would you rather be stateless in Serbia or France right now...

[Red Harvest]

Would you rather be stateless in Serbia or France right now...

Tough question...did the French finally get the riots under control? Of course, he would probably do better in France in winter, as he could warm himself beside a burning car.

[Slyspy]

Would you rather be stateless in Serbia or France right now...

Errr, France every time I think.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Of course, he would probably do better in France in winter, as he could warm himself beside a burning car.

Yep. And not a snowball's chance in hell he'd get deported here, no matter how impressive his criminal record.

[KukriKhan]

If he could somehow travel to France, and produce a French birth certificate, would he be entitled to French citizenship?

Stated another way: Does being born in France automatically confer citizenship?

[Louis VI the Fat]

Hush, Kukri...

I'm not an expert, but If I'm correct nowadays in order for an appeal on the jus soli the parents need to have been residents in France for five years. Even if this were the case, he cannot now appeal for naturalization. As an adult, you need to be a resident of France and be of 'good moral character'. Neither applies.

Mr Jovicic arrived in Australia from France with his Serbian-born parents in 1968 when he was just two.

His parents could've been anything from tourists to settled immigrants. I see no reason to consider a Serbian-Australian French just because he spend two years of his early childhood in France in the 1960's, to be quite honest.

[Red Harvest]

That is a difference with the U.S. If born in the U.S. or to the parents of U.S. citizens (while overseas) you automatically have U.S. citizenship IIRC.

If he was not born in France, and his parents were Serbian citizens, then Serbia would indeed be the correct place to deport him to I believe.

Sounds like the real problem is that he effectively has no nationality. He made the problem worse by failing to behave where he was, so nobody wants him now.

[KukriKhan]

I bet the Canadians would take him. Put him to work on one of Beirut's crews.

[solypsist]

a guy doesnt spend all but two years in a country and then get deported without first getting noticed by the authorities - this is no doubt where his extensive criminal record comes in. he played the ends against the middle too many times and now has been pinched.

[el_slapper]

...which doesn't mean Serbia should have that guy as a burden. That's a complex issue.....

I'm pretty sure a child must have been resident for 5 years to get the naturalization(at the age of 18) in France. An adult MUST be resident since 5 years to be allowed to ask.

[Red Harvest]

What this points out is a huge hole in citizenship. Sounds like it is rather easy for people to never have citizenship in any country. If you aren't granted citizenship at birth, or due to your parents citizenship, then you don't really have a country at all, do you? We could end up with "hordes" wandering through europe again...

Sounds like we are going to need some sort of international agreement on how to assign the nationless types when disputes like this arrise. With nations pushing to remove birth as a citizenship criteria, this is going to get really complex.

[BDC]

What this points out is a huge hole in citizenship. Sounds like it is rather easy for people to never have citizenship in any country. If you aren't granted citizenship at birth, or due to your parents citizenship, then you don't really have a country at all, do you? We could end up with "hordes" wandering through europe again...

Sounds like we are going to need some sort of international agreement on how to assign the nationless types when disputes like this arrise. With nations pushing to remove birth as a citizenship criteria, this is going to get really complex.

Send them to those ex-Soviet republics with such a low birth rate that they are actually shrinking.

[Taffy_is_a_Taff]

aren't those ex-Soviet republics shrinking due to large scale emigration of the young and certain ethnic groups?

this will in turn bring about a huge decline in birth rate though.

[BDC]

aren't those ex-Soviet republics shrinking due to large scale emigration of the young and certain ethnic groups?

this will in turn bring about a huge decline in birth rate though.

And everyone who is left is too depressed and hopeless to bother. Yes.

So send all the stateless criminals there. They'll love you for it.

[Taffy_is_a_Taff]

Khazakstan watch out, eh BDC?

[Louis VI the Fat]

I love this story just for the fantastic irony of Australia shipping off their convicted criminals to Europe.

[Red Harvest]

I love this story just for the fantastic irony of Australia shipping off their convicted criminals to Europe.

It is pretty amusing isn't it? Should be titled, "Australia settles some old scores."

And how bad do you have to be to get kicked out of Australia? Afterall, the Aussie's have always seemed a rather frontier/rough & tumble/resourceful lot to me. (And I mean all of that in positive way, as I can relate to that better.)

[Adrian II]

And how bad do you have to be to get kicked out of Australia?

I know you are joking, but still.. some friends of mine just came back from a 2-month trip in Oz and they had a great time there. Fantastic scenery, beautiful beaches, great wildlife. People were friendly, helpful, civilised. Public spaces were large, clean, relaxed and done in good taste. The food was excellent, hotels and B&B's were top-notch.

Of course they didn't meet the proverbial Outback dweller called Bruce with a cork-rimmed hat, seventeen cousins, a 35 word vocabulary and a couple of missing teeth who hunts wild hogs from the back of his Toyota pick-up for a living.

But they are going back next year, and guess where they are going...

[Redleg]

Of course they didn't meet the proverbial Outback dweller called Bruce with a cork-rimmed hat, seventeen cousins, a 35 word vocabulary and a couple of missing teeth who hunts wild hogs from the back of his Toyota pick-up for a living.

But they are going back next year, and guess where they are going...

East Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana - and a few other places that have the same type of individual minus the cork-rimmed hat. They be wearing the old wornout baseball cap from their pee-wee days of playing baseball. With a wad of tobacco in their mouth.........

[Adrian II]

East Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana - and a few other places that have the same type of individual minus the cork-rimmed hat. They be wearing the old wornout baseball cap from their pee-wee days of playing baseball. With a wad of tobacco in their mouth.........

I know I know. I have a recollection of a village in Virginia... let me just say that most of the men there appeared to be their own fathers.

Anyway, in the United States, Virginia (oh, along with Vermont) is among my favourite places in this world for scenery, hospitality and food. Not that I have lived there, but I have been around.

That rugged Lake Virginia, oh my...

[Proletariat]

I know I know. I have a recollection of a village in Virginia... let me just say that most of the men there appeared to be their own fathers.

That's why you need to get up to Fairfax County. Bit more urban (even went Democrat the last Presidential and Gubernatorial elections), but still close enough to drive along Skyline Drive in the autumn.