Help! Help! I'm Being Oppressed!

[Mongoose]

The new changes to the .org favor christianity over other religions! Look at the smile list! Gah! there it is again, Gah!

Ok, i've got that out of my system. What are your thoughts on the effort in the U.S to remove Christmas decorations form public display? I've always heard lots of Conservatives in the media talking about it, but i've yet to see it in my state....

[m52nickerson]

I think it is a bunch of crap! There is suppost to be free speech in the US. I can see no have x-mas decorations in schools or other goverment building, but removing from all public view? If I want to put a merry christmas sign on my front lawn you can damn sure I will. Imagine the government trying to tell a Jewish family they could not have try minora (spelling?) in there window. It comes down to the fact that if you don't want to look at something DON'T.


Now that my rant is done, merry christmas!

[Kaiser of Arabia]

Gah. America is owned by the leftist elite. What do you expect?

[Spetulhu]

If I want to put a merry christmas sign on my front lawn you can damn sure I will. Imagine the government trying to tell a Jewish family they could not have try minora (spelling?) in there window. It comes down to the fact that if you don't want to look at something DON'T.

A sensible way of thinking.

Not that the decorations as such irritate me, but why oh why do people start placing them six weeks in advance? I'm tired of looking at the stupid things already, and it's only the 14th!

[GoreBag]

The line is "I'm being repressed", actually. Listen very closely; you can hear the difference.

As much as I don't like the 'holiday' in question, I can deal with having to look away from the decorations. We don't have the problem with taking down decorations in Canada to the extent that America does, but it does work the other way. People will spell out 'JESUS LOVES YOU' in little blinking lights on their houses, but I'm prohibited by law to write 'SOD OFF'.

[Taffy_is_a_Taff]

I'm a hardcore Santaist.

have you been naughty or nice?

Edit: glory to old St.Nic

Edit: P.S. nice signature Mongoose.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Meh, my family is atheist and we still celebrate Christmas and have that little manger thing or whatever you call it.

If walmart or whoever thinks that putting out christmas decorations is going to hurt there business then they are naturaly going to be as pc as possible.

[Samurai Waki]

they're just decorations, get over it already. It's not like Christians go over to every jewish, muslim, hindu, buddhist, and atheist family and tell them that they 'have to celebrate it'. I think Christmas is universally accepted as a part of our culture in the US, and to hell with anyone who thinks differently. I may not be a part of any religion, but it's a good time of year to get together with your friends and family members, and exchange gifts, and just being thankful that someone out in that cold lonely world actually cares about you.

[Strike For The South]

down here its still merry christmas...commies

[Lemur]

The whole "war on Christmas" line of outrage is being puffed up as an issue at a time when it would be really convenient for certain folks in power to have the subject changed.

A lot of the reported "war" is distorted beyond fact. Some of it is straight-up invented. Bill O'Reilly (Fox News) announced that a town in Michigan was outlawing the wearing of green and red. He then sputtered on about how a big, tough guy like him would dress from head to toe in X-mas colors to show that town who's boss. When somebody bothered to call the town, the whole thing turned out to be a lie. But who really cares about the facts?

It's been a bad year for the ruling party. They'd love to set up a straw man to knock over. Hence the "War on Christmas."

[Rodion Romanovich]

Over here some tasteless official buildings used to start Christmas decorations in November the last few years, which took out most of the excitement for Christmas, so I wouldn't have been sad if they'd forbidden official decorations at that time. Now it seems it's self-regulating though, as people seem to have boycotted the stores that had decorations too early, so this year they're starting later...

What exactly is the US effort trying to do? Forbid it in public buildings/stores, or also in the windows of ordinary people?

[Xiahou]

A lot of the reported "war" is distorted beyond fact. Some of it is straight-up invented. Bill O'Reilly (Fox News) announced that a town in Michigan was outlawing the wearing of green and red. He then sputtered on about how a big, tough guy like him would dress from head to toe in X-mas colors to show that town who's boss. When somebody bothered to call the town, the whole thing turned out to be a lie. But who really cares about the facts?

It's been a bad year for the ruling party. They'd love to set up a straw man to knock over. Hence the "War on Christmas."

O'Reilly is a blowhard- so no suprises there. However, one example does not a case make- that's called a 'hasty generalization'.

[Lemur]

Well then, if you're really buying into the "War on Christmas" (and I'm not saying you are), please provide some examples of how this war is being waged.

I'd say the prime offenders would be the Pilgrims. Those God-fearing, black-wearing pinkos didn't celebrate Christmas at all. How dare they call it decadent!

[Lemur]

What exactly is the US effort trying to do? Forbid it in public buildings/stores, or also in the windows of ordinary people?

There is no special "US effort." And nobody has ever suggested that the windows of ordinary people should be legislated beyond the existing local statutes involving how much noise and light one can project. (Oh, there are probably some communities with detailed rules about how close to the sidewalk, etc., but that applies to everything in those places. They're just being @nal.)

This Lemur contends that the entire "War on Christmas" theme has been raised for the sole purpose of giving religious conservatives something to feel outraged and oppressed about. Red meat for the red voters, nothing more. There have been no more challenges to publicly funded displays this year than there have been on any other year. Situation normal. Unless you soften your brain with cable news.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

There is no special "US effort." And nobody has ever suggested that the windows of ordinary people should be legislated beyond the existing local statutes involving how much noise and light one can project. (Oh, there are probably some communities with detailed rules about how close to the sidewalk, etc., but that applies to everything in those places. They're just being @nal.)

This Lemur contends that the entire "War on Christmas" theme has been raised for the sole purpose of giving religious conservatives something to feel outraged and oppressed about. Red meat for the red voters, nothing more. There have been no more challenges to publicly funded displays this year than there have been on any other year. Situation normal. Unless you soften your brain with cable news.

On the contrar, the situation is far from normal:

WASHINGTON, DC—In a sudden and unexpected blow to the Americans working to protect the holiday, liberal U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals Judge Stephen Reinhardt ruled the private celebration of Christmas unconstitutional Monday.

Activist Judge Cancels Christmas

Per the court order, city workers take down the Christmas tree from New York's Rockefeller Plaza.

"In accordance with my activist agenda to secularize the nation, this court finds Christmas to be unlawful," Judge Reinhardt said. "The celebration of the birth of the philosopher Jesus—be it in the form of gift-giving, the singing of carols, fanciful decorations, or general good cheer and warm feelings amongst families—is in violation of the First Amendment principles upon which this great nation was founded."

In addition to forbidding the celebration of Christmas in any form, Judge Reinhardt has made it illegal to say "Merry Christmas." Instead, he has ruled that Americans must say "Happy Holidays" or "Vacaciones Felices" if they wish to extend good tidings.

Within an hour of the judge's verdict, National Guard troops were mobilized to enforce the controversial ruling.

"Sorry, kids, no Christmas this year," Beloit, WI mall Santa Gene Ernot said as he was led away from his Santa's Village in leg irons. "Write to your congressman to put a stop to these liberal activist judges. It's up to you to save Christmas! Ho ho ho!"

Said Pvt. Stanley Cope, who tasered Ernot for his outburst: "We're fighting an unpopular war on Christmas, but what can we do? The military has no choice but to take orders from a lone activist judge."

Across America, the decision of the all-powerful liberal courts was met with shock and disappointment, as American families quietly took down their holiday decorations and canceled their plans to gather and make merry.

"They've been chipping away at Christmas rights for decades," Fox News personality John Gibson said. "Even before this ruling, you couldn't hear a Christmas song on the radio or in a department store. I hate to say it, America, but I told you so."

Judge Stephen Reinhardt of the U.S. 9th Circuit of Appeals issues his ruling.

Gibson then went into hiding, vowing to be a vital part of the Christmas resistance that would eventually triumph and bring Christmas back to the United States and its retail stores.

The ban is not limited to the retail sector. In support of Reinhardt's ruling, Sen. Ted Kennedy, a Jew, introduced legislation that would mandate the registration of every Christian in the United States and subject their houses to random searches to ensure they are not celebrating Christmas.

"Getting rid of every wreath or nativity scene is not enough," Kennedy said. "In order to ensure that Americans of every belief feel comfortable in any home or business, we must eliminate all traces of this offensive holiday. My yellow belly quakes with fear at the thought of offending any foreigners, atheists, or child molesters."

America's children are bearing the brunt of Reinhardt's marginal, activist rulings.

"Why did the bad man take away Christmas?" 5-year-old Danny Dover said. "I made a card for my mommy out of paper and glue, and now I can't give it to her."

Shortly after Dover issued his statement, police kicked down his door, removed his holiday tree, confiscated his presents, and crushed his homemade card underfoot.

A broad, bipartisan coalition of lawmakers has been working closely with the White House, banding together in the hope of somehow overruling the decision. So far, however, their efforts have been fruitless.

"Our hearts go out to the Americans this ruling affects," Sen. Chip Pickering (R-MS) said. "If it's any condolence, I wish you all a Happy Holidays, which, I'm afraid, is all I'm legally allowed to say at this time."

[Rodion Romanovich]

There is no special "US effort." And nobody has ever suggested that the windows of ordinary people should be legislated beyond the existing local statutes involving how much noise and light one can project. (Oh, there are probably some communities with detailed rules about how close to the sidewalk, etc., but that applies to everything in those places. They're just being @nal.)

Ok, sorry, my interpretation of the opening post almost suggested something like that, which sounded strange and unlikely to me.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

This Lemur contends that the entire "War on Christmas" theme has been raised for the sole purpose of giving religious conservatives something to feel outraged and oppressed about. Red meat for the red voters, nothing more. There have been no more challenges to publicly funded displays this year than there have been on any other year. Situation normal. Unless you soften your brain with cable news.

Its not just about displays.

ACLU Style Political Correctness Hits the USPS
by Gribbit on 11-25-05 @ 2:56 pm Filed under News, Christmas
It is official, the United States Postal Service has now folded to the anti-Christmas PC movement. Postal employees are no longer allowed to say to customers “Merry Christmas.” And if that isn’t enough, no more Christmas stamps.

The busiest time of year for the USPS is the Christmas/Chanukah season. More letters, greeting cards, and packages are shipped via the USPS during the last week in November and the first 24 days in December than the rest of the year combined.

We, in our 21st century need for instant gratification, now rely on email, instant messaging, and mobile telephones to do our communication. We no longer take the time to hand write letters and other communications, place a stamp on an envelope, and drop it in a blue box. We now boot up the computer, connect to the internet, type out a message, click send and it’s there. No need for a stamp. No waiting days for it to arrive and days more for a reply.

The USPS has decided that the traditional “Madonna and Child” had to be replaced with “Holiday Cookie” stamps.

From the USPS:

The season kicks off on Oct. 20 with the dedication of the 2005 holiday stamps, celebrating the child in everyone and evoking favorite memories from the simple pleasure of decorating cookies of the season. The stamps, featuring cookie-shaped gingerbread men, Santa Claus, snowmen and an angel, will be dedicated at a special ceremony in the Pillsbury Test Kitchens in Minneapolis. Anita Bizzotto, USPS Executive Vice President and Chief Marketing Officer, will be the dedicating official.

“What would the holidays be without cookies? These cookie stamps are a great way to share the joy of the season,” Bizzotto said.

What I cannot figure out is why they are willing to ditch the traditional “Madonna and Child” which is a reproduction of a classic work of art for seemingly secular images of holiday cookies, one of which is a representation of an angel? Excuse me, but wouldn’t an angel be considered a religious symbol? What purpose does it serve to remove a classic work of art that is in keeping with the traditional meaning of the season in favor of a generic animated image of an angel?

The USPS has a limited supply of last year’s Madonna and Child stamps available for purchase. But, once they are gone, there will be no more produced. I see this as another battle won by the secular left in the War on Christmas. The USPS should be ashamed of themselves.

• In Illinois, state government workers were forbidden from saying the words “Merry Christmas” while at work
• In Rhode Island, local officials banned Christians from participating in a public project to decorate the lawn of City Hall
• A New Jersey school banned even instrumental versions of traditional Christmas carols
• Arizona school officials ruled it unconstitutional for a student to make any reference to the religious history of Christmas in a class project

Anti-Christian Hostility Driving 'War on Christmas,' Attorney Says

By Jim Brown
December 7, 2005

(AgapePress) - A Christian attorney says recent acts of censorship indicate Christmas is under attack in public schools across the United States.

One Ohio high school principal, for example, recently renamed the school's Christmas tree and concert a "holiday tree" and a "holiday concert." Similarly, a Missouri school superintendent informed fine arts teachers in his district that an upcoming winter assembly may not include "direct references to Christmas or the birth of Jesus," and a Wisconsin school district has banned all Christian Christmas songs.

Such phenomena are occurring not only in primary and secondary public schools, but also at the college level. Controversy recently erupted at Auburn University when the student government association re-dubbed its Christmas tree a "holiday tree."


Steve Crampton
Steve Crampton, chief counsel with the American Family Association Center for Law & Policy, takes issue with those who argue there is no "war against Christmas" going on. "They are flat wrong," he says, "and to miss what is happening in our public schools and in the public square -- even in our so-called places of public accommodation, such as the department stores during the Christmas season -- is to be completely blind to the culture war that's raging around us."

The hostility against Christianity that Crampton asserts has "been under the surface for years" has finally boiled over, he contends, and secularists are making no bones about their attempts to blot out all religious meaning associated with the holiday. He feels such acts of censorship indicate that public school officials have run amok with hypocrisy.

"When a public entity such as these high schools takes the extreme position that we can't even use the name 'Christmas,' let alone 'Jesus Christ,' how else can you describe it other than censorship?" the pro-family attorney asks. He says these public education officials' attempt to strip every vestige of Christian faith from the holiday represents "a running away, not only from our own history and tradition but from the very principles of tolerance that they are espousing on the other side of their mouth."

Crampton says the rising incidence of Christmas censorship is an indication that the culture war continues to rage (See related commentary). He suggests that anyone who denies this fact is either blind to an ever-mounting body of evidence or has been lulled into a false sense of complacency.

If any of you dont think theres a war going on here between Christains and secularists I dont knw what planet your living on. It all started when they took Christ out of Christmas. I never have and never will wish anyone a merry X-mas. Disgusting.

[Samurai Waki]

I'm not even Christian and still say "Merry Christmas". Is the world going mad?!?

[Quietus]

Christmas doesn't necessarily mean "Christian" anymore. That's an obsolete association.

[Ja'chyra]

The line is "I'm being repressed", actually. Listen very closely; you can hear the difference.

As much as I don't like the 'holiday' in question, I can deal with having to look away from the decorations. We don't have the problem with taking down decorations in Canada to the extent that America does, but it does work the other way. People will spell out 'JESUS LOVES YOU' in little blinking lights on their houses, but I'm prohibited by law to write 'SOD OFF'.

So buy the house next door and write, "But I don't"

Lemurmania

A lot of the reported "war" is distorted beyond fact. Some of it is straight-up invented. Bill O'Reilly (Fox News) announced that a town in Michigan was outlawing the wearing of green and red. He then sputtered on about how a big, tough guy like him would dress from head to toe in X-mas colors to show that town who's boss. When somebody bothered to call the town, the whole thing turned out to be a lie. But who really cares about the facts?

I think BBC is doing a documentary on how so many news reports are distorted beyond all recognition in order to make it vaguely interesting, including Christmas related stories.

strike for the south down here its still merry christmas...commies

Yeehaa

• In Illinois, state government workers were forbidden from saying the words “Merry Christmas” while at work

What, and they complied? I'm a civil servant in the UK, yes I know I'm a lazy B, and I can imaginewhat the response would be here, the second word would be "Off".

p.s. Don't you hate people who quote whole swathes of others posts in their own?

[Husar]

Hahaha, most of that "official" crap(newspapers and so on) here sounds quite funny.
I don´t care wether it´s true or not in the US, but here in germany we don´t bother about forbidding Christmas, in fact, many people celebrate Christmas with their families, even atheists! The christmas lights are everywhere in the "shopping zones" of cities and they can go on your nerves if you let them, but IMO they just need lots of snow to look nice.
I myself have no Christmas decoration in my appartment, I rather spare my money for other things.
Now, on forbidding to say this and that at work I find really stupid, if someone feels opposed if I say something, he should come to me and discuss it. If he is too much a pussy to do so, every Darwininst should agree that he needs to die out anyway, because he is too weak to survive!

[Rodion Romanovich]

In Illinois, state government workers were forbidden from saying the words “Merry Christmas” while at work

Haha that made me laugh

If any of you dont think theres a war going on here between Christains and secularists I dont knw what planet your living on. It all started when they took Christ out of Christmas. I never have and never will wish anyone a merry X-mas. Disgusting.

Aha, so that's where the ugly word X-mas comes from... So they're actually serious about it I don't know whether to cry our laugh...

I don't think anyone denies that many of the Christmas traditions are inspired by pagan and non-religious old traditions, and that many atheists celebrate Christmas (but the main idea of Christmas in the Christian interpretation and celebration of it is to celebrate the birth of Christ). But I don't understand why on earth they'd remove the word Christ from Christmas, as if it would be offensive or something?!!

War on terrorism, war on Christmas, war on french fries, war on war, what next? Btw, when speaking of odd laws, it's interesting to see what the typical sentence given to someone breaking that law would be. So, has anyone got prison for saying "Christmas" yet?

[KukriKhan]

Plenty of end-of-year holiday stamps available still, http://shop.usps.com/cgi-bin/vsbv/po...ubject/Holiday
but I don't recommend buying more than you'll actually use in the next 3 weeks...rates go up to $0.39 for First Class on January 8th, so you'll need a 2-cent make-up stamp for any left-overs.

No one has ever told me I can't say "Merry Christmas", "Joyous Kwanzaa", "Happy Eid", or "Happy Hanukkah" , or even "Super Solstice, Dude!" to anybody, postal patron or not.

[Beirut]

It all started when they took Christ out of Christmas. I never have and never will wish anyone a merry X-mas. Disgusting.

Ahh, when I was but a lad back in the old country (Montreal), I was told the X was just shorthand for the cross symbol.

You're saying it denotes... nothingness.

Makes sense I guess.

[lugh]

It's not like Christians go over to every jewish, muslim, hindu, buddhist, and atheist family and tell them that they 'have to celebrate it'.

They should be. Forced conversion never hurt anyone, it was the hot irons that did that.

Sorry to kill off the indignation, Xmas has nothing to secularism. It comes from Greek, Xristos (Christos) is Greek for Christ, and in the Orthodox church X has long been used as a symbol for Christ. Xmas has been in use since the 16th C.
Yet another reason Greek and Latin should never have been removed from national compulsory curriculums.

[Rodion Romanovich]

@lugh: ah, the XP / chi-rho, of course! Thanks for clearing that up! But still it's my opinion that writing X-mas doesn't look good in English, where X or XXX usually means there's some letters you wanted to hide

[Prodigal]

Well bahh-bloody-humbug to the lot of you, yet again someones already made my point

Nevermind though.

Eat, drink, be merry, & don't let the ban 'em all brigades get you down! 25th of Dec. can't be all bad, pagans can be happy, so can the christians, the agnostics can think about it, & the atheists can stuff themselves & drink to much too! Course this leaves out a whole bunch of others, but you can't please everyone all the time.


PS - What is egg-nog, & why would anyone want to drink it?

[KukriKhan]

PS - What is egg-nog, & why would anyone want to drink it?

For the alcohol content, o'course
http://www.indepthinfo.com/eggnog/recipesa.shtml

[Ja'chyra]

Sorry to kill off the indignation, Xmas has nothing to secularism. It comes from Greek, Xristos (Christos) is Greek for Christ, and in the Orthodox church X has long been used as a symbol for Christ. Xmas has been in use since the 16th C.
Yet another reason Greek and Latin should never have been removed from national compulsory curriculums.

LOL, classic

[Prodigal]

For the alcohol content, o'course
http://www.indepthinfo.com/eggnog/recipesa.shtml

That's what I was afraid of, so we're talking a cold alcoholic custard type thing

Americans awake! Port, Brandy, Whisky, Rum none of them taste great, but it has to be better than adding sugar & raw eggs to them! Egg-nog's a conspiracy dreamed up by chicken farmers to pay you back for buying turkeys