Missing: Roman Babies

[Vibrus]

I am well...ermm...having problems having babies playing as the romans. I know, I know...I gave all of my generals the birds and the bees lecture. I even went so far as to have them stay in town a bit longer...maybe to blow wind over the low "love embers" in hope of starting a blaze.

I have built nice governmental buildings for some potential "alone time".

Alas...no babies and therefore no true Romans!

I am in year 250 and the only new officials I get are adoptions and man of the hours'....which are most times not as good as a good baby which comes of age.

Anyone else having this problem?

P.S. When I played Pontus (until the 243 crash), my generals had babies like rabbits.

[Antagonist]

I believe it's a deliberate design decision that SPQR (and maybe some other factions) can attain "family members" only through adoption and patronage rather than by birth and marriage. I don't know if it's the same for any other faction as well?

Antagonist

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Yeah, they purposefully don't have babies and give them control - but whoever are the best men rise up and are adopted or gain power through 'men of the hour' events. Some other factions are this way too, but ones that handed power down to children still have the babies.

[Dâriûsh]

P.S. When I played Pontus (until the 243 crash), my generals had babies like rabbits.

That is the oriental way.

[Ano2]

So no family feuds? Ahh...

[Dux Corvanus]

As Teleklos stated, it's made this way to avoid as far as possible the 'Royal Family' unhistorical feel for the Romans and other factions where power only rarely was inherited from father to son.

It's far from being perfect -given the game code limits- but, IMHO, it's better that everyone having the same 'Genes of the Ruler' system.

Take into consideration that Rome is an unified faction now, so no more 'Mafia' wars.

[Vibrus]

Thanks for the heads up. I like the approach by the way. One last question:

Are babies just not possible or are they just very rare? Finally, can anyone direct me to more information on how the different factions are set up?

Thanks in advance.

[Malrubius]

I'm suprised to see it working so well! In testing, Romans could always squeak out a baby or two. If I'd known it was working, I would have put some documentation about it.

We actually have 3 categories at this time:

- No babies: Rome, Koinon Hellenon, Qarthadast, Aedui, Arverni

- Some babies: Sweboz, Iberia, Casse

- Normal fertility: Dacia, Makedonia, Epeiros, Ptolemaioi, Pontus, Steppe culture (Yuezhi, Pahlava, Sauromatae), Eastern Greeks (Baktria, Arche Seleukeia, Hayasdan)

[QwertyMIDX]

I've heard a few reports of the romans squeaking out a kid, but they are few and far between.

[Malrubius]

I probably need to calculate what happens to bribed generals (I believe they'd keep their former faction's fertility, and that wouldn't fit).

[Reverend Joe]

In playtesting, the one frustrating thing for me was that none of the adoptees were patricians, so for someone trying to guide Rome along a patrician-rule timeline, this was hampering. Perhaps the Patricians should still be able to have babies- after all, they were pseudoaristocratic families, rather than being merely prominent by accomplishment, as the Plebians had to be.

Should this be posted in the hidden forum as well?

[QwertyMIDX]

By 272 BC the ruling class of Rome was already a through mix of Patricians and Plebians.

Be careful not to confuse Patrican and Aristocrat. Everyone in your faction tree is part of the Roman upper class.

[Malrubius]

In playtesting, the one frustrating thing for me was that none of the adoptees were patricians, so for someone trying to guide Rome along a patrician-rule timeline, this was hampering. Perhaps the Patricians should still be able to have babies- after all, they were pseudoaristocratic families, rather than being merely prominent by accomplishment, as the Plebians had to be.

That might make sense, I have no idea. Mike?

Should this be posted in the hidden forum as well?

Que?

There's a whole thread on it in the Mechanics subforum on page 2. Believe me, I didn't decide this on my own, LOL. I actually prefer full fertility to get all the "Takes After Dad" stuff.

[QwertyMIDX]

Zorba's suggestion doesn't make a lot of sense with reference to the realities of the Roman political system in 272 (and even less as time goes on). But making both Pats and Plebs have some kids (while most are adopted or MOH) makes sense. It would even be ok to give the Pats slightly higher fertility levels than plebs (to represent the aura of the name in roman politics) but we'd want them to be increasly thinned out by Plebs as the game wears on not to weed out the Plebs.

[econ21]

I've heard a few reports of the romans squeaking out a kid, but they are few and far between.

Yes, it's around 243BC in my Roman game and I think I've had had one son grow up. He sticks out like a sore thumb from the sharp/charismatic/vigorous adoptees and rather disappointingly has a "not like his father" trait, as his father was one of my best starter generals.

[AggonyDuck]

I'm suprised to see it working so well! In testing, Romans could always squeak out a baby or two. If I'd known it was working, I would have put some documentation about it.

We actually have 3 categories at this time:

- No babies: Rome, Koinon Hellenon, Qarthadast, Aedui, Arverni

- Some babies: Sweboz, Iberia, Casse

- Normal fertility: Dacia, Makedonia, Epeiros, Ptolemaioi, Pontus, Steppe culture (Yuezhi, Pahlava, Sauromatae), Eastern Greeks (Baktria, Arche Seleukeia, Hayasdan)

Well I've been getting decent amounts of offspring with Carthage, so either my game is bugged or the Qarthadast belongs to the some babies category.

[Malrubius]

Well I've been getting decent amounts of offspring with Carthage, so either my game is bugged or the Qarthadast belongs to the some babies category.

Notice any traits like Fruitful, Fertile, or Prolific in these bunny-rabbit Qarthies or any other factions having kids who are in the no-kids list?

Or traits like Flaccid, Infertile, or Barren? If other people will report what their factions are doing, it would be very helpful, Thanks!

[Antagonist]

In my Aedui campaign I'm getting most of my generals through adoption, but some births. I do have 2 or 3 characters with fertility traits as well.

Antagonist

[jebes]

One of my Aedui general has 4 kids all minors.

[AggonyDuck]

Notice any traits like Fruitful, Fertile, or Prolific in these bunny-rabbit Qarthies or any other factions having kids who are in the no-kids list?

Or traits like Flaccid, Infertile, or Barren? If other people will report what their factions are doing, it would be very helpful, Thanks!

Well now that you mention it that would be the case. Some were fertile whilst others had an ancillary that increased fertility.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

I've heard a few reports of the romans squeaking out a kid, but they are few and far between.

The Dingos ate most of them from what I hear.

[Malrubius]

The Dingos ate most of them from what I hear.

What do you expect, when you leave them exposed on the hilltop?

[Tanit]

It might be historical if all factions had some babies or maybe only powerful members/ faction leaders had babies as the most powerful leaders often made sure that their sons made something of themselves and got positions of power. Like Hamilcar Barca's 4 sons. All became generals in spain and one is so famous I don't even have to utter his name.

[Slider6977]

Playing as Carthage, I have had three babies so far. One on my last turn. Two of the generals have had no fertility traits or ancillary characters to boost fertility. However my first child came from my best general. He currently has the Adulterer trait, the Healthy wife trait (both giving +1), the Mistress Anchillary, and the Physician anchillary (again both giving + 1). Its actually very annoying because once he got the two traits, I really wanted him to have some kids (plus he has intelligent wife trait, which makes me want to have a lot of kids). And with all this he has still only shot out one kid, and he is already five, with no brother or sister to speak of.

In fact, if you could let me know where you set all this up, and if it is possible to change factions in their "child standings" I would like to change this. I want to have more generals. I don't feel it will unbalance the game, or even make it historically inaccurate. At this time, at any point when a general was slain in battle or otherwise, there was always a family member to take his place. If I lose a general in battle (hopefully not a good one), I want to be able to replace him.

[Malrubius]

Yeah, search for "Trigger Have_No_Children" in edct.txt and add "and not CultureType egyptian" and it will let new Carthaginian generals have children.

[Mouzafphaerre]

.
If you mess with the Carthaginians, the cost will be your babies.
.

[Sheep]

I actually had a baby Roman a few years ago... 268 I believe... a little Scipioid... that's one good Physician in his entourage, lemme tell you...