Rally, Route or Withdraw?

[The Darkhorn]

IIRC the Benny-Hill code does not apply to missile units that have some arrows left, but I am not sure. Also, a skirmishing unit will get cornered unles the player intervenes.

Actually it does. I found out the hard way when I had a bunch of HA facing a bunch of Nubians. My general just routed away. I've turned two generals into girlymen b/c of that code. I've since just avoided being HA heavy which is unfortunate.

[ajaxfetish]

If you use the 'g' key instead of your mouse to group units you're a little safer. I never use route (my troops seem to manage that well enough on their own when push comes to shove), but withdraw is very useful, not just for replacing missile units, but for removing any unit that's ready to retire. In a long battle heavy units get tired soon (especially if you've taken them to the desert) and you can withdraw them and replace them with fresh troops, or if there's a lull you can send out depleted units (5 or 10 men or so left) and replace them with full ones. Use it to keep your army in peak condition. The AI's favorite use of it is to protect their one-man supergeneral units by withdrawing them the moment the battle begins.

Ajax

[matteus the inbred]

The AI's favorite use of it is to protect their one-man supergeneral units by withdrawing them the moment the battle begins.

ah, a deliberate policy. this one is currently featuring another thread somewhere in the main forum i think...

bog-standard horse archers have crappy morale and tend to run away a lot. they really need valour bonuses to be effective against anything but crap.

[Scurvy]

bog-standard horse archers have crappy morale and tend to run away a lot. they really need valour bonuses to be effective against anything but crap.

hmm actually i think they are better than inf with no val, as you can use them to shoot and tire out enemy cav that chase etc. and when the fighting starts if you place them behind enemies, they deplete morale even when not in combat then can chase routers so they arn't all that terrible without val....

[matteus the inbred]

hmm actually i think they are better than inf with no val, as you can use them to shoot and tire out enemy cav that chase etc. and when the fighting starts if you place them behind enemies, they deplete morale even when not in combat then can chase routers so they arn't all that terrible without val....

oh no, i agree with you, i meant comparatively with other types of horse archers...but then the same goes for most 'vanilla' troop types. i make a lot of use of HA and other 'crappy' cavalry like viking raiders when i can, any cavalry is better than none, and usually battle-winning. if i hadn't had HA in my army last night, for example, the Italian Doge would have gotten away
just don't rely on them to outfight Trebizond archers, for example. or even, as i discovered, unbroken UM...!

[Scurvy]

oh no, i agree with you, i meant comparatively with other types of horse archers...but then the same goes for most 'vanilla' troop types. i make a lot of use of HA and other 'crappy' cavalry like viking raiders when i can, any cavalry is better than none, and usually battle-winning. if i hadn't had HA in my army last night, for example, the Italian Doge would have gotten away
just don't rely on them to outfight Trebizond archers, for example. or even, as i discovered, unbroken UM...!

[Legorreto]

Here`s my particular case that originated the whole thread.

I was playing this battle with one army, without reinforcements (840 troops approx). The enemy came with three complete army reinforcements (1230 approx) and I decided I was able to handle this invasion to my province.

It was a bridge battle, and I got some ammo units (Camel Berbers and Mwhavids) Then I thought it would be easier to defeat of my oponents (Spanish) and so I dared.

The battle was balancing towards my side as I literally stormed them with javelins and arrows. I also sent one unit of AUM with very high valour to stop them at the end of the bridge and make them very vulnerable to my missiles.

So it happened, and the rate of kill was very on my side until... WHOOPS! no more ammo left... so I had to send my units towards the bridge to counterattack and have them retreat...

In short... They ended up bringing in lots of ammo units and literally fulminated my tired army. I lost all Camels and more than half my army and had only my Generals Unit: Peasants to face them.

I really was scared of loosing this general as he was the governor of the province and very high valour, so I finally decided to rout him and my left army so I could ransom them back and retrain them taking advantage on their high valour obtained during battle.

So i gave the order to Route and my very few army units (about 130) were basically swooped off by the spanish fresh Jinets and lost them almost completely. At the end of the battle I only got my general's unit with only 24 men. I indeed ransomed them and lost my province.

So I though Would it had been better to withdraw earlier and garrison my units and hold until bringing more reinforcements? or, Did I made the correct decision by Routing?

What do you think is the best in these situations?

[Ludens]

Actually it does. I found out the hard way when I had a bunch of HA facing a bunch of Nubians. My general just routed away. I've turned two generals into girlymen b/c of that code. I've since just avoided being HA heavy which is unfortunate.

Oh dear. Well, at least it is good to know it, so your frustration was not in vain .

Legorreto, it depends on how much damage you could have done to them and how easy it would have been to retake the province. In your particular case, withdrawing earlier might have been a better idea, but it is always hard to determine the correct moment for this. Your high valour AUM unit was almost certainly going to be jinette-fodder.

[Loucipher]

I'd concur. Withdrawing the general's unit before the enemy could get it, especially as it was a high Valour governor, would be very wise. Especially as withdrawal doesn't earn him cowardice vices - isn't discretion a better part of valour?
Peasants would fare poorly against anything to start with, and against the Spanish Jinetes they would melt like snowball in hell after second volley of javelins. On the other hand, panicked flight with infantry is unwise when the enemy does have a cavalry unit ready to ride your men down... at least unless you have something else to make the sacrificial last stand.

[ajaxfetish]

Your best option would probably have been to leave a solid infantry unit (AUM or any kind of spears) to hold them at the bridge while the rest of your army withdrew in good order. After you had spent all of your missiles of course. The rearguard unit would be a complete sacrifice, but it'd let you keep the rest of your army intact. Without a bridge you can use one or two units of decent cavalry to keep the enemy distracted while your infantry march to safety.

Ajax