Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
Sassanids get both Clibs and Catas too. Their Clibs just happen to be a bit different from the ERE Equites Clibanarii (who if I recall correctly have shields, but no bows).
Pontus doesn't get Catas, nevermind Cata Archers (Armenians have a monopoly on those AFAIK). Not on default settings anyway. Cappadocians are a sort of poor man's BI Cataphract.
Last edited by Watchman; 01-19-2006 at 17:41.
"Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."
-Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster
Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
I stand corrected. Anyway, no dispute here: "Tanks" with arrows beat "tanks" without as a general purpose unit. No question.
"In war, then, let your great object be victory, not lengthy campaigns."
Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
Just ask anyone who's played the Russians in MTW.
"Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."
-Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster
Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
That brings back memories.
"In war, then, let your great object be victory, not lengthy campaigns."
Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
But still in a comperision between R: TW catas and BI Clib, you must count the cost. Catas in R: TW are relatively easy with this secondary mace option to attack which AP. That WILL help me a lot in MP. And the Cataphracts archers in R: TW have a secondary 'sword' attack with no AP and as far as I think even a wrose morale than Catas'.
"Cry, the beloved country, for the unborn child that is the inheritor of our fear. Let him not love the earth too deeply. Let him not laugh too gladly when the water runs through his fingers, nor stand too silent when the setting sun makes red the veld with fire. Let him not be moved when the birds of his land are singing, nor give too much of his heart to a mountain or a valley. For fear will rob him of all if he gives too much."
Cry, the Beloved Country by Alan Paton.
Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
Unit costs between vanilla RTW and BI aren't really compatible anyway - for one RTW Peasant unit costs on Huge unit size a happy 100 denari upkeep, while an equivalent BI unit costs something like 18... but is only half as effective as a garrison.
Anyway, I'm not sure if that's what you meant, but the Sassanid archer-Clibanariis have maces too. *And* two point higher base armour than the RTW Catas... Equites Clibanarii only had 18 armour if I recall correctly, but they had shields by the way of compensation. And maces.
"Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."
-Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster
Re: Cataphracts in R: TW.
I'm just commenting on this:
In R: TW that doesn't seem to apply, Cata Archers are relatively weak facing a melee cata.Originally Posted by Doug-Thompson
About them in BI, I seem to like Catas more even their, look below:
Code:type clibinarii dictionary clibinarii ; Clibinarii category cavalry class heavy voice_type Medium_1 soldier clibinarii, 27, 0, 1 mount horse cataphract mount_effect elephant -4, camel -4 attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, power_charge formation 1.2, 4, 2.4, 6, 4, square, wedge stat_health 1, 0 stat_pri 7, 4, arrow, 100, 30, missile, archery, piercing, none, 25 ,1 stat_pri_attr prec stat_sec 6, 7, no, 0, 0, melee, blade, blunt, mace, 25 ,1 stat_sec_attr ap stat_pri_armour 20, 6, 0, metal stat_sec_armour 0, 3, flesh stat_heat 3 stat_ground 0, 1, -6, -1 stat_mental 5, disciplined, highly_trained stat_charge_dist 50 stat_fire_delay 0 stat_food 60, 300 stat_cost 2, 1430, 300, 150, 220, 1430 ownership sassanidsClearly, Clibinarii 7 damage arrows won't badly effect the 18 armour of Catas (And maybe the 4 points of shielding nto sure though). Moving on to the Secondary weapon, They have 6 damage points with AP + 7 charge bonus. While the Catas have 9 base melee sword damage + 9 from spear charge.Code:type cataphracts dictionary cataphracts ; Cataphracts category cavalry class heavy voice_type Heavy_1 soldier cataphracts, 27, 0, 1 mount horse cataphract mount_effect elephant -4, camel -4 attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, power_charge formation 1.2, 4, 2.4, 6, 4, square, wedge stat_health 1, 0 stat_pri 6, 9, no, 0, 0, melee, blade, piercing, spear, 25 ,1 stat_pri_attr no stat_sec 9, 5, no, 0, 0, melee, blade, piercing, sword, 25 ,1 stat_sec_attr no stat_pri_armour 18, 10, 4, metal stat_sec_armour 0, 4, flesh stat_heat 3 stat_ground 0, 1, -6, -1 stat_mental 9, disciplined, highly_trained stat_charge_dist 50 stat_fire_delay 0 stat_food 60, 300 stat_cost 2, 1390, 337, 140, 210, 1390 ownership sassanids
All that added to the fact that Catas armor in melee is 28, while Clibnarii's is 24. And still, the morale effect, Clibnariis' morale looks bad while Catas liik quit fine (5 to 9).
"Cry, the beloved country, for the unborn child that is the inheritor of our fear. Let him not love the earth too deeply. Let him not laugh too gladly when the water runs through his fingers, nor stand too silent when the setting sun makes red the veld with fire. Let him not be moved when the birds of his land are singing, nor give too much of his heart to a mountain or a valley. For fear will rob him of all if he gives too much."
Cry, the Beloved Country by Alan Paton.
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