The obligatory Unit thread!

[Leet Eriksson]

This will be the unit speculation and wishlist thread, here we talk all about units (only), and how they will function, so what units would you like to see and how would they function?

I would love CA if they would put unique low tier militia for muslim factions (and i mean not the generic urban militia everyone got), for example Beduin Warbands, Beduin/Ashaer Cavalry.. etc these would generally have decent attack, low defence and cheap (with poor morale). Also upgraded versions like beduin nobles (heavier version of the lighter cavalry).

Also an upgraded AUM for the almohads so they won't suck in the late period, call them the Almohad Urban Cohorts.

So don't be shy, mention whatever unit you'd like (fictional or not, but don't exaggerate the fictional units to superhuman proportions), and hope CA would read this thread and take our advice!

[pyradyn]

hmmm what units Superman! nah just kidding. I want Pagan Milita from my Pagan lands. This would of course lower your statis with the Pope but who listens to him? Pope what Pope HOLY CRAP THEIR IS A POPE, to bad im pagan. Not Uber untis just so that your Pagan provances dont get mad at you by having a garison of Christian Knights. I wouldnt take to kind to that if i was a peasant but then agian im king arnt I yay for me. Also i wouldnt mind Russian Raiders for when they are at war with Mongols. Russia never did take to kind to people in their land. MOTHER LAND. Ya thats about it i will probly think of more and post agian. Kool thread thanks for starting

[Mount Suribachi]

Also an upgraded AUM for the almohads so they won't suck in the late period, call them the Almohad Urban Cohorts.

Upgraded AUMs!!!

Aye Carumba!

They were kick-ass enough to begin with - cheap, easily available, +1 Valour in Granada, easy acces to Iron to upgrade armour....

I know what you're saying though about the weak Almohad roster in the later game, I always interpreted this as CAs attempt to reflect the decline of the Moors in Spain - they did the same with the Byzantines.

[Beirut]

Armoured Longbowmen.

My own little MLRS units.

[caspian]

Some type of Kensai Unit, don't know how historic it would be but an uber-one-man unit really kicks ass.
Or a Hashishin/Battlefield Ninja unit for the Catholics.

[The_Doctor]

Hussite war wagons.

[econ21]

In many ways, I find it easier to think of MTW units I'd like to see cut, than new ones I'd like to see introduced. My hit list would include:

* Kataphracts - replace with mercenary Frankish knights

* Byzantine infantry - give them long spears, not swords. By that time, they were an anti-cavalry shield, not medieval legionnaires.

* Almohad urban militia - remove the half-plate (where on earth did that idea come from?)

* Saracen infantry - do not make them more heavily armoured than the early European spears (unless they are just dismounted Saracen heavy cavalry)

* Mid period Arbalests - move them to late

* Spanish lancers - make them less heavily armoured than the other late period Catholic knights (& give Gothic knights lances, as well as maces, & allow England and France to have them)

* Sword armed Men-at-arms units - make them just the dismounted version of knights or mounted sergeants, and give them "spears" (anti-cavalry properties) due to their lances

Indeed, I think the unit classes of MTW need totally rethinking and probably blurring. I don't think the swords vs spears distinction is historical - virtually no units in that period were solely armed with swords (& certainly not the Byzantines or the Almohad urban militia). Moreover, the more heavily armed European fighters would typically have horses and so have the option of dismounting. Certainly, with the English medieval army, the knights and men-at-arms would be both the best "spears" (anti-cav infantry), the best "swords" (shock infantry) and the best cavalry (heavy cavalry). The French knights might have been initially more reluctant to dismount, but did do so routinely after stumbling against the effective anti-cav English "spear+longbow" combo.

With the early/mid-period Catholic European armies, I would like to see distinctions made more in terms of "soft factors" such as training and proficiency than "hard factors" such as weapon type (although armour and mount would remain a key hard factor). With the evolution of polearms and the reintroduction of the pike, then weapon-based classes would start to become more distinct.

Having early/mid knight/men-at-arms units that simultaneously excel at several roles might reduce the "rock-paper-scissors" aspect of the game, but I'd prefer historical accuracy to an artificially introduced gameplay. Balancing such multi-use powerful units would be a challenge but there are enough options (support cost, build time, unit size, tech requirements etc) to do it. Moreover, if it wanted to, CA could even introduce an additional quantitative constraint on the pool of such "elite" units (e.g. you can't have more elites than provinces etc).

[Rodion Romanovich]

Hussite war wagons.

Yeah, that would completely rock for the late period

Cool with a new subforum btw. I hope CA tries a more historical approach this time. I don't think it's necessary for them to remove things like Chivalric Men-at-Arms and other generic units, but I hope for removal of priests and dogs etc., the gameplay and mechanics of battles are interesting and complex enough as it is with light, shock and heavy version of all units, plus the possibility of adding a secondary weapon (javelin, dart etc.) for many units (a part of their engine potential I think they haven't taken full advantage of yet - and when they did they gave the units a little too much ammo for pila IMO). So my unit lists wish is - units that use the full secondary weapon potential of the engine but without giving them too much ammo!

[Leet Eriksson]

Hussite war wagons.

the first game didn't have the hussite rebellion, but now that there is a chance for it, might as well add the hussite faction and their war wagons!

[Rodion Romanovich]

Some type of Kensai Unit, don't know how historic it would be but an uber-one-man unit really kicks ass.
Or a Hashishin/Battlefield Ninja unit for the Catholics.

If they want historical uber units they can always choose between the al-murabitin, the viking berserkers and/or joms vikings (would however be removed in the later eras), the varangian guard, templars/hospitallers, etc. But I personally think it's more fun if those uber units have as many men as the normal units, like the gaesatae in EB . It makes them possible to use in a more natural way, otherwise they're always flanked, surrounded etc., or have to be as overpowered as the berserkers in BI (who could easily rout a whole early era army alone and didn't get very tired in the process).

[Kraxis]

Ah but the Berserkers of VI on the other hand were in my mind almost perfectly balanced. Sure a superb normal sized units would be cool, in fact I would prefer it, but I doubt that will happen. And if it does, then we will see Urban Cohort Mk 2.