A bad install or.....?

[PseRamesses]

....is this mod far from finished? Ok, I know it´s a beta and I DO love many of the unique feats in the EB-world. I´ve been waiting so long for this project to see the light of day. Maybee my install has gone bad but I´ve now tried this three times with the same results. I´ve a clean RTW install with a manually installed 1.2 patch (since the other patch doesn´t work?) and then I installed EB. I also made a new DL of EB for my last install.

My problem is that units, names, factions, features etc is all mixed up... it´s like someone took a deck of cards and shuffled the whole contents of the game randomly. Let me explain.
*I have Romans with Greek faces, voices/ speeches. When I leave a settlement the townbanner turns from Roman to Seleukeian. Furthermore, as the Koinon Hellenion I get all agents wearing the "old" robes and colours. My banners are Parthian. Playing the Yehuzi (sp?) I´ve Pontic nobles as generals and I can´t even use their alternative attack (sword) until they´ve depleted their pilae which is quite annoying. Oh, I´ve Roman "barracks" in every city on the map, nomatter the factions holding them??? This goes on and on with every faction... what the h_ll is wrong?
*Economics is badly balanced. Just love that things are expensive and the fact that you can´t build what you want since you have to be very careful what to build and where you should build it. This however requires an extensive information about your new techtree - which I don´t seem to find anywhere. Is there one even made for the players. As for now I just fumbles in the dark when it comes to buildingstrategies. This was not your intentions right?
Why start off with units that you have to destroy on turn one to get your economy into a surplus? Ex: As Carthage you´ll bleed out some 5.000/ turn IF you don´t destroy your fleet and that elephant unit. But I need atleast 2-3ships just to maintain some degree of satisfactory level of logistics. Playing the Koinon Hellenion it´s the same problem, and even worse, since you have to take the nearby Macedonian and/ or rebel settlements just to turn your economy around. So you don´t even give the player a second strategical option. This is just bad balancing. If your intensions were to depict the problems theese factions had with their economy then it´s fine with me but I can´t find that information anywhere either.
The only faction I´ve found this far that can turn a profit from turn one without deleting units/ buildings are the Romans. This can´t be your intentions, right?!
*Scripting: Oh, I looove this concept! But why script suggestion/ orders that I can´t possibly fullfill? Take the whole "Sinope-script" when you´re playing K.H. You can´t do a thing about the situation and Sinope is a rebel city so why should I bother? And how can I be at war with Pontus over a rebel town that is of no interest to me at this stage in the game. I was fortunate since I was able to sue for peace three turns in a row and make 15.000 in retribution from them but they just kept attacking Sinope the very next turn and I was back in war with them again. What´s the point?

So, do I have a bad install or is this mod really this far from reasonably finished? Thanks for all the work that has gone into this epic projects and for any answers and/ or corrections.

[pezhetairoi]

Well Ramesses, a lot of the problems you have mentioned are noted and perennially mentioned problems. I even mentioned them myself, at the start when I didn't know better. You should take a look at the 'known bugs' thread to update yourself. These issues have been addressed time and time again in reply to everyone who asks it, and I think Khelvan is pretty much sick of answering them, so I shall do the answering this time.

About the Roman/Seleukid faction switch issue, i'll say it again for the benefit of those who haven't heard, it is being solved, but currently the team has many more important issues such as the Apocalypse bug and the unit cards that still don't have the graphics they are supposed to have and problematic models/recruitment areas/building complexes that they have to iron out. So that can wait since it's only an immersion issue that really doesn't interrupt gameplay.

About the techtree, I share your grumbles completely. There simply isn't a techtree around for reference. However, the question is: Is there anyone left who has the time and spare effort to do it for the community? Currently the team is low on manpower with volunteers bleeding off after the OB (and people who have other pressing commitments that pushes them off the team, e.g. me, who must serve in the army 5 out of 7 days a week) and therefore no one has the spare time left to create a unit guide and government systems guide, since it must of course be far more comprehensive than the original RTW guide, and since it requires extensive testing and references to the spreadsheets prepared by the team beforehand. You'll just have to live with it, I'm afraid, and feel in the dark like I am. It is just too daunting a task to attempt right now with so many OB bugs to iron out.

About Pontos and KH, I'm not too sure because I have played neither before. However, I think the Pontos-getting-back-into-war-with-you thing is a hardcoded RTW diplomacy screwup, and not the script's fault? And it probably was meant to reflect historically possible events, since you must remember that 'rebel' cities in EB are not necessarily 'rebel' but are just 'independent'. And besides, quite a few of the eleutheroi cities are actually affiliated/allied to the KH in the scripting, since historically many Asian Minor cities were closely tied to the Greek city-states that founded/supported/traded with them.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Especially Rhodes was very upset when Pontos attacked Sinope and eventually siezed it. Sinope and Trapezous are greek poleis and other Greek poleis tried to help them with men and weapons and money. So, yes, if Pontos attacks Sinope or Trapezous it will cause a state of war between KH and Pontos - that's realistic, it's not a bug. You can ignore it for the most part though. Even if you can't do anything about it, it's more immersive to let you know these things are going on and some Greek poleis with close ties to KH are being overtaken by other factions.

[jebes]

About the Roman/Seleukid faction switch issue, i'll say it again for the benefit of those who haven't heard, it is being solved, but currently the team has many more important issues such as the Apocalypse bug and the unit cards that still don't have the graphics they are supposed to have and problematic models/recruitment areas/building complexes that they have to iron out. So that can wait since it's only an immersion issue that really doesn't interrupt gameplay.

I am pretty sure that the Roman=Selucid bug has been fixed as well as the Apocalypse bug and will be fixed with the next patch.

[King of the dutch]

My problem is that units, names, factions, features etc is all mixed up... it´s like someone took a deck of cards and shuffled the whole contents of the game randomly. Let me explain.
*I have Romans with Greek faces, voices/ speeches. When I leave a settlement the townbanner turns from Roman to Seleukeian. Furthermore, as the Koinon Hellenion I get all agents wearing the "old" robes and colours. My banners are Parthian. Playing the Yehuzi (sp?) I´ve Pontic nobles as generals and I can´t even use their alternative attack (sword) until they´ve depleted their pilae which is quite annoying. Oh, I´ve Roman "barracks" in every city on the map, nomatter the factions holding them??? This goes on and on with every faction... what the h_ll is wrong?

The roman barracks is an icon for you're military infrastructure that has been build it does not represent a barrack as such.

*Economics is badly balanced. Just love that things are expensive and the fact that you can´t build what you want since you have to be very careful what to build and where you should build it. This however requires an extensive information about your new techtree - which I don´t seem to find anywhere. Is there one even made for the players. As for now I just fumbles in the dark when it comes to buildingstrategies. This was not your intentions right?

There are numerous threads about this.. Check the forum for info about government buildings, naval/commercial ports.

Why start off with units that you have to destroy on turn one to get your economy into a surplus? Ex: As Carthage you´ll bleed out some 5.000/ turn IF you don´t destroy your fleet and that elephant unit. But I need atleast 2-3ships just to maintain some degree of satisfactory level of logistics.

You really need only 1 ship. The transport ship of the baeleric islands. For some factions (iberia f.i.) i agree about the huge armies but mostly its meant to give that second strategical option you want. Makedon has a very powerful army so you have two choices:
1 Build up slowly so disband most of it
2 use it to take the two HK towns i greece and even the Epeiros towns in the west. Yes you will bleed but that's for having an ber army. I admit that i think this could be balanced a bit more but for most factions i managed it.

Playing the Koinon Hellenion it´s the same problem, and even worse, since you have to take the nearby Macedonian and/ or rebel settlements just to turn your economy around. So you don´t even give the player a second strategical option.

See above

This is just bad balancing. If your intensions were to depict the problems theese factions had with their economy then it´s fine with me but I can´t find that information anywhere either.

That is the case so here is that info.

The only faction I´ve found this far that can turn a profit from turn one without deleting units/ buildings are the Romans. This can´t be your intentions, right?!
*Scripting: Oh, I looove this concept! But why script suggestion/ orders that I can´t possibly fullfill? Take the whole "Sinope-script" when you´re playing K.H. You can´t do a thing about the situation and Sinope is a rebel city so why should I bother? And how can I be at war with Pontus over a rebel town that is of no interest to me at this stage in the game. I was fortunate since I was able to sue for peace three turns in a row and make 15.000 in retribution from them but they just kept attacking Sinope the very next turn and I was back in war with them again. What´s the point?

see TA and:
They are not rebels. They are you're fellow greeks who are not represented as a seperate faction because no more slots are available. Rebels are not really rebels. They are the free peoples and represent a seperate faction which is not entirely possible due to reasons mentioned above. Some rebel towns may rebel to you're faction for instance because they turn to you're glorious leadership.

So, do I have a bad install or is this mod really this far from reasonably finished? Thanks for all the work that has gone into this epic projects and for any answers and/ or corrections.

It's far from finished, but....within reason IMO. At first i was put off by a lot you mention (especially economy) but now when i play a game on VH/H its HARD. I play a Cart. campaign with a friend of mine and its really a struggle to keep it going and conquer stuff. We decided to leave Afrika alone, let Scicily run it's course ( the rebels are to strong and Roman Epeiros hopefully keep each other busy.) and we went for Spain. Killed their faction leader and heir and two familymembers in an EPIC battle. Are now sieging their towns and BOOM the ptolemies siege Lepcis (or something). What to do what to do. Our economy is just strong enough to support another semi full stack wchich is on a 1 and a 1/2 year trip to save the town....hopefully. I NEVER lost a town to the a.i. in vanilla (or in RTR for that matter no disresepct the a.i. is just not very good) and this is precisly what's gonna happen now. Man it's a thrill.

grtz kod

[PseRamesses]

Thx guys for your answers and inputs. I actually followed Pez´ advice and read through the whole bug-thread and I can see that my report wasn´t news at all. Sorry for bringing known issues to your attention yet again.

@Pez.. I might have the time to comply a tech-tree for the mod. Inform me through mail how to proceed, when and what to do if you need any assistance like research etc.

@Teleklos. So my suspicions wasn´t completely unfounded. I just couldn´t find any info regarding this particular script hence my Q. But I just love the script anyway.

@King of the Dutch. I do agree with you and I DO like a good challenge. I had a go at KH again and this time i´m atleast afloat around 10k/turn. It´s a pity though that I´m not acustomed with the tech-tree and I´m quite uncertain what to build sometimes.