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  1. #1
    Oni Member Samurai Waki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    A little bit of both I suppose you could say. Morally, I'm a liberal pot smoking hippy (though I don't actually smoke pot), Legally and Judiciously I'm pretty far to the right, less big government, and less taxes... so I suppose you could say, I either want a little bit of both, or that I'm an Anarchist...whichever you decide is fine by me.

  2. #2
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    Pretty far on the right when it comes to immigration.

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    Texan Member BigTex's Avatar
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    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    I would have to say i would be a bit of a moderate, but on some views extremely right or left (USA should conquer the world bwuahahahaha!). I'm against the idea of redistributing wealth but pro minimum wage and such small scale measures like that. The idea that making everyone economically equal would just destroy the American way as it would leave little for one to strive for in their lives. And as for immigration I'd like a big wall, a gigantic one between us and Mexico. Let all who want in, just do it legally so it can be monitored, and the workers taxed properly. Ahhh and some law to make sure those people at Mcdonalds speak english well, I want my burger my way thank you.

    Last edited by BigTex; 02-26-2006 at 17:58.
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    Old Town Road Senior Member Strike For The South's Avatar
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    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    Quote Originally Posted by BigTex
    I would have to say I'd like a big wall, a gigantic between us and Mexico. Let all who want in, just do it legally so it can be monitored, and the workers taxed properly. Ahhh and some law to make sure those people at Mcdonalds speak english well, I want my burger my way thank you.
    Although Im in favor of greatly curbing immagration on the whole
    Last edited by Strike For The South; 02-26-2006 at 17:49.
    There, but for the grace of God, goes John Bradford

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    Humanist Senior Member A.Saturnus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    Be careful when someone uses the word "liberal". The Amercian usage of the word is entirely different from the (mainland) European. In America a liberal is left-wing. Mainly what JAG explained above. In Europe though liberal is a synonym of libertarian, which is rather right-wing.

    I consider myself progressive, which means that I don't embrace the past or am satisfied with the status quo but strive to improve society in small controlled steps.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    In the U.S., the self-perception of Right or Left and conservative or liberal, as well as the perception of your opposite ideology has a very real problem.

    This:

    A true Conservative views himself as this only as it applies to constituional interpretation.

    A Liberal would view themselves as open to change and eager to change what they see as tradition.

    This is an important distinction because each side also views the other side through their oen frame.

    For example, A Conservative sees liberals as constituionally liberal. A conservative would be horrified at the broad interpretation that liberal judges apply to the constitution. Ashcroft Vc. Raich and the City of New London Supreme Court cases are good examples of Liberal judges expanding the power of government and reducing individual and state's rights because of liberal interpretation.

    On the other hand, A liberal would not view a conservative through the constitutional frame, instead viewing the conservative through a social frame. A liberal would be horrified by Conservative reluctance to change certain established social structures, and consequently views conservatives as only "socially conservative". Drug laws, homosexuality, minority privelege over whites, etc.

    The result is that folks incorrectly view conservatives as fascist falsely believeing that conservatives want to tell other people how to live. This is completely incorrect, but unfortunatley the religious influence on the Republican party has greatly contributed towards this becoming truth.

    A true conservative believes that the Constitution of the United States is the foundation for American society and culture. Therefore, society must obey the law in order to preserve the constitution. Afer all, without the Constitution, kiss the U.S. goodbye. A liberal believes that the constituion must be made to fit the current social percpetion and that the law must bend to the people, not the people to the law.

    Because of this difference in perception, both sides view the other as attempting to usurp power. The truth is only that liberal interpretation can genuinely eliminate our rights, while a conservative interpretation can protect our rights.
    "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -Einstein

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  7. #7
    Philologist Senior Member ajaxfetish's Avatar
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    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    IIRC, the terms left and right came from the seating arrangement of the French congress after the first revolution. Basically the left is liberal (or as it was then called, radical) and the right is conservative. Conservatives look more to the past, relying on tradition and past experience as a guide. Liberals look to the future, looking for experiment and change.

    The Democratic and Republican parties are independent of the left/right distinction, but currently Democrats are seen to fit the left mentality to a greater degree, and Republicans the right. The ideas behind the parties are support for private industry on the Republican side, meaning low taxes and less government interference in business (the idea being that if the populace is allowed to work freely they will take care of themselves), and big Government on the Democratic side, meaning more taxes used to support social programs (the idea being that it's better for the government to take care of the people).

    Religion is also independent of either party and I suppose technically from the conservative/liberal issue, though many religions have a strong foundation in tradition so tend towards the more conservative side. Currently, again, there is a lot more open religious support for the Republicans, and it seems to me that more of those who claim to be Atheist/Agnostic/Don't care about religion gravitate toward the Democrat side.

    That's the basics for America at least. Of course there are liberal Republicans and conservative Democrats, strongly Christian Democrats, Atheist Republicans, and people with their own views on particular issues that may not fit the broader policy of their party. Also, there are more and less extreme views on all sides.

    As for me, I consider myself to be a moderate, which means I'm kind of a loner here in the Backroom. I don't really get to join either side, and if I did I would occasionally disagree with them and get my club membership revoked . At home I feel very liberal, here at school (or probably anywhere in California) I feel much more conservative. I think a mix of both viewpoints is required for a healthy nation, and generally just wish people would take more time to openly think about any specific issue, instead of following whatever their party-line says is right and refusing to consider its fallibility.

    Ajax

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    "I have no words, my voice is in my sword." --- Shakespeare
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Now you all have me a little confuzzled

    Quote Originally Posted by A.Saturnus
    Be careful when someone uses the word "liberal". The Amercian usage of the word is entirely different from the (mainland) European. In America a liberal is left-wing. Mainly what JAG explained above. In Europe though liberal is a synonym of libertarian, which is rather right-wing.

    I consider myself progressive, which means that I don't embrace the past or am satisfied with the status quo but strive to improve society in small controlled steps.
    Then my definition above is American.

    Conservatives believe that Humans by nature are flawed (hence the need for more controls, and stricter laws).

    ex. generally favor:
    A moral standard/absolute (i.e. the bible): to balance/counter the perceived (inherent) flaw in humans.
    Gun ownership: (evil) People kill (good) people, not guns.
    the War in Iraq: Saddam is (evil) a threat, therefore war is necessary.

    Liberals believe that Humans are relatively faultless (hence requiring only little control, less possible laws).

    Quite the opposite in views.

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