Swiss and burgundian emergences

[NodachiSam]

I've never in all my playing ever seen the swiss or burgundians show up so I wonder if it is even possible. From the game files they look like they could function perfectly like normal factions and I hear they are in multiplayer but are they ever in single player? Presumably they are able to appear like the Mongols are able to appear even though they do not exist at the beginning of early and high.

[Ironside]

Both at the same time, and individually (only seen the Burgund twice though).

Seen the Swiss way before 1290 (the date were a message about the forming of Switzerland shows up) once though.

[Weebeast]

They didn't appear in certain turn like Mongols but they did appear often when I had my old MTW. Swiss did appear in almost all of my campaigns.

I don't know if you're running MTW-VI.

[Ciaran]

Neither. But then I assume they appear by rebellion, much like an ordinary faction re-emergence, right?
If so, it´s unlikely I´ll see them, playing with the HRE (and usually starting in High) I go to great lenghts to keep Switzerland (and the Swiss Halberdiers). And Burgundy is one of the few decently developed provinces the HRE gets.

[Loucipher]

Well, the way I see it, the only surefire way to make them show up is to raze down all happiness structures in both Burgundy and Switzerland, disband or march the garrison out of the provinces, raise taxes all the way to Very High and preferably put a remotely positioned governor with as many happiness reducing vices as possible. They shall rebel in no time, upon which the new factions will emerge. The only question is, when. Prior to the event? Seems counterintuitive. After the event? May be a bit too late.
What do you think?

[caravel]

"and preferably put a remotely positioned governor with as many happiness reducing vices as possible."

The governor's distance from his province has no bearing whatsoever on loyalty.

To cause the Swiss or Burgundians to emerge, if you control those provinces, you just have to reduce loyalty to the point of a loyalist revolt after, IIRCC, the start of the late period or thereabouts and when a rebellion occurs it has a very good chance of being one of those factions instead of rebels.

[rvg]

I've seen them both show up in the same game within about 15 years from each other.

[ShadesWolf]

Play in late, and they always appear

[Knight Templar]

Seen them both, Burgundian rebellion only twice, Swiss much more. However, both are usually destroyed in 10-20 years.
I found Swiss very fun to play with.

[ajaxfetish]

Only seen the Burgundians once, but the Swiss fairly often. I wish they were more successful, though.

Ajax

[antisocialmunky]

If you really want to see a super powered Swiss, surround the HRE and attack their border, defeat them and withdrawl and repeat. It'll soak up all the HRE's troops and probably multiple kings. Then let them take out all of Germany when it mass rebels.

[NodachiSam]

Awsome, thanks for the responses!
My problem is I've hardly played late period so by the time of the swiss confederation Switzerland is often under my control. I suppose I'll have to play a few late games now.

[tigger_on_vrb]

I've only seen the burgundians once. I thought it must be a myth before then! The swiss emerge plenty.

[matteus the inbred]

just had the Burgundians emerge in 1350 or thereabouts, with about 5,000 highly teched up troops, following an Italian defeat in Burgundy. they're a rather pretty light blue colour...

seen the Swiss twice, and then only by announcement about the cantons plus the later presence of some rebel Swiss pikemen.

[DukeofSerbia]

I never saw that Swiss or Burgundians reapear as Golden Horde. I play MTW + VI.

[Zain]

I have never seen the Burgundians.... but the Swiss many times.

-ZainDustin

[Divine Wind]

Ive seen both on multiple occasions, more often the swiss though.

[Diehard_TH]

Had the Swiss appear in my current game (Poland early hard), get destroyed by the massive French empire then reappear just as i was steam rollering said French. The second re-appearance is mad, 2-3 full stacks packed full of Swiss Armoured Pikemen, Swiss Pikemen, Swiss Halbardiers, Pavise Arbalesters.

Against my Polish spearmen and mounted sergeants could be fun.

They just sat there for 4-5 years then actually attacked me, not impressed as i'd been trying to ally with them (8 influence king) and then the Danes cancel my alliance as they managed to ally. The Danish isssue is now a problem as I moved my holding army in Saxony a few years ago so i'm expecting a large attack by the Danes, who also re-emerged 30 years ago with some stupidly large stacks of units.

Things are what you might call interesting!

[DukeofSerbia]

I checked files early.txt and high.txt - and yes, there are Burgundians and Swiss as factions. So, they should be show up in the game.

[Joshwa]

The Swiss appeared in my Byzantine game just now. The French, who were in control of Switzerland, had a civil war, and the Swiss popped up the turn after.