The best WWII general?

**Pannonian** · 04-02-2006, 20:55

Originally Posted by Kraxis

Eben Email... Just up that to a hundred such cases and you would have the situation across southern England.

How would they be dropped in southern England? The RAF was intact and fully ready for any attempted invasion. So you're asking heavily laden bombers to cross the Channel when they were expected, with the defenders aware of any concentrations of aircraft and where they were heading, with a large, skilled defending air force armed with extremely effective and modern fighters awaiting them? And as I've said, the Luftwaffe was still reorganising after the lighting Frecnh campaign. Either you're launching an immediate mass combined fighter and transport attack where any losses will not be recovered as you're still based largely in the east, or you reorganise on the ground and give the RAF and British army time to prepare as well. Also, pilots downed over France will fall into German hands, but England and the surrounding seas are British territory.

I think Belgian neutrality was still nominally being respected by the allies at the time of Eben Emael, meaning they could not respond in time. Everywhere surrounding Britain would be regarded as fair game for the British, so they'll have complete freedom of movement and deployment. Anything not clearly identified as friendly in the seas and air around southern England was liable to be attacked, no matter where or who they were.

Also, how are you planning to disembark your main invasion force? All major ports were prepared for destruction should they be capture by the enemy. And how are you planning to transport your main invasion force? Sealion grabbed all the barges they could find, discovered they weren't seaworthy, and there were fewer skilled crew than there were barges. The capriciousness of the Channel is well known (one of the Mulberyy harbours was destroyed by storms a fortnight after its construction despite being firmly anchored and protected by moles of ships). The proposed river barges were discovered to be vulnerable to anything other than an utterly calm sea. Even a passing destroyer could cause enough turbulence to sink them without needing to fire a shot.

**Kagemusha** · 04-02-2006, 21:19

Maybe we should start a new thread about this?This has nothing to do with best General of WWII anymore.

**Craterus** · 04-02-2006, 21:23

There was a Polish general. I only heard about him the other day, and I can't recall the name.

IIRC, he led an entire tank unit from Poland to liberate the Netherlands...

**ShadesPanther** · 04-02-2006, 23:26

Originally Posted by Pannonian

The capriciousness of the Channel is well known (one of the Mulberyy harbours was destroyed by storms a fortnight after its construction despite being firmly anchored and protected by moles of ships). The proposed river barges were discovered to be vulnerable to anything other than an utterly calm sea. Even a passing destroyer could cause enough turbulence to sink them without needing to fire a shot.

May I also point out that that date was the only other avqailable day for a landing in Normandy in 1944.

as for greatest General, I'd have to say Manstein
although heres a relative unknown
Field Marshal Walter Model
not the most reliable source but http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Model

**rotorgun** · 04-09-2006, 19:47

I have two favorite WWII Generals.

General Norman "Dutch" Cota - for his outstanding leadership on Omaha Beach and of the 28th Infantry Division during the Battle of the Bulge. His was a hands on personal approach that all soldiers appreciate. It was he who told the struggling GIs "There are only two kinds of people on this beach, those who are already dead, and those who are going to die...now let's get going!" His stubborn defense of Clervaux to the last delayed the 2nd Panzer Division long enough for the 101st Airborne Division to reach Bastogne.

General der Panzertruppen Gerd Von Manteuffel - For his leadership of the "Grossduetschland" Panzergrenadier Division on the east front, and for his superior leadership of the V Panzer Army during the Ardennes Offensive. He was another frontline General who personally reconnoitered the American positions and recommended a change of plans to Hitler about the opening barrage. He must have been greatly respected for Hitler to even listen to such a suggestion.
His tactics, hard driving leadership, and ability to adapt to changes in plan allowed his forces to make the farthest drive west during the attack. His also held out the longest during the retreat phase.

**Duke Malcolm** · 04-09-2006, 21:02

I cannot say for the Germans, and natural bias makes me think that all British soldiers are inherently better Americans...
I have to agree with many previously and say Slim. Although, he is often overlooked, because he was in command of the "Forgotten" 14th Army. He didn't command in the European Theatre, so is less studied (Monty gets a mention for the struggle to defeat Germany in History classes. British Imperial, and hence Imperial Defence, history is overlooked in Scotland). Slim did not (as far as I am aware) command, fight below, or fight alongside Americans in his most famous struggles...

**Ice** · 04-09-2006, 21:48

This thread is perfect. Does anyone have an "scholary" sources on Zhukov? I have to do a paper on him, and I'm having trouble finding anything.

**English assassin** · 04-10-2006, 14:41

Cunningham's comment about the Crete evacuation

.

Ah yes. Sorry for going OT but I couldn't resist laying that out. Presumably Pannonnian had in mind (when Cunningham was being urged to call off the evalucation in light of the number of ships being attacked from the air):

It takes the Navy three years to build a new ship. It would take three hundred years to build a new tradition.

Cunningham gets my vote as Most Nelsonian Admiral of WW11 anyway.

**Pannonian** · 04-10-2006, 15:04

Originally Posted by English assassin

.
Ah yes. Sorry for going OT but I couldn't resist laying that out. Presumably Pannonnian had in mind (when Cunningham was being urged to call off the evalucation in light of the number of ships being attacked from the air):

" It takes the Navy three years to build a new ship. It would take three hundred years to build a new tradition."

Cunningham gets my vote as Most Nelsonian Admiral of WW11 anyway.

That's what I had in mind, and also when Churchill was told that the Hood was lost, he commented that there was no point in having a navy if one wasn't prepared to use them and lose them. That was the mistake of the German and Italian navies, who kept their ships safe and hence useless in harbour.