A question about access to holy sites

[Don Corleone]

I want to begin by saying that I am not attempting the opening of yet another 'bash Islam' thread. If this degrades into 'what do you expect', then I would like to ask the moderators to close the thread immediately. Likewise, the first person who mentions the crusades or Saladin's reconquest of Jersualem gets Let's stick to a rational discussion of present day events.

That being said, it would appear that muslims have recently decided to not allow Christians or Jews access to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. This is a site that is holy to all 3 of the monotheistic relgions.... it was the site of the Temple of Solomon, it was where Jesus was tried and convicted, and it was where Mohammed ascended into heaven.

I would find it deeply offensive for Christians or Jews to deny access to Al Aqsa to Muslims. My question is why the Waqf, the Muslim caretakers of the Temple Mount, feel entitled to deny access to the rest of us?

Is there something in Islam that demands that when Islam shares a holy site with other religions, the other religions not be allowed to practice their faith or worship there? I'm not trying to inflame passions, I'd really like to know if this is an aspect of Islam, or is it a question of misapplied faith (ala Rev Fred Phelps out in Kansas, lest we Christians get to be too sanctimonious). What can we as Christians, and the Jews out there, do to be allowed to pray and worship at sites that you as Muslims control? If I wanted to go and say a rosary on the Temple Mount, what would it take?

In case you're all scratching your heads, I'm referring to this...
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=49454

The Temple Mount was reopened to non-Muslims in August 2003. It still is open but only Sundays through Thursdays, 7:30 a.m. to 10 a.m. and 12:30 p.m. to 1:30 p.m., and not on any Christian, Jewish or Muslim holidays or other days considered "sensitive" by the Waqf, the Muslim custodians of the Temple Mount.

During "open" days, Jews and Christian are allowed to ascend the Mount, usually through organized tours and only if they conform first to a strict set of guidelines, which includes demands that they not pray or bring any "holy objects" to the site. Visitors are banned from entering any of the mosques without permission of the Wafq. Rules are enforced by Waqf agents, who watch tours closely and alert nearby Israeli police to any breaking of their guidelines.

[Proletariat]

Your link takes me to microsoft.com

Edit: Read the excerpt, removed my question

[KukriKhan]

To be clear Don, you are asking if there is some Qu'ranic prohibition to the very presence of non-believers in designated Muslim holy sites?

Or something else?

[Don Corleone]

Well, both really. Under the best of circumstances, it would appear that the Muslim caretakers of the Temple Mount, the Waqf, only allow limited access to the holy site... it must be treated as an attraction... no prayers or religious objects such as crosses or prayer scrolls allowed. Also, access to non-Muslims is only granted at times the Waqf feel appropriate: Monday through Thursday, and never on a Muslim, Christian, or Jewish holy day. Why?

But now, apparently, all access to non-Muslims has been cut off. Why?

[KukriKhan]

Those are much broader questions, then. Just looking at your word "Now", seems to imply that the access is variable, historically, depending on who is politically/militarily in charge.

I think I remember some Jewish restrictions on who may enter temple, especially inner-sanctums. I don't recall specific Christian prohibitions against non-believers being present in churches. And I confess woeful ignorance of Qu'ranic injunctions... so I guess I'll sit this one out as a reader, with the parting thought that it seems to be political, not religeous - and all tied up in the Jerusalem/East Jerusalem - capital of Israel/capital of Palestine imbroglio.

[master of the puppets]

i know little of the quaran but i have to agree with KukriKhan, its probably nothing relgious, just pompous and self-rightious jerks doing what they want under the guise of religion.

[Dâriûsh]

That being said, it would appear that muslims have recently decided to not allow Christians or Jews access to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem. This is a site that is holy to all 3 of the monotheistic relgions.... it was the site of the Temple of Solomon, it was where Jesus was tried and convicted, and it was where Mohammed ascended into heaven.

Your quote left out this part:

The Temple Mount was opened to the general public until September 2000, when the Palestinians started their intifada by throwing stones at Jewish worshipers after then-candidate for prime minister Ariel Sharon visited the area.

Following the onset of violence, the new Sharon government closed the Mount to non-Muslims, using checkpoints to control all pedestrian traffic for fear of further clashes with the Palestinians.

But I know what you meant, so I'll comment further after I shower.

[Don Corleone]

Your quote left out this part:






But I know what you meant, so I'll comment further after I shower.

Oh, I don't argue. The Wafq has no capability to enforce their rules directly. The article makes it clear that it's the Israeli army, acting on behalf of the Wafq, that keeps non-Muslims from entering the checkpoints and confiscating non-Muslim religious articles.

But they do that to keep the Wafq from inciting a riot. So the Israeli army is the club, not the arm that wields, it in this case.

My question is why Muslims find religious expressions from Christians and Jews, at a site that was holy to Christians for hundreds and Jews for thousands of year before Muhammed was born, so gosh-darned offensive? If the dhimini truly receive equal treatment, and if Islam does call for respect for the other peoples of the book, wouldn't this be an ideal place to prove it? Think of the PR you could get out of that...

<Speaking as a Hamas spokesman>: Folks, we are not terrorists. We welcome Jews to come visit the tomb of the patriarch. Christians are welcome to come and pray in Nazareth or Bethlemhem any time they like. All are welcome to the great holy site of brotherhood, the Al-Aqsa/Temple Mount compound. We will guarantee their safety, and we hope that through this mutual respect of beliefs, Jews and Christians alike can come to see that what is going on in Palestine and Israel is a question of politics and mutual respect, not religious hatred. <end spokestalk>.

If nothing else, you're allowing those on my side of the fence, with whom I do disagree (publicly in this forum, as a matter of fact) to paint you in a very dark light indeed. It's stories like this that generate that 'intolerant' stereotype that Muslims take such offense to.

By the way, my apologies for the broken status of the original link. I fixed it, so it should take you there. Apparently the ghost in the machine didn't care for my choice of link text, so I took it out of URL tags.

[Dâriûsh]

I think both Jews and Christians should have a place of worship on the Temple Mount, if they so desire. Assuming, of course, the Chief Rabbis could agree on whether or not Jews are allowed prayer, let alone access, on the Mount (some prominent members of the Chief Rabbinate banned Jewish access to the mount a long time ago).

However, the main problem is in the last few decades these Wafq guys have managed to claim the entire Mount as a sacred zone, not just the Dome and the Al-Aqsa, and the Israeli government has unfortunately agreed. And as usual neither group cares about the Arab Christians.


Edit:

I believe (although I am not sure) that since the site was captured during the Six-Day War that it was the Government of Israeli which decided that only Muslims should be allowed to pray on the site.

Indeed they did. I guess it was a necessary political decision at the time.

Edit2: Salam Al Khalifah, are you Muslim?

[rory_20_uk]

Out of all the hills in all of Palestine the same one get used for those three events??? What are the odds?

I imagine that the restriction of people can be construed as allowed or forbidden depending on what you read where - and if that's not enough just interperet something and say who wrote it meant the site youhad in mind.

Look at that Christian who was nearly killed in Afghanastan. They got himoff saying he was medically ill which is a cop out really, but since there was no other solution it was the best one could hope for. I've read scholars who have taken views that he should die and that he did nothing wrong - based on different sources.

As usal, God isn't the problem. He just needs to take more time and effort choosing the people who speak on his behalf. IMO he needs to "kick upstairs" those that have misunderstood the message.

[Kanamori]

some prominent members of the Chief Rabbinate banned Jewish access to the mount a long time ago

I didn't think that any sort of Judaism was this centralised. I wonder what is keeping any sort of Jew from saying, "I disagree, it's this way." Does anyone know if reform/reconstructionist Jews are free to enter as they please? Because they have thrown out most of the Talmud and all of the rules that go along with it, following the end of the Temple and Rabbinic period.

[Al Khalifah]

I believe (although I am not sure) that since the site was captured during the Six-Day War that it was the Government of Israeli which decided that only Muslims should be allowed to pray on the site.