What spec of machine do I need?

**Beirut** · 04-02-2006, 14:53

Make sure your new video card supports the Shader 3 option. The Nvidia 6800 cards and up do, as well as the ATI-1800s and up. For my money I would not buy the lesser series cards that support Shader 3, like the ATI 1600 (bad reviews) or the Nvidia 6600 (better choices available). Many of the new games make heavy use of Shader 3. The ATI 1900 is the king of the hill as far as Shader 3 goes. But the cooling fan is very, very loud. My 7800GS AGP handles Shader 3 and is quieter than my 9800Pro.

Also, don't be fooled by the AMD64 specs that say these cards only run at about 2.2 Ghz. They run as fast as much higher clocked Pentium chips. Conventional wisdom these days is that if you're going to play games - then get an AMD CPU.

Even on beastly machines, resolutions higher than 1600x1200 are usually unrealistic. Also, the R:TW in-game res specs can be changed so that you can define the res you want, regardless of your card, but it's a chore to figure it out. I got 1600x1200 with my 9800Pro. It was gorgeous, but I had to limit the size of my units to avoid getting low FPS.

I get my machines built by my local computer dude. he's good, honest, and I know where he lives.

Ask around for reputable computer builders, get references, ask exactly what parts he uses and ask for all the empty boxes when he's finished with your machine, as well as a detailed bill listing those parts and the warranties for the parts as well as the warranties for his work. Don't hand your cash over to some shmuck, make sure you know he's good.

**orangat** · 04-02-2006, 20:41

Dragoncrusader,
If you're upgrading the cpu/mb, go with pci-e. Getting a new agp system makes no sense. The 7800GS is a bad buy because its costs the same as the gt but is much slower.

And if you can spring for a A64 4000+, you might as well go for an X2.

**Beirut** · 04-03-2006, 22:04

Originally Posted by orangat

Dragoncrusader,
If you're upgrading the cpu/mb, go with pci-e. Getting a new agp system makes no sense. The 7800GS is a bad buy because its costs the same as the gt but is much slower.

And if you can spring for a A64 4000+, you might as well go for an X2.

You might be right about the CPU. I'm not up on my X2 tech yet.

I disagree about the video card and AGP system though. Granted, PCI-E is the future, but right now there is enough life left in the AGP architecture to warrant buying an AGP system if money is an issue. You can still put together a very good AGP system that will run games well for the forseeable future, and some good deals can be found on AGP equipment. I find staying about a year behind the times gives me a good machine at a good price that still handles all games.

If money is not an issue, than I agree that PCI-E would be the way to go.

**orangat** · 04-03-2006, 23:27

Originally Posted by Beirut

You might be right about the CPU. I'm not up on my X2 tech yet.

I disagree about the video card and AGP system though. Granted, PCI-E is the future, but right now there is enough life left in the AGP architecture to warrant buying an AGP system if money is an issue. You can still put together a very good AGP system that will run games well for the forseeable future, and some good deals can be found on AGP equipment. I find staying about a year behind the times gives me a good machine at a good price that still handles all games.

If money is not an issue, than I agree that PCI-E would be the way to go.

Money an issue? pci-e mb's aren't more expensive anymore. Why bother with agp when pci-e mb's costs the same and has an upgrade path.

The pci-e versions of the 6800gt/7600gt/x800xl are available for mid-range gamers on a budget. And they cost as much for equivalent agp cards.

The fastest agp card is probably the x850xt-pe. The agp 7800gs is gimped - it costs the same as the 7900gt but has 8 less pipelines and about 20% slower core and to add to the insult, significantly slower than the x850pe in some benchmarks and games.

**Beirut** · 04-04-2006, 00:13

Egads! A vibrant debate.

I bought my BFG AGP 7800GS card for less than the price of an X850XT. They have same pixel and vertex pipelines but the X850XT does not have the Shader 3 option, which is an absolute must for me. I think the 7800GS is a very good card. Then again, so is the X850XT.

I completely agree that AGP is behind PCI-E, but I think AGP still has life in it, more so because good deals can be had on AGP systems. I'm going to be AGP for at least another year and I see no problem running my stuff with the equipment I'll have.

**orangat** · 04-04-2006, 00:44

Originally Posted by Beirut

Egads! A vibrant debate.

I bought my BFG AGP 7800GS card for less than the price of an X850XT. They have same pixel and vertex pipelines but the X850XT does not have the Shader 3 option, which is an absolute must for me. I think the 7800GS is a very good card. Then again, so is the X850XT.

I completely agree that AGP is behind PCI-E, but I think AGP still has life in it, more so because good deals can be had on AGP systems. I'm going to be AGP for at least another year and I see no problem running my stuff with the equipment I'll have.

This is not really a debate. I'm just stating the obvious.

I'm not saying that agp is bad but its not a reasonable choice for a NEW pc when pci-e mbs and video cards costs the same and have an upgrade path.

There is nothing wrong with the 7800gs card except that it costs almost the same as a 7900gt, has 8 less pipes and 20% slower core. Any reasonable person would get the card which is approximately 40% faster in newer games for the same amount of money.