Does anybody know this fresco?

**cunctator** · 04-17-2006, 13:19

Thanks for all the replies. The fresco is from "Sphinx: Geheimnisse der Geschichte" (secrets of history), the companion book to an early 90ties german tv documentary series spanning from the king minos over Hannibal, Cleopatra and the huns to the lost amber room. The author date it to the 5th century AD and claims it is from an eyewitness of the wars with the huns. The book isn't very sorrowly researched and there are quite a lot errors and inaccuracies in it, especially in the hun chapter. Thus probably their dating is onyl speculation because they needed something like this.

**rotorgun** · 04-17-2006, 15:47

Danke Herr Cunctator,

Just curious, but don't the arms and armor of the knight look a bit out of place for the 5th century? They appear to be Norman or Frankish in appearance. The long pointed footwear is a bit medieval as well. I can't quite make out the face of the knight to tell if the helmet has a nasal guard or not, but I think both types were in use in the early middle ages. I have seen some plates of early Germanic soldiers with this type of equipment, so it could be a representation of the late Roman period heavy cavalry. Too bad that the mural wasn't more completed.

**cunctator** · 04-17-2006, 17:47

That's why I don't believe the book when it says 5th century AD. For me a medieval background is much more likely, and I wanted to hear some independent opinions. Helmets with nasal guards were used in late roman times and the soldiers partily looked very medieval but the overall apearance of the lancer and especially the shield doesn't fit into the period.

**rotorgun** · 04-18-2006, 02:05

While this is a stretch, it could be a rendition that was begun to depict a momement during the battle of Chalons. While not definative, the other figure could pass for a Hunnish bowman; he could pass for a Hun and they were known for this type of manuever; but then again, so were the Turkish horsearchers as well. There was a pretty big battle in Anatolia early in the crusades where a crusader army was defeated by such tactics. Do you recall the name? It was a mixed bag of Europeans there as well, along with some German knights.

**cunctator** · 04-18-2006, 21:48

I think at Dorylaeum in Anatolia 1097 against the seljuks the crusaders encountered great numbers of horse archers the first time. It finally was a victory for them but with very high casualties.

**rotorgun** · 04-24-2006, 17:58

Originally Posted by cunctator

I think at Dorylaeum in Anatolia 1097 against the seljuks the crusaders encountered great numbers of horse archers the first time. It finally was a victory for them but with very high casualties.

Thank you, I've been trying to remember that for some time. Do you think this could be a rendition of a moment in the battle?