Protectorates

[Iskandr]

Is there any way to just kill these? I mean, remove them from the game entirely? Or at least a console command to break specific ones while you play? Maybe 1.5 will fix things, but for now, they're a real game killer, completely destroy any balance in the campaign.

Thanks,
Iskandr

[GodEmperorLeto]

In what way are they wrecking your campaign, out of curiosity?

[Dooz]

A lot of AI factions acquire protectorates, and the submitting factions lay dormant and nothing much happens with them for years.

[Greek_fire19]

That sounds pretty realistic to me; although I personally would rather protectorates were removed and it was just assumed that a type 4 government represented a type of protectorate, which it sort of does.

Protectorates just seem kind of useless to me. Except for the money.

[Mad Guitar Murphy]

I have never been able to persuade any nation to become a protectorate, even with most of their empire taken and the remaining cities besieged they never seem to like the idea.

The only situation in which i could get a prectorate was when I had taken all seleucid lands with parthia and so the seleucids offered to become a protectorate in exchange for all their lost lands.... not really a charming offer

[soibean]

Ive never been able to acquire any protectorates either
Ive gotten a nation down to 1 city and they will never surrender their freedom to blah blah blah
The AI works these negotiations with their magic and will get massive donations per turn, both from their protectorates and from the plus 20k per turn. I dont know if you guys took that out or if Im misunderstanding it but that happened before the patch.

[Iskandr]

I think it is also largely due to the save/load bug- even if, as a player, you refuse to take advantage of it, the computer doesn't, so you end up with computers having huge multiple protectorates, making them incredibly rich. At the same time, it's virtually impossible for the human player to ever get one, not that the human needs the advantage anyway though. Also, I have noticed that a faction can be a protectorate of more than one other faction. Very annoying. So no one knows how to break these protectorates?

Iskandr

[We all need someone]

Protectorates ain't useless, though you have to know when and where to offer them with the quirky AI. Usually when you've had several heroic-type victories wiping out the majority of a nation's forces, and your troops are invading, but not besieging anything.(I think besieging the capital gives away any hope of a Protectorate, although that capital is usually the most dangerous city in terms of recruitment, etc.) However, I'll admit that in EB it is much harder than say, RTR or RTW vanilla.

However, I also agree the Type 4 governments are supposed to symbolize some sort of "Protectorate" agreement. However, we shall see what the big new recipe for Type 4 the EB team is cooking.

[nikolai1962]

So no one knows how to break these protectorates?Iskandr

Porting to 1.5 may well help this problem if it is related to the save/load bug (which seems very plausible). The romans making a protectorate out of gaul early on is an obvious case where it makes a huge difference to the game as the romans stop expanding entirely. Naval expansion happens a bit more in 1.5but it still seems to be mostly short distances (which is ok imo).

I don't think there is a modding way to break protectorates. You can sometimes do it in game if you have enough cash and the alliances are just right by bribing one faction to attack another i.e you bribe the protector into attacking a faction that is allied to their protectorate. Not much of a solution though.

There are new bugs in 1.5 (apparently) but the fixed ones and the improved ai more than make up for them imo.

[Cheexsta]

I have never been able to persuade any nation to become a protectorate, even with most of their empire taken and the remaining cities besieged they never seem to like the idea.

The only situation in which i could get a prectorate was when I had taken all seleucid lands with parthia and so the seleucids offered to become a protectorate in exchange for all their lost lands.... not really a charming offer

It's easiest to make protectorates when you declare war on them and they ask for a ceasefire. Simply demand they become a protectorate and they'll ask for a fair amount of money. If you have enough money and/or land, voila, you have a protectorate.

But to the original topic, I would much prefer it if protectorates were removed altogether as well. However, I don't see any method of doing it...

[Dooz]

There are new bugs in 1.5 (apparently) but the fixed ones and the improved ai more than make up for them imo.

What are the new bugs? Haven't played 1.5 yet.

[nikolai1962]

What are the new bugs? Haven't played 1.5 yet.

I haven't seen any yet personally but i read on forums there are bugs with siege towers and large stone walls. Which isn't too bad.

[Simmons]

I haven't seen any yet personally but i read on forums there are bugs with siege towers and large stone walls. Which isn't too bad.

That same bug happens in 1.2 to some people.

[QwertyMIDX]

There's a bug with AI use of foot achers too and they're not firing on heavily armored units.

[Dayve]

Foot archers firing at heavily armoured units is a good bug... Firing at heavily armoured units is a waste of archer ammo anyway and it means they'll do more damage to you by firing at lighter units/cavalry...

[soibean]

unless of course they're firing into the flank of heavy infantry, which would decimate them if they're being attacked already
but on the other hand Ive only seen the AI do this once in a battle... not through maneuvering, but because they had archers as reinforcements and appeared behind my guys

[nikolai1962]

I think the bug you get with archers (sometimes) is not them choosing to shoot at less-armoured guys instead of heavy-armoured guys. The bug is when they see their arrows are no good against the unit in front of them so they charge instead.

[Ludens]

There are new bugs in 1.5 (apparently) but the fixed ones and the improved ai more than make up for them imo.

There is some memory leak problems (far less than 1.3) and a couple of minor things (siege towers not fitting, Romans using pila in close combat, archers not firing but charging) but that's about it. Compared to the issues with 1.2 this is nothing.

[nikolai1962]

There is some memory leak problems (far less than 1.3) and a couple of minor things (siege towers not fitting, Romans using pila in close combat, archers not firing but charging) but that's about it. Compared to the issues with 1.2 this is nothing.

Yep. And the benefits are huge.

I actually quite enjoy the vanilla 1.5 game in small doses as long as i'm not playing a faction i know anything about. I am drooling at the thought of playing a historical mod built on the improvements in 1.5. Drooling.

[Telys]

I dont know if this is a bug it just really bothered me in 1.5 when fighting a naval battle in a cove the enemy can withdraw when cornered and my ships are blocking the way out. I believe I was the julii and I attacked a macedonian fleet near the port of corinth, I won and they withdrew by sailing straight through me.

[Dooz]

Yep. And the benefits are huge.

I actually quite enjoy the vanilla 1.5 game in small doses as long as i'm not playing a faction i know anything about. I am drooling at the thought of playing a historical mod built on the improvements in 1.5. Drooling.

Yeah, I've soiled myself on more than one occasion in anticipation for the ported version.