Fall/Siege of Constantinople

[edyzmedieval]

We all know Constantinople fell the the Turks at the end of the Medieval Period. Cannons have always been attributed to the Turkish victory.

Actually the Fall of Constantinople was a lengthy process. The fall started along with 1204. That really marked a turning point. Slowly, the Turks gained territory as the emperors neglected the middle class, turning their attention to Stratiots or Pronoias.

But it didn't work out, so in 1453, it fell forever.

Mehmet would have conquered Constantinople without cannons much much harder. Constantinople could have been constantly supplied by the ships, if he didn't construct the 2 fortresses on the entrances to the Bosphor: Rumeli Hissar and Boghaz Kessen. Those 2 stopped the ships with their cannons from entering the Bosphor to supply the city.

And the fact is, Orban is considered Magyar, but he was born in Transylavania. At that time, Transylvania was part of Hungary. But in modern days, it belongs to Romania. So basically, I am really ashamed and angry of him.

And another fact, which is really historical. The Hungarian diplomat sent by Janos Hunyiadi(born also in Transylavania) told the Ottoman bombers the triangle wall bombardment. THAT brought the walls down!!! Because of a diplomat sent to act in the interests of the Byzantines!!!

As for the Kerkoporta, I really doubt it had such a big impact.

Discuss please.

[Rosacrux redux]

Attack of the clone-topics

Damn, you copied many of the ideas in the relevant topic in TWC, didn't you? Well, I've given a deailed view there, not gonna do that again here.

[Kagemusha]

I saw that too Edyz...About the siege of Constatinopole if you want to read a heart touching novel about it.please read Mika Waltaris(the author of Sinuhet)Novel Mikael Angelos. Its the best Novel of that siege i have ever read.

[edyzmedieval]

We got a romanian writer who wrote a 2 book novel called "Fall of Constantinople".
Really touching...

Maybe I'll read the one you Kage proposed.
And as for Rosacrux, leave it. People here have a much different opinion.

[Rosacrux redux]

...meaning?

[Kagemusha]

Guys this is monastery.Take it easy

[Idomeneas]

I saw that too Edyz...About the siege of Constatinopole if you want to read a heart touching novel about it.please read Mika Waltaris(the author of Sinuhet)Novel Mikael Angelos. Its the best Novel of that siege i have ever read.

Its ''Ioannis Aggelos'' and indeed its very good novel. Very emotionaly charged, but good.

[Randarkmaan]

So basically, I am really ashamed and angry of him.

For letting the Byzantine empire fall?
Actually for much of the late 14th and the 15th century the Byzantine empire was but a vassal of the Ottoman state. I don't think the Ottomans would have had to wait long before the Byzantines would have handed the city over to them peacefully.

[edyzmedieval]

I am angry for Orban. He left the Byzantines because they couldn't supply them with materials!!!!

[Kagemusha]

Its ''Ioannis Aggelos'' and indeed its very good novel. Very emotionaly charged, but good.

Its Mikael Angelos in the original language its written.

[Prince Cobra]

Actually the Fall of Constantinople was a lengthy process. The fall started along with 1204. That really marked a turning point.Slowly, the Turks gained territory as the emperors neglected the middle class, turning their attention to Stratiots or Pronoias.
Edyz, as far as I understood you your point is that Byzantium went into a permanent decline since 1204. However some Nicaean emperors like John III Duca Vatatzes ran very successful policy that made Nicaea stable. At that time the Turkish threat was ellimainated because of the system of border forts and special kind of units Akritois. This emperor tolerated the minor pronoais who were the soldiers of the empire. The decline started when Michael Palaelogus usurped the throne. He was the leader of the major nobility and as a result he tolerated them too much. That was the beginning of the end because he made the Akritois and minor nobility vulnerable to the attempts of the major aristocracy to take their lands. So IMHO the turning point was the reign of Michael VIII Palaelogus.

[Prince Cobra]

Now on the topic. The fact about the hungarian diplomat is not surprising. The Christian 'collaboration' with the Ottoman Turks is not surprising- there was a significant number of Christian vassals in the early Ottoman army.During the siege of Constantinople the Genoese were not very loyal to the Christian cause. They refused to burn the wooden rails that had to transport the ottoman ships by land (by the way also buld by an Italian engineer (Christian)) to the 'Golden horn'. And human gluttony and greediness are endless.

P.S. I wish you success and inspiration because to write a good story for such a significant historical event like falling of Constantinople is not easy. Good luck!

[edyzmedieval]

The Akritoi dissapeared under Mihail Paleologos, because he neglected the borders. They started to desert to the Turks, slowly leaving the borders of the Byzantine Empire with no defence.

And thank you. I shall post the 10th chapter soon!

[Watchman]

Its Mikael Angelos in the original language its written.

I could swear it's "Johannes Angelos" (I've seen the English translation titled "Dark Angel", incidentally) - you sure you're not confusing it with the Mikael Karvajalka books ? Mind you, I thought those were better too...

As for Urban the artillerist (or cannonsmith, or whatever he now technically speaking was), who cares ? There's never been any shortage of mercenaries and disgruntled professionals leaving for greener pastures anywhere, was there ? The man had marketable skills, so it is only natural he sought the best money he could get for them. Regardless of what the official dogma and propaganda was, people on both sides had the pesky habit of quite often being rather flexible in these things too. Just look at the strange love-hate soap opera relationship the Venetians and Ottomans had...

[Kagemusha]

Watchman you are right.Its Johannes Angelos.Poor old Kages memory isnt anymore what it used to be.

[Watchman]

Am I not always ?