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  1. #1

    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    For one, they want to double-dip and charge websites (eg. Google) as well as the customer. If it is a telephone, they want to charge both ends of the line, not just the caller. If it was mail, they want to charge not just the sender for stamps but also the recipient.

  2. #2
    Nobody expects the Senior Member Lemur's Avatar
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    Red face Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    Quietus, you nail the problem squarely. The network providers are in a hissy fit that they're not seeing the profits that Google, Yahoo and Amazon are making, and rather than attempting to compete with a better product (the Free Market way) they're attempting to put chokepoints and legislation in their favor (the Soviet way). I have nothing but contempt for them.

    Depressing conclusions reaced at Ars Technica:

    Any sort of Congressional endorsement of network neutrality seems a long shot at this point. Last month, Sen. Ron Wyden (D-OR) introduced net neutrality legislation in the Senate that would have had the same effect as the defeated House amendment. However, given the current climate in Washington, its prospects do not appear strong. Part of the blame for that may lay with Google, Microsoft, and other companies that rely on the Internet for a significant chunk of their business. According to a C|net report, the telecoms are far more invested in lobbying than their opponents, spending over three times the amount of money. Maybe it's time for Google, Yahoo!, and Amazon to build a serious presence on Capitol Hill.

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    Arena Senior Member Crazed Rabbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    The free market way is not to pour more regulation to stop companies from doing things you don't like. Consumers (not you, or your congressman) will choose which they like better. And if you don't like it, don't use verizon or AT&T for internet, but don't try and stop the company from doing something that you don't like through legislation. And certainly don't even attempt to claim that legislation is 'the free market way'.

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    Nobody expects the Senior Member Lemur's Avatar
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    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    CR, if I had more faith in the Republicans, I would reach the same conclusions you have. Unfortunately I do not see them in that light. The current Dem proposal was not great, but I would like to see some sort of endorsement of net neutrality come out of that bog of corruption we call "Congress."

    A free market needs good controls and regulation to function. It's one of life's funny little paradoxes. If I have no incentive not to sell asbestos hot dogs, I just might do it. My imperative is to maximize my profits, period. If society wants any other perogative, it has to be imposed through some sort of rules.

    Ask any economist about it. Regulation and a free market -- the oddball couple that makes life great!

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    Member Member Alexander the Pretty Good's Avatar
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    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    The consumer, acting on his own, won't buy many asbestos hot dogs. Even if it is a good name for punk band.

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    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by article
    "This is not Chicken Little, the sky is not falling, we're not going to change the direction of the axis of the earth on this vote," said Rep. John Shimkus, an Illinois Republican. He said overregulatory Net neutrality provisions would amount to picking winners and losers in the marketplace and discourage investment in faster connections that will benefit consumers.

    Last week, Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman Joe Barton said: "Before we get too far down the road, I want to let the market kind of sort itself out, and I'm not convinced that we really have a problem with Net neutrality."
    I agree with both of those statements.
    The American Conservative Union, the National Taxpayers Union, former House Majority Leader Dick Armey's FreedomWorks, and Citizens Against Government Waste were among the signers of a letter Friday that said the Democrat-backed proposal would let the FCC "exercise complete discretion over the Internet."

    "At the very least," the letter cautioned, "the vague terminology could lead to an explosion of litigation, which would, in turn, deter capital investments in technology and thwart the evolution of the Internet."

    Republican insider Grover Norquist of Americans for Tax Reform, which opposes tax hikes, added in a letter on Tuesday that "a network neutrality provision in any form would begin down the dangerous path of Internet regulation.
    Again I totally agree. This has nothing to do with trusting Republicans Lemur- they're not imposing regulation or anything else. It's about trusting free-markets and the innovation that has made the Internet the unbelievable success it is today. You're not going to get that growth and innovation by having overstuffed politicians imposing uneeded regulations and red tape.


    This is 'foot in the door' government regulation for a problem that doesnt even currently exist. Or as us techies say its 'a solution looking for a problem'.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemur
    Ask any economist about it. Regulation and a free market -- the oddball couple that makes life great!
    Most regulation is just an attempt to fix problems created by earlier government meddling.
    Last edited by Xiahou; 04-07-2006 at 00:38.
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    Dyslexic agnostic insomniac Senior Member Goofball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Alexander the Pretty Good
    The consumer, acting on his own, won't buy many asbestos hot dogs.
    But consumers acting on their own will buy billions of cigarettes every year, which are just about as palatable and certainly as carcinogenic as asbestos hot dogs. This fact pokes a bit of a hole in the theory that consumers will always act rationally and in their own best interests.

    So while I agree in principal that markets are best off with as little government interference as possible, I do believe that there are certain minimum levels of regulation that are required. Mainly because people are idiots and do need some protection both from themselves and from the greed of those willing totake advantage of their idiocy.
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  8. #8
    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: Republicans Defeat Net Neutrality Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Goofball
    But consumers acting on their own will buy billions of cigarettes every year, which are just about as palatable and certainly as carcinogenic as asbestos hot dogs. This fact pokes a bit of a hole in the theory that consumers will always act rationally and in their own best interests.
    Well, at least we have the government to protect us from cigarettes.

    Honestly though, when I think it through, just about the only need for government meddling I can think of is in fact environmental regulation. I dont doubt problems would sort themselves out here too over time, but Im not convinced the markets would react before significant damage is done. And even that should be sensible and as unobstrusive as possible.
    Last edited by Xiahou; 04-07-2006 at 00:43.
    "Don't believe everything you read online."
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