MP faction

[FearofNC]

I can think of a reason, Ca would have to add in a new faction, and balance it entirely sepearately from all the other factions. How about we just wait and see how well MIITW is balanced?

this would take 2 people 1 day of work... the stats have already been balanced with stw1.03.. graphics wise you would need 1 custom image to put on the banners and faction selection screen.

mtw2 will be balanced.. im sure of that... knights will take 2 turns to produce and their upkeep rates will balance them against weak spear units. this however means nothing when you play online. mtw2 nor any verion of tw will be balanced online.. simply impossible when sp and mp stats are the same.

If you want to make sure that tactics are decisive in an RTW multiplayer game then just use the same faction and the same or nearly similar armies.

plz read above again... its not that simple... faction vs faction is not balanced taticly if the factions themselves arent balanced to begin with. trust those that were there.. ive played tw for 6 years now.. why would i lie to you about this? im not asking for samurai units cause i miss the stw era.. (although that would be icing on the cake) just the stats used in that version.. dont knock it till you try it :)

[Darren_Shan]

dear NC

as i said above.. (thats my last post) i wouls be veyr happy if CA would listen to "us" about including these "rules" in the game

i just pointed out that IN MY OPINION rtw is more tactical.. but again this is MY opinion

*bows*

[FearofNC]

very well... i understand your points... i appericate your support for the mp faction and we agree to disagree on the rtw vs stw thing... everyone is entitled to their opinions afterall :)

*hands darren mug of elmo shine*

any stw player will recall how prized elmo shine was.. good thing for me that our clan stockpiled this rare and potent beverage :D

[Darren_Shan]

yay then we are cleared.. good luck with ur clan m8

[Brighdaasa]

... the stats have already been balanced with stw1.03..

yeh, but those stats are for units with completely different physics and game mechanics, careful rebalancing would still be needed
eg. cav charges and charge impact have hugely different mechanics in STW and RTW, hence most probably also in MII:TW

[allfathersgodi]

Personally, I am against an MP faction, anyone can beat another opponent if everything is equal. The true test is adversity, over-coming.

Look at Alexander who often fought out-numbered, look at Erwin Rommel, possibly the greatest General since Lee, who fought a desperate war in appaling circumstances with crappy Allies (Italians) very rarely with the supplies he needed (Armchair Generals talk tactics, Professional Generals talk Logistics) and cut-off from support...

Hannibal (anyone with a brain and big brass balls would've gone for the end-run, but the idiot didn't bring Siege Equipment) who marched an Army across the Alps.

Look at Genghis Khan who often fought out-numbered...

That being said, I would like a tweek to the game engine that would allow much more maneuver based warfare instead of the attritional warfare you saw in M:TW...

[FearofNC]

Personally, I am against an MP faction, anyone can beat another opponent if everything is equal. The true test is adversity, over-coming.

adversity is welcome... in stw i could take on armies 2v1 with a better than 50% success rate.. never since then have i been able to use my skill to such effect. when our clan battled in 3v3 or 4v4 we would always play on mountain maps to allow our oppenents drastic height bonuses.. then there was always the challenge of fighting a famous general like Fearamp or Magyar Kahn..

and if you think anyone can beat anyone when things are equal you never faced amp, magy, myself or any of the other well recongonized experts... the only luck involved was when 2 generals of equall abilities fought to almost a draw and the death of a general caused one army to rout first.

anyways.. being "against" including a mp faction is a bit upsetting to me... its not just that i take it personally because its my idea.. why be against any option that would cause some players to enjoy the game more when you have the choice of not playing with it..

[Furious Mental]

"faction vs faction is not balanced taticly if the factions themselves arent balanced to begin with."

I've read that ten times and it still makes no sense. If you are using the same units how else can you win or lose except by being smart or dumb?

[FearofNC]

you win by knowing how to stand in one place and throw pila...

[x-dANGEr]

NC, it just seems you haven't adapted to R: TW, that is all. Their is a rock scissors paper work out in R: TW. Get a praetorian cav to charge a triarii and see what happens, get a swordmen unit fight a triarii and see what happens. Every game has it's tactics, and you just need to adapt to them, not to bring the old stats into them. BTW: The SP and MP stats aren't the same, actually I think their is something wrong in BI unit stats, a clibs unit for the ERE costs 1800 denarii in SP, but in MP it costs 1390. While a Sass Cata cost 1400 in SP and MP.. Thus, giving a huge advantage to ERE..

[buujin]

yeh, but those stats are for units with completely different physics and game mechanics, careful rebalancing would still be needed
eg. cav charges and charge impact have hugely different mechanics in STW and RTW, hence most probably also in MII:TW

He's right. The RTW engine is completely different and has many flaws which is why even with limitless tweaking u can never retain the same balance and gameplay that STW/MTW had. I suspect this is the same Engine which will be used in M2:TW. Sadly, In this case the unit stats are irrelevant.

The balance in mtw was not ruined by having too many different troop types to choose from, it was ruined by valour upgrades which made some troops more cost effective than others to upgrade (FMAA for example). I believe this was also a problem in some previous versions of STW.

Imo Having true balance can only be obtained by taking each troop type at face value relative to its initial price and not upgrading it , (ala Mizus STW mod and DUX mp mod for VI).

[Duke John]

Then you should be glad to hear that Napoleonic: Total War 2 has disabled the upgrading of troops.

[Darren_Shan]

any luck to let CA know of this?

[L'Impresario]

Then you should be glad to hear that Napoleonic: Total War 2 has disabled the upgrading of troops.

That is an excellent choice IMO, and a first step - and I think that many more would be still neded if RTW is an indicator of what will come- for more diverse gameplay and easily determined "balance" in M2TW would be an option allowing you to play at a fixed valour level. I 'm making here the assumption that V0 will be quite unstable for purposes outside the campaign, and I'm also hoping that every valour/honour/experience level will have more easily discernable changes in the unit stats - ofcourse changing this system for something else, at least online, would be more than welcome, but anyway;)

[cromwell]

I agree it would be nice to have a bonus faction for the purists of MP. Saying the troops are the same and move the same and where is the challenge in that. I submit to you where is the challenge in the game of chess, both sides have the same pieces. It's how u use them!

Their is no denying that as each version of TW games have come out, the MP community has added more and more rules. This alone shows the inbalance. It's a joke now, 6max, no ele, no zerks, no catabrian, ......etc.

You can expand the rock,paper,scissors, to 5 or 7 items, you just have to follow the mathmatical formula. If CA were vigilant about keeping this true, we wouldn't have the online problems we face today.

PS. We could go about this for years...lol

Cromwell