New screenshot (21 April)

[Lord Adherbal]

should we start on a bug report already ?

[Duke John]

How good is a game if the players want a patch based on promotional screenshots?

[edwardusbenedictus]

I agree CA has over looked this and Hope they'll fix it b4 the release the game and Not work it out on a patch!!!!

[Ultras DVSC]

I think this screen was captured during a historical battle, by name at Crécy. The extremely wide fighting line (almost 2 km!), the slope which wasn't too favourable to the French, the pales sticking out from the ground (their aim was to inhibit the French knights from rushing the longbowmen) all prove that.

[x-dANGEr]

Lets hope those flaming arrows don't turn into napalm bombs and burn troops to crisp on first contact..

And, I hope they don't result in lag while they're igniting.

I really don't bother looking so deep in a screen shot. After all, I won't be looking closely in the battle anyway, I'll be commanding, from a high zoom, that I may not see these flaws, that propably will be fixed.

[Watchman]

I think this screen was captured during a historical battle, by name at Crécy. The extremely wide fighting line (almost 2 km!), the slope which wasn't too favourable to the French, the pales sticking out from the ground (their aim was to inhibit the French knights from rushing the longbowmen) all prove that.

Except that was the sort of deployement the English adopted whenever they could. And pikes in practice weren't in offensive use outside the Swiss for the entire Hundred Years' War.

Wide front lines were the norm for major field battles - when you deploy tens of thousands of men and horses for battles, the frontage obviously tends to end pretty impressive. Anyway, as the English were habitually starkly outnumbered in the more famous battles (and not all that rarely in the smaller ones) they would attempt to force battle in conditions and terrain that forced the French to advance division by division, instead of the entire line abreast (so much as that now was really doable with feudal S-and-C anyway). That's basic tactics for countering numerical advantage really.

[Ciaran]

And, I hope they don't result in lag while they're igniting.

I really don't bother looking so deep in a screen shot. After all, I won't be looking closely in the battle anyway, I'll be commanding, from a high zoom, that I may not see these flaws, that propably will be fixed.

Basically, I agree, most of the time you won´t notice glitches like that, or at least I wouldn´t, but it´s just that bit of polish. And it´s not as if that´s new, even in MTW I there was the odd weapon placement (compare vanilla MTW with the Middle Earth mod, especially in case of the cavalry and you´ll see what I mean).

[cannon_fodder]

The screenshot looks kinda dull to me. And those pike heads are uuuugly. But it's good to finally see some pikemen, as someone else said.

[hsimoorb]

Meh, I was hoping that fire arrows would just drop off the face of the earth and never plauge the Total War series ever again...but, there they are.

[Lord Adherbal]

now if they could light things on fire that would make them interesting. And I mean dry grass in the middle of a hot summer, or wooden buildings - NOT metal clad soldiers.

[Dutch_guy]

now if they could light things on fire that would make them interesting. And I mean dry grass in the middle of a hot summer, or wooden buildings - NOT metal clad soldiers.

Such a feature would be great !

However I don't see this happening really, I imagine it would take quite some time to implement this and rid it of the bugs it would most certainly have.

[Spino]

I'm not one to go lightly on historical accuracy but you fellows obsessed with the presence of quivers on the backs of those pikemen need to keep in mind that the game is still in the alpha stages and is a long way from going beta. Crude, incomplete & placeholder graphics, sounds, etc., are the norm for pre-beta builds.

I would sooner see people campaigning like mad for improved AI & a return of the Glorious Achievments campaign objectives than nitpicking 3D models & textures, both of which can easily be rectified via modding.

[Duke John]

What do you mean with easily? How big is the chance that CA gives us a model importer/exporter soon after the release. Most likely we will be waiting months until we can change a model.

And even then, CA is contantly speaking about how wonderful the game looks like and not how well the AI fights. I think it serves them right if we tell them how much glaring mistakes there still are. It does say something about how polished the AI or the game mechanics might be, especially when looking back at the mess of R:TW. I mean the graphics are supposed to be the primary selling point of M2:TW, if they can't get that right, what does that tell us about the other content?

[Orda Khan]

Yep, CA chose to improve RTW/BI by sticking that terrible red square on the Hun generals. That was some improvement

.......Orda

[Spino]

What do you mean with easily? How big is the chance that CA gives us a model importer/exporter soon after the release. Most likely we will be waiting months until we can change a model.

And even then, CA is contantly speaking about how wonderful the game looks like and not how well the AI fights. I think it serves them right if we tell them how much glaring mistakes there still are. It does say something about how polished the AI or the game mechanics might be, especially when looking back at the mess of R:TW. I mean the graphics are supposed to be the primary selling point of M2:TW, if they can't get that right, what does that tell us about the other content?

As I recall the ability to mod the 3D graphics & textures in Rome happened rather quickly, so quickly in fact that the relevant files were identified & converted for use with 3D modeling apps soon after the game was released. Let's not even count the sheer number of graphics mods that followed. On the other hand modding the AI in Rome went only as far as changing the formations & formation priorities in the relevant text file (which helped somewhat but not nearly enough to cure the AI of it's brainless habits) and this was due to the diligent efforts of one person (Darthmod) and his personal crusade in making the AI put up a better fight. So comparatively speaking changing graphics/3D models = easy, changing gameplay/AI = hard if not impossible. If Medieval 2 is going to win back many of the disgruntled, disilllusioned hardcore TW fans it needs to not only be superior to Rome in terms of AI & gameplay but files related to those categories need to be far more moddable than any previous installment of the series.

CA is talking about how good the game will look because that's what helps sells games. Medieval sold over one million copies in its entire run, Rome sold well over one million copies in a fraction of the time. Why? Because it looked phenomenal in pre-release screenshots & movies. The fact that some pikemen in a screenshot taken from an alpha-build of Medieval 2 is sporting some incorrect gear will probably be lost on the average gamer and to my eyes, seems to be a strange thing to get upset over because it's a safe bet to say errors like that won't be present in the retail release!

If Medieval 2 winds up looking 100% historically accurate and yet is as unchallenging and dull as Rome would you be happier about plunking down your $50 for it?!? Modders vastly improved the look of Rome after it was released so I don't see the logic in getting worked up over how Medieval 2 is going to look when it hits the shelves.

I don't know about the rest of you but I'm far more concerned with how this goose is going to taste when its served, not how good it looks sitting on my plate.

[Duke John]

On the other hand modding the AI in Rome went only as far as changing the formations & formation priorities in the relevant text file (which helped somewhat but not nearly enough to cure the AI of it's brainless habits) and this was due to the diligent efforts of one person (Darthmod) and his personal crusade in making the AI put up a better fight. So comparatively speaking changing graphics/3D models = easy, changing gameplay/AI = hard if not impossible.

Very few modders are looking at the AI, because so many are still busy with the graphics. It is easy if you have the skills and the tool, but that doesn't mean that it is a piece of cake to fix hundreds of flaws made by CA. That takes alot of time, just look at how long EB or any other great mods are taking to finish. Darth Vader did make any graphical changes, or he took them from other mods/modders, that is why he was able to focus on AI, it was the only thing he had attention for.