Some early reflections of a newbie

[Guyus Germanicus]

Yeeeehaaaaaa! (newbie warcry ) I've finished two short campaigns now on easy/easy. Have been practising my screen management control a bit and am ready to start fighting more of my battles personally while kicking up the campaign level to medium. I think I'm learning to manage my money better too. The Julii were especially tough in this department But I had a bad habit of spending everything I made queuing up "build" lists in some cities and leaving no cash left for emergencies. So, I have been queuing only one building project at a time and hitting up my neighbors for map info money. That has kept a little extra cash flowing into the coffers. I've also put emphasis on economic building projects rather than following Victoria's advice on everything. That has helped.

I've been using assassins on enemy diplomats and spies. Some are more vulnerable than others. But, foremost, I learned a very expensive lesson about Britannic chariots in Trier. I had the city besieged three times with superior forces and excellent generals (mind you, this is in easy/easy mode). Three times on auto-resolve the Brits fought my legions off - ignominious defeat. I couldn't figure out what the heck the problem was. I finished the campaign against the Gauls, thereby winning the game, before Trier fell. So I continued the campaign and surrounded the city once more - fourth time - and chose to handle the campaign myself to see what the difficulty was. There were four Brit family members in the city with their heavy chariot units. They didn't even contest from the walls. My Hastati breached the wall in two places. The chariots were simply waiting in the town square for my legions to form and approach. Thankfully I was Equite heavy - I had six units of Equites, the Roman General's heavy cavalry, and one unit of barbarian cavalry for the battle. Still in my clumsiness, two of my Hastati got routed. It took persistent charges from my cavalry to finish off these chariots. So British chariots are worth something, if only against inexperienced newbies like me.
The Brutii are defintely my favorite faction so far with their Velite Gladiators and all their rich "wonder" targets. I love this game!

[vonsch]

Yeeeehaaaaaa! (newbie warcry ) I've finished two short campaigns now on easy/easy. Have been practising my screen management control a bit and am ready to start fighting more of my battles personally while kicking up the campaign level to medium. I think I'm learning to manage my money better too. The Julii were especially tough in this department But I had a bad habit of spending everything I made queuing up "build" lists in some cities and leaving no cash left for emergencies. So, I have been queuing only one building project at a time and hitting up my neighbors for map info money. That has kept a little extra cash flowing into the coffers. I've also put emphasis on economic building projects rather than following Victoria's advice on everything. That has helped.

I've been using assassins on enemy diplomats and spies. Some are more vulnerable than others. But, foremost, I learned a very expensive lesson about Britannic chariots in Trier. I had the city besieged three times with superior forces and excellent generals (mind you, this is in easy/easy mode). Three times on auto-resolve the Brits fought my legions off - ignominious defeat. I couldn't figure out what the heck the problem was. I finished the campaign against the Gauls, thereby winning the game, before Trier fell. So I continued the campaign and surrounded the city once more - fourth time - and chose to handle the campaign myself to see what the difficulty was. There were four Brit family members in the city with their heavy chariot units. They didn't even contest from the walls. My Hastati breached the wall in two places. The chariots were simply waiting in the town square for my legions to form and approach. Thankfully I was Equite heavy - I had six units of Equites, the Roman General's heavy cavalry, and one unit of barbarian cavalry for the battle. Still in my clumsiness, two of my Hastati got routed. It took persistent charges from my cavalry to finish off these chariots. So British chariots are worth something, if only against inexperienced newbies like me.
The Brutii are defintely my favorite faction so far with their Velite Gladiators and all their rich "wonder" targets. I love this game!

Chariots are intimidating, you take morale hits. But they have little defense so go down easily. The trick is to attack them. Oull them to a crossroads and have units sitting ready to flank them. Be over in seconds.

I learned this trying to use generals in chariots the same way I do heavy cav generals. Bad idea. Kept getting my generals very quickly.

Bump up to medium/medium. Easy is just tutorial. You get too much help and will learn bad habits you'll have to break. Campaign mode on hard isn't that bad either. But if you want to work on battle command skills, leaving that on medium too means less micromanagement.

The really cool thing about this series is how different factions can be. Learn to play the Romans and then try something radically different like horse archer armies, or chariot and warband/berserker/whacked out wierdos. Managing a tightly disciplined infantry army is very different from missile cavalry. And there's nothing like the screaming hordes for wildness (I've barely scratched the surfaces of those guys, but they seem to LIKE being scratched... ritual scars, ya know?)

Oh, you can queue up lots at once (as long as the denarii holds out). If you need the denarii back, just cancel all but whatever is actually currently in progress. Some of us who micromanage use governors with good build skills to line up lots of building work, and those with unit training skills to line up lots of units, then rearrange the queue as necessary on the fly. Then send the governor off to the next city to set that one up, and the next. If an emergency pops up (The Huns are coming! The Huns are coming!), no big deal, you get the same denarii refunded. (Of course you have to set everything back up after things are under control...)

Of course, in tough games with immature economies you just don't have the spare denarii to do this, but in those situations you rarely have a governor who can save you much anyway.

Anyway, enjoy, and welcome.

[Guyus Germanicus]

Many thanks Master Vonsch for your kind remarks. I played another short campaign, with the Scipii, and ran into Egyptian chariots. I mopped them up without any trouble. I think the Trier case in my earlier game with the Julii was a combination of factors - four Britannic family members with their heavy chariot bodyguard contingents, and the enclosing environment of a city. In any case, auto-resolve was a loser even in easy/easy. When I directed the armies myself, I got'em. The Scipii in my latest finished game proved to be a cash poor challenge again, like the Julii. I started doing better in the cash department once I got a good war going against the Egyptians, and the Senate ordered me against the Macedonians in Corinth. I started a short game using Carthage and have been fighting almost all of the battles myself. I even used one of the cheats to give the Carthaginians a hefty cash reserve, just to see if I could do it. I don't like doing cheats, though, so I won't do that again. It makes me feel like I'm not mastering the game. The problem with Carthage in the short game is that you must eliminate the Scipii, and the problem with that is that (though the Scipii are gone now) I'm facing the Brutii, Julii and the Senate as permanent adversaries. The Senate's military stack can go higher than 20 units, which makes their army rather formidible. Sea mastery is key, and I built up a huge navy right away and cleared the sea lanes of rebels, Scipii and Julii. The Julii couldn't threaten Sardinia after I did that. I may start over at medium/medium AKA normal/normal, without the cheat this time, and direct the campaign differently. Bandits get no quarter from me. I fight all those battles myself and wipe them out to a man. I did a bribe once just to try that feature and bought myself a good frontier post that I supplemented with light cavalry.
Thank God for hoplites and Balearic slingers. When in a pinch, they sure help out. more later . . .

[Avicenna]

Welcome, Germanicus!

Glad to see you're enjoying RTW. Don't worry, we were all (I think) at that stage once. The battle takes a bit of getting used to, then you'll complain about them being too easy. Perhaps you should take a look at the 'RTW Guides' forum for more help on your Carthaginian campaign? Good luck and may you have a great game!

[vonsch]

I haven't ever really done anything with Carthage. I suspect that's a more challenging faction than most, but that's a guess. They do get good top end units and are a real civilization (no barbarians!) which are advantages. But they also have powerful enemies.

On the money front, the key (aside from eliminating populations for the cash...) is largely tied to trade and ports. With Carthage's control of the seas (which it seems pretty able to do, though I haven't played it) it should be poised to make a killing. And anyone at war with Carthage (or with whatever faction is in control of the trade channels) is going to be hurting. Blockades really cut into income. I know I HATE it when the rebels and WRE/ERE blockade my ports in BI. Money is usually a lot tighter in that too.

Sometime about 40 turns in you should start seeing good denarii flow in vanilla RTW. At least with most factions and assuming you're expanding fairly aggressively and focusing on getting trade enhancing buildings up (especially ports!) Then the reverse rapidly becomes a problem. You start bribing and giving away denarii to allies to avoid huge balances and corrupt governors.

Then the problem becomes everyone else hates you. I hate that. Even longtime allies get envious and won't stand by you. Scum!

[Bombasticus Maximus]

In my latest briton expansion I am not going to expand until the romans come for me the only time I will fight is when rebels are on my land or if I am attacked. I have allied with germany and have trade rights with:

• The house of Julii
• Germania
• Gaul

One of my diplomats is on teh way to greek lands as they make alot of money so I will also get trade rights with Greece, macedon, thrace and maybe the house of brutii.
I am also allied with Rome it's self so that should keep the romans of my door for a while. But my capital is in a few 100 denarii in debt and I don't know why I am doing everything I can to keep it making profit and it's not working. Whats an easy way to make money?

[limitedwhole]

Hey welcome. Don't forget that you can get loans if you are having trouble with money. A diplomat at Rome who can hit up each your roman allies and the senate for single paymnets in return for tribute is an invaluabel asset of the roman families.

Also be sure to read up on diplomacy. The higher the difficulty rating goes up, th emore important diplomats are. On the long campaign game I have up to 20-30 diplomats on teh board at once.

[Bombasticus Maximus]

Well I decided to expand I am still allies with Rome I have trade rights with all of the other factions before and some new ones which are Greece, Macedon, The house of brutii, The house of scipii, Scyhtia and thrace I asked for miltary access from the germans but they said no. I am not trading with Gaul as they went to war with me. When I started the game I was going to leave the settlement at the top of france to the rebels I am now glad I never as I am getting alot of profit from it.


I have a legendry commander at the age of 27. And he has one gold chevron. I love this game when it goes right for you.

[Guyus Germanicus]

I find all of your remarks interesting, all of you who have been espying this little thread. Thought I would throw out a few more observations and a couple book recommendations (since I'm a book collector - my other hobby besides RTW - with a large history library) for those who like reading about the characters they are playing with in RTW. A gentleman named Peter Wells has written an excellent book on the battle of the Teutoburg forest entitled, "The Battle That Stopped Rome." It came out in 2003 and brings that battle up to date with the latest archeological finds on the site where the battle took place. He attempts to recreate (and I think credibly) exactly how the battle unfolded. He does a good job of describing German religious beliefs and the background of Arminius. A good read of about 220 pages. Victor Davis Hanson's book on the Peloponnesian War that came out last fall is an excellent read as well. He does a remarkable job of describing what it must have been like for the individual soldier as a participant in this ancient war.
I'm hoping to try Carthage again and start over from scratch. There's a quirk in the loading process for Barbarian Invasion. When I loaded RTW, I started playing the game before I loaded BI. If you saved a game, by loading BI later, the RTW software loses the pointers to the saved game. I could reload everything from scratch and retrieve the saved game (I've done that before and not lost anything). But . . . I wanted to start over with Carthage anyway - this time without the cheat. I'm playing a short game with the Julii with the campaign level kicked up a notch, and the money is tighter than ever. I'm fighting all my own battles now as it's cheaper on my casualties rather than auto-resolve. (I think I actually like my grizzled veterans and mercenaries.) But I've begun to notice a peculiarly irritating bit of behavior from the Brutii. They seem to have an AI's inate enmity toward the Julii. They start roving all over my territory getting in the way of diplomats and my own armies - blocking passes, inhibiting my movement in my own territory - EVEN, mind you, when they dont' have official military access rights to my territory. I'd love to kick some Brutii butt, but if I do that, the rest of the Roman factions declare me anathema and I end up fighting the whole Roman world. Any thoughts on recalcitrant Brutii out there?

[limitedwhole]

Hey Geyus,
While I have never played a full campaign with the Julii, it is not surprising that they get in your way when they can. They hate the scipii and the julii and feel that they alone are the true romans. Try getting an army to the Greek/MAcedonian mainland early in the game and impede them before they can get setup and impede you. The romans one must remember are "allies". They are useful as allies as long as they can gain some beenfit form one another. That doesn't mean they don't vie against one another. Also, you always have a military alliance with them unless you cancel it. It is part of the roman alliance at the outset. Your best bet is to be as nefarious as them and force the action in their realm of control. Surely you can spare an army from your northern command?

[BHCWarman88]

I find all of your remarks interesting, all of you who have been espying this little thread. Thought I would throw out a few more observations and a couple book recommendations (since I'm a book collector - my other hobby besides RTW - with a large history library) for those who like reading about the characters they are playing with in RTW. A gentleman named Peter Wells has written an excellent book on the battle of the Teutoburg forest entitled, "The Battle That Stopped Rome." It came out in 2003 and brings that battle up to date with the latest archeological finds on the site where the battle took place. He attempts to recreate (and I think credibly) exactly how the battle unfolded. He does a good job of describing German religious beliefs and the background of Arminius. A good read of about 220 pages. Victor Davis Hanson's book on the Peloponnesian War that came out last fall is an excellent read as well. He does a remarkable job of describing what it must have been like for the individual soldier as a participant in this ancient war.
I'm hoping to try Carthage again and start over from scratch. There's a quirk in the loading process for Barbarian Invasion. When I loaded RTW, I started playing the game before I loaded BI. If you saved a game, by loading BI later, the RTW software loses the pointers to the saved game. I could reload everything from scratch and retrieve the saved game (I've done that before and not lost anything). But . . . I wanted to start over with Carthage anyway - this time without the cheat. I'm playing a short game with the Julii with the campaign level kicked up a notch, and the money is tighter than ever. I'm fighting all my own battles now as it's cheaper on my casualties rather than auto-resolve. (I think I actually like my grizzled veterans and mercenaries.) But I've begun to notice a peculiarly irritating bit of behavior from the Brutii. They seem to have an AI's inate enmity toward the Julii. They start roving all over my territory getting in the way of diplomats and my own armies - blocking passes, inhibiting my movement in my own territory - EVEN, mind you, when they dont' have official military access rights to my territory. I'd love to kick some Brutii butt, but if I do that, the rest of the Roman factions declare me anathema and I end up fighting the whole Roman world. Any thoughts on recalcitrant Brutii out there?

Hey,


"The Battle That Stopped Rome." It came out in 2003"



I have that book :-) :-)


had it for years,but didn't read the whole thing yet.but it is good from what I read so far..



Well,I would Mass Retruict and/or use Money cheat :-) :-)



peace,


BHCWarman8888KT

[limitedwhole]

Hey Guyus,
Just had another thought. i play the brutii allot and my strategy for the mainland is to get Greece and MAcedon fighting each other then take over. I imagine the AI might try to do the same thing. Get the Brutii into a war versus the Greeks and MAcedons at the same time and that ought to put a crink in their plans. If the Greeks and MAcedons ally versus the BRutii they will not be able to spare units to march north and will be bogged down in the peninsula indefinately.

[BHCWarman88]

Hey,

you should start playing Online Guyus, now that is Intersting,lol..

[Guyus Germanicus]

I'm sure I'm too shy to play online.
I finished my short campaign with the Julii conquering the last Gaulish province in mid-Spain after getting involved against Carthage and Macedonian and Britain. I decided to extend the short campaign to a long. I'm still maintaining a healthy bank account (I've got about 80,000 denarii.) I bought (bribed) one Spanish province into joining me for 23,000. Theron fell to my legions last night and Sparta and Larissa are under siege. The campaign against Macedonian was bloody around Thessalonica with several massive armies bloodying the grounds. I've taken two provinces from the Brits and returned them to the Germans. The AI can't decide what to think of me on that, methinks. The Germans, suspicious of me in any case, moved a small force into ambush position close to Alesia on me. But when one of my spys discovered it and I moved a large force adjacent to them without attacking, they moved back into their home territory. So I may have a fight with the Germans in the end. But for now, they seem to be more worried that I'm going to attack THEM. It would be interesting to know how the AI is programmed on this scenario I've given it - giving regions as gifts after conquest. So, I'm at war with the Spanish, the Carthaginians and the Macedonians. The Greeks are at cease fire with me holding out tenaciously in Asia Minor against the Pontids and the Egyptians. And, it looks like the Scipii are finally going to campaign against someone besides simply posting large armies next to my city, Patavium. Thrace, which is allied to the hapless Macedonians, keeps giving me monetary gifts when I offer them map information. And I'm learning some hard lessons about storming cities with stone walls. Build siege towers (3-4), a couple battering rams, at least, and use fire arrows in lieu of onagers. (The onagers are just now getting to my battle fields.) Marius is a few years in the future yet.
In the money department, I've found that it helps to cull out and discharge excess military units to reduce your carrying costs. And as "Froggie" has advised, use a few cities as your force builders, and don't put every building project in every city. My assassins are getting good experince points assassinating other assassins. In the end, the Egyptians will probably pose as my greatest threat before the Civil War. The Brutii have nothing but Crete, and the Scipii have only Sicily except for their home Italian provinces. I'm sure I don't understand why the AI has kept them so idol. Neither the Scipii or the Brutii are "in alliance" with Rome - only me. hmmmm The AI on that one is also a mystery to me. Fun stuff.

[BHCWarman88]

no need to be Shy


I'm playing as the Seleciud Empire,again.. Egypt is posing the biggest threat to me,since we in a bloody deadlock,of me taking their lands though,slowy but surely..

[Bombasticus Maximus]

Online are you good BHCwarman?? I am speaking of BI.

[Goalie]

Online are you good BHCwarman?? I am speaking of BI.

yes, he is quite good, also u still havent answered my challenge.

[BHCWarman88]

Thank you bett,and Yes, I am Quite Good..

What was the Challage Again??

[Guyus Germanicus]

I started a short game with the Seleucids myself - not going too far into it since I still had my long campaign with the Julii to finish up. You start out with some real handicaps with them. Limited early funds, threats from all sides - Pontus, Armenia, Egypt and Parthia. Parthia is particularly tough because of their extensive cavalry. My hat's off to you 'BHC'. One of the reasons I'm having such success with the Julii is that I get the best of infantry and can produce a lot of cavalry that are not just of the skirmishing type. Parthia came at me in a surprise attack and their army had both skirmishing cavalry and heavy cavalry. If you don't match their numbers on horseback, yuo can get into real trouble. The game hadn't progressed far enough for me to produce similar units. The style of combat you must employ with the Seleucids is much different too. Good luck in your endeavors.
more later . . .

[BHCWarman88]

Call Me War

I'm destroying Egyt and Greece.. I beat back Greec to their Last Town,and Egyt got Massarce by my guys in a Long Bloody War (which netiher side,us or theirs will agree to a peace treaty or at least a ceasefire.)my guys are very expercined,as I got armies every where.. Partiha try to attack me,but I murder them so bad,it wasn't even funny Guyus..Pontus giving me the hardest Time,Then Egypt,Then Armenia,and I am invading the Roman terrtioy..

[Goalie]

Thank you bett,and Yes, I am Quite Good..

What was the Challage Again??

Not to you, to bombastics, he called the horde a noob clan, so i want to show him that we arent one, but he has been a coward and hasnt responded to my challenge for a battle.

[Guyus Germanicus]

BHC,
There must be something about these Neareastern factions that give them a bad temperment - the heat, no doubt. When I started with the Roman factions - none of my adversaries, whether the Gauls, Brits, Germans, Greeks, was jumping at the bit for an immediate confrontation with me. But when I started with the Seleucids; Armenia, Parthia, Egypt - they all wanted to face off with arms right away, and in a sneaky way. They'd sit across the border from me with an army - large, small, indifferent in size - and then move at me without advance notice. The Egyptians I found were the least intimidating. Having plenty of cavalry skirmishers kept the Egyptians in their place. But, . . . my experience is extremely limited at this point with the Seleucids. So, I defer to your judgement on these issues.

I did validate something in Aescuplius's advice on governors. I just finished my Julii campaign - winning 50 regions plus Rome, and had about 190,000 denarii in the bank at the end. Aesculpius is so, so right about the corrupting influence of these large bank accounts over 50,000 denarii. I didn't have one faction member, as I recall, who wasn't corrupted by the large amounts of money. I think I had 24,000 denarii being skimmed off every turn just in corruption. That's a lot of dinaro lost to wasteage. Aescuplius recommends that you go on spending sprees when you approach the thresholds. The large bank account gives you some security, but it has its drawbacks. I've noticed too that when bribing - if possible, negotiate down the bribe. One other interesting thing I noticed in one bribe scenario. I sent a rather large army to Cyrenaica to seize that port from rebels. I had offered them a bribe earlier and the amount was exorbitant that they wanted. The next time I offered them a bribe, I had a huge army parked just outside the city. They took a whole lot less. I wonder if the AI was smart enough to associate the intimidation factor there. Interesting. Good luck BHC!

[BHCWarman88]

I been Playing Seleciud Empire for Ages.. I did play as them once last Year in the SUmmer of 05,but Pontus crushed me....

this time, I murdered Parthia,fought Hard with Aremenia.. After getting Push out of their land and them retaking their 1-3 towns from me, I kill their armies when they attack my towns,so it been a bloddy statlement.. the Egyptians are on the Defensive,as I am shipping my huge armies on small navals and working up the side of the Big Boot (Italy) and taking the Roman Towns,with Hard FOught Restancile..

I use the Money cheat code,but god,it is really hard still....