Protectorates

[janmichaeldave]

can anyone tell me what is the use of protectorates

[orwell]

They pay you and the game counts their territories as yours. I find they make great Iron Curtains.

[Avicenna]

Save you time, soldiers and money (no need to conquer them). Count towards faction objectives. Give you money every turn.

[edyzmedieval]

At least in 1.2 it's much easier to obtain a Protectorate. The 1.5 diplomacy sucks completely.

[Byzantine Mercenary]

i know, its hard to give provinces away let alone get protectorates

[Teleklos Archelaou]

At least in 1.2 it's much easier to obtain a Protectorate. The 1.5 diplomacy sucks completely.

Is there any summary of the problems with diplomacy in 1.5?

[The_White_Knight]

At least in 1.2 it's much easier to obtain a Protectorate. The 1.5 diplomacy sucks completely.

I was under the illusion that the 1.2 diplomacy-ai was completely bugged and 1.5 fixed that.

[edyzmedieval]

It was practically impossible to gain a protectorate in 1.5...
And after 1 try of ceasefire or ally thing, when you want to offer them something else to accept, they closed it without looking.

Call that good diplomacy?

[Teleklos Archelaou]

I've never gotten a protectorate anyway, so it probably won't affect me there.

As for not accepting cities or gifts at times, if the situation is right, I am fine with that - I had the KH refuse to take a city, but I sorta understood since they were peeved at me. I just gave a few small gifts of money and then in a couple of turns they took it. Didn't seem weird to me there.

[Avicenna]

You had to bribe a faction to take a free settlement? (and hence free money?)

EDIT: edyz, BI diplomacy beats them all in being the worst hands down.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Sure, why would you trust anything that your worst enemies want to do, after all? Sink money into a place, worry about irritating new neighbors around it, invest troops there to the detriment of forces elsewhere. The AI shouldn't accept cities 100% of the time.

[nikolai1962]

I find RTW much better if i just pretend the diplomacy aspect doesn't exist at all.

[Dayve]

Me too. I'm playing RTR Platinum which runs on RTW 1.5, (Whilst i await a more complete version of EB) and the diplomacy in 1.5 and BI is attrocious. The AI simply will not accept a ceasefire, not ever... Not even if they have only 1 city left, are on the other side of the map to you and their army consists of one unit of something levied... They still will not even THINK about accepting a ceasefire...

And protectorates? Oho... Don't even go there girlfriends. If you can get an AI faction to become your protectorate in 1.5 or BI then i'll eat my own hat, which in this case would be a white bandana with a black dragon on it.

The not accepting cities thing was purposely put there by CA i think... In previous versions people were giving their cities away and then retaking them and exterminating to cure overpopulation and squalor or unrest issues... Which wasn't how it is supposed to be played. But sometimes they will accept if you give them some cash first or as well as it.

All that said... I've been ignoring the diplomacy in this RTR game with 1.5... No point in even proposing anything... I have diplomats in a few cities but their purpose, along with the spy in the city, is to stop the AI from any dirty bribery antics... Sometimes they come to me and offer things like trade rights, which i never accept since i'm playing as Rome with some iron man rules, and ceasefires which i DO accept if the war is pointless and i've no intentions of expanding into their territories anytime soon.

[janmichaeldave]

when i played Carthage in R:TW i got 2 protectorates SQPR and brutii it was veryhard/meduim and version 1.5 for me version 1.5 is easier to have a protectorate than version 1.2 thats just my opinion

[Scott]

I think in EB your Protectorates should send troops to help you fight wars with other factions(if you ask them).

[edyzmedieval]

See what I'm talking about? Daybe told us about the Ceasefire thing.

Call THAT good diplomacy?
Stick to 1.2 and it'll be better. Anyhow, your decision.

[Avicenna]

Problem is, edyz, if you stick to 1.2 the Romans will be the same culture as the Greeks.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

I'm playing a romani campaign in 1.5 and I kicked the Epeirotes out of Taras within a couple of years of starting the game. About four years later I sent diplomats and spies around Illyria and into Greece and saw a couple of stacks sitting on the shores of Epeiros - I was still at war with them of course. Worried, I asked for a ceasefire with Epeiros and they immediately accepted - then I got trade rights the same turn. Sure enough, within a couple more turns, they had taken those stacks and attacked Pella.

I haven't seen anything at all yet that would make me be really afraid of the diplomacy in 1.5.

[abou]

Sounds similar to what happened to me in 1.2. Perhaps the conditions need to be just right for a ceasefire. Once I kicked Pyrrhus out of Italy a ceasefire and trade rights were easy to acquire, but remember that a strong Makedonia is their unfriendly neighbor. A situation like that never really develops in RTW vanilla because if you are a top five faction the only other ones tend to be not even near you - let alone with a weak faction inbetween that you are at war with.

[edyzmedieval]

Problem is, edyz, if you stick to 1.2 the Romans will be the same culture as the Greeks.

Yeah, that's a point.
The thing is, you can get the guys to make more advantageous things for you in 1.2, and you get Protectorates easier. In 1.5, you have to siege their last city for them to accept it.

[Conqueror]

Worried, I asked for a ceasefire with Epeiros and they immediately accepted - then I got trade rights the same turn.

That's not surprising. You no longer had a land border with Epeiros, and what I've learned of the RTW AI is that factions tend to be whole lot less aggressive toward you if they can't march their armies straight into your territory.

Anyway, getting a long lasting peace with a bordering faction is generally very difficult in RTW. AI neighbours may stay friendly for a while provided that you manage to look intimidating enough. But eventually they will attack you, and once hostilities have started the best you can get out of a ceasefire is a few turns of peace. Except if they lose the land border, but even that doesn't guarantee anything. Making them into protectorates will force them to stay friendly, but only for as long as you refrain from attacking any of their allies.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

I'll add that after a few turns of starting the game, the Epeirotes met my army near our borders and we had a good battle that I won. I took my army to Taras then to "seal the deal" since they only had a couple small units holding the city after they had taken their army out to fight me. While I was sieging the city though, suddenly a one-third stack of Epeirotes popped across the channel and attacked me from the north, to my astonishment, in a pincer movement. I just barely survived it, but I did. That was nice to see though!