"Iran can also be wiped off the map" -Israel

[Divinus Arma]

Linky

Vice Premier Shimon Peres said Monday that "the president of Iran should remember that Iran can also be wiped off the map."

Good for Israel. Stand up to that bully.

[Reenk Roink]

Wipe them both off, USA and Russia...

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It's funny though, Iran is seen as "standing up to that bully" in the Muslim world, and Israel is here...

[Joker85]

Linky




Good for Israel. Stand up to that bully.

Right on.

[Papewaio]

As long as Iran walks the line of hostile but does not act, guess who is getting the worst side of the bargin?

USA and China as they are importing a lot of oil.

While Russia and Iran are supplying a whole lot of oil.

So a little bit of belligerence adds a couple of billion to the income of all the oil producers.

[Hurin_Rules]

Good for Israel. Stand up to that bully.

So you're saying the bully is the one WITHOUT the nuclear weapons?

[Joker85]

So you're saying the bully is the one WITHOUT the nuclear weapons?

I think he's saying the bully is the one who began threatening to wipe a nation off the map, to which Isreal just responded "that can work both ways".

[Reenk Roink]

I think he's saying the bully is the one who began threatening to wipe a nation off the map, to which Isreal just responded "that can work both ways".

Actually, before that comment, Israel threatened to preemptively strike Iran like it did Iraq in the 80's...

Needless to say, there is a lot of history between the two...

[Divinus Arma]

I think he's saying the bully is the one who began threatening to wipe a nation off the map, to which Isreal just responded "that can work both ways".

Pretty much. Israel does nothing but seeks its own survival. Israeli foreign policy does not included a stated goal of "The destruction of Iran". However, Iran does have a stated policy goal of "the destruction of Israel".

Preemptive strikes by Israel are in the interest of its survival. They don't seek to "wipe Iran off the map", or dream of "a world without Iran".

[Byzantine Prince]

A premeptive strike will not stop a nuclear Iran. They have a huge country. If Israel attacks first, they lose. If Iran attacks first, Israel loses. One bomb can oblitarate everyone in Israel.

These are big words coming from Pervez. No one can wipe off Iran.

[Soulforged]

Good for Israel. Stand up to that bully.

I only hope this doesn't pass from mere words. Another thing, we're not talking about you or me standing against an individual bully, we're talking about international relationships, words matter a lot more in that enviorament.

[Hurin_Rules]

Israel does nothing but seeks its own survival.

I can think of a few million Palestinians who would vociferously disagree.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I can think of a few million Palestinians who would vociferously disagree.

...with anyone, about nearly any subject, on a virtually constant basis. If they were any less "together" they'd be Democrats.

[Redleg]

I only hope this doesn't pass from mere words. Another thing, we're not talking about you or me standing against an individual bully, we're talking about international relationships, words matter a lot more in that enviorament.

Careful now you are about to enter into an area that you normally argue against.

The power of words.....

[Devastatin Dave]

I can think of a few million Palestinians who would vociferously disagree.

But then they could be matyrs which I'm sure they'd enjoy while the melting occured.

[Soulforged]

Careful now you are about to enter into an area that you normally argue against.

The power of words.....

I was expecting this Red. Let's no ruin the thread with another subject...By the way I can still save myself but this is not the place.

[Redleg]

I was expecting this Red. Let's no ruin the thread with another subject...By the way I can still save myself but this is not the place.

This thread is about the use of language.....

[GoreBag]

I'm gonna go with the underdog. Come on, Iran, don't take that from the new kid just because he has big friends.

[LeftEyeNine]

*Next door neighbor knocks the ceiling and the floor with a mop. That is too much noise..

[Bar Kochba]

what actual effect would the missle have how much of israel can it take out

[Avicenna]

A city or two, I'd guess. Iran doesn't have hydrogen bombs or anything.. just WWII era nukes max I'd say.

[Ser Clegane]

Uhm ... actually Iran does not have any nukes at all ... yet (at least that seems to be the consensus of all involved parties)

[Xiahou]

Actually, before that comment, Israel threatened to preemptively strike Iran like it did Iraq in the 80's...

Needless to say, there is a lot of history between the two...

Uh, actually I think Isreal has publicly said pretty much the opposite- that it wouldnt be able to pre-emptively strike. Whether or not they would may be a different matter, but I don't recall them threatening to do so.

[caravel]

As usual, a muslim country that happens to have pretty sour relations with the US and Israel wants to develop Nuclear energy and it's a terrible crime for them to do so. The US, Britain, Israel, France, North Korea and Russia all have this technology, including weapons. Britain is even talking about constructing more nuclear power stations. But as soon as Iran makes a move to enrich uranium the "world police" start laying down the law. If Iran is moving to arm itself in this way, of which there is currently no hard evidence, there can be only one reason, and that is to deter the US and it's allies from invading as they did Iraq. You don't see the US invading North Korea, this is because they're already armed. Iraq was not Nuclear, Biologically nor, at that time, Chemically armed, and the US and UK knew this only too well, which is why the whole 'WMD' fiasco was invented as a pretext and the invasion went ahead. The cold war proved the effectiveness, and the drawbacks, of mutually assured destruction in that a country with Nuclear weapons became effectively immune to open war.

So with regard to Iran possibly wanting to arm themselves, the question is: Can you blame them? As to the "wipe Israel off the map"/"wipe Iran off the map" thing, well it sounds like alot of empty threats, as Iran, as yet, doesn't posess the technology to do so, and if they did, it is likely that Isreal, a Nuclear Power, would also wipe them off the map at the same time, with the help of their allies the US.

[Husar]

A premeptive strike will not stop a nuclear Iran. They have a huge country. If Israel attacks first, they lose. If Iran attacks first, Israel loses. One bomb can oblitarate everyone in Israel.

These are big words coming from Pervez. No one can wipe off Iran.

That´s actually very funny.

One problems with nukes, however big they may be, is that they have a circle of destruction which means in the case of countries like Israel that if you use just one nuke, you will inevitably harm(or destroy) neighboring countries as well.
And btw, the neighboring countries are full of muslims.

[Taffy_is_a_Taff]

That´s actually very funny.

One problems with nukes, however big they may be, is that they have a circle of destruction which means in the case of countries like Israel that if you use just one nuke, you will inevitably harm(or destroy) neighboring countries as well.
And btw, the neighboring countries are full of muslims.

The Iranian leadership have made statements before now that they don't care how many of their people die as they could destroy all Israelis and still have a good chunk of their own population left. I imagine this cavalier attitude to their own civilian deaths probably applies to other Muslims too, thus setting the scene for some very nasty goings on if they did try to extinguish Israel.

[Divinus Arma]

Erm. Why do the liberals here find it acceptable that an autocracy should have nuclear weapons? By the same arguments you make, the "world police" should have allowed Hitler to possess nukes too.

The government of Iran publicly seeks the anihilation of Israel.

The government of Israel does not seek the destruction of Iran.


You same people would stand by and watch the holocaust happen all over again.

[Redleg]

As usual, a muslim country that happens to have pretty sour relations with the US and Israel wants to develop Nuclear energy and it's a terrible crime for them to do so. The US, Britain, Israel, France, North Korea and Russia all have this technology, including weapons. Britain is even talking about constructing more nuclear power stations. But as soon as Iran makes a move to enrich uranium the "world police" start laying down the law. If Iran is moving to arm itself in this way, of which there is currently no hard evidence, there can be only one reason, and that is to deter the US and it's allies from invading as they did Iraq. You don't see the US invading North Korea, this is because they're already armed. Iraq was not Nuclear, Biologically nor, at that time, Chemically armed, and the US and UK knew this only too well, which is why the whole 'WMD' fiasco was invented as a pretext and the invasion went ahead. The cold war proved the effectiveness, and the drawbacks, of mutually assured destruction in that a country with Nuclear weapons became effectively immune to open war.

I wonder if someone realizes that most of Western Europe as represented by the European Union is attempting to get Iran to halt the enrichment aspect of their nuclear program.

Or is the European Union just another lapdog of the mighty "world police."


You might want to recheck why there is not a return to active warfare in the conflict between the two Koreas, it is not just because of their possiblity of having a few nuclear weapons. Give you a slight hint there - North Korea didn't have the possiblity of nuclear weapons until recently. (within the last 10-15 years, depending on which intelligence summary you wish to believe.)

It might have something more in the line that for years every artillery piece in North Korea was aimed at where roughly 80% of the population of South Korea lives, where the doctrine of the North Korean military includes the heavy use of chemical weapons to prepare the battlefield for thier attack, or to choke any attack along one of the manuever avenues. That there are only three manuever avenues in korea in which both sides have heavily defended, also plays a factor into the equation, and then there is China, one of the few remaining allies ( and that is just barely in my opinion) of the North Korean regime.

Edit: Oh I forgot to add that look back at the number of talks between the United States and North Korea (two party) and the six party talks (China, North Korea, South Korea, United States, Japan, and if I remember correctly Russia). How many times was a deal worked out for North Korea to halt its enrichment program? How many times did North Korea violate same deal and continue with its development?

Look at a map and you might discover that relative fact, versus the myth of Nuclear Weapons so much spread over the web.

So with regard to Iran possibly wanting to arm themselves, the question is: Can you blame them? As to the "wipe Israel off the map"/"wipe Iran off the map" thing, well it sounds like alot of empty threats, as Iran, as yet, doesn't posess the technology to do so, and if they did, it is likely that Isreal, a Nuclear Power, would also wipe them off the map at the same time, with the help of their allies the US.

With Iran its not an empty threat - check out how much support they provide to several organizations who's sole goal is the destruction of the Israeli state. Its not hard to find out.....

[LeftEyeNine]

The government of Iran publicly seeks the anihilation of Israel.

The government of Israel does not seek the destruction of Iran.

Iran has no headaches and keeping in mind how Ahmedinecad wants to camouflage his idiotic revolution inside- openly confirmed that they want no Israel in Middle East. (not the best way to reveal your intentions)

Israel is fond of Arabians or Iran ? C'mon.. If there were no Palestine at the door, I'd like to hear what they would say at first hand.

Someone acting like world police is irritated by autocracies. How touching

[caravel]

Erm. Why do the liberals here find it acceptable that an autocracy should have nuclear weapons? By the same arguments you make, the "world police" should have allowed Hitler to possess nukes too.

Don't use the liberal tag, it's far too easy to pigeonhole someone in this way instead of listening to their opinions.

The government of Iran publicly seeks the anihilation of Israel.

In your opinion, where's your evidence? Many muslim states have voiced empty threats against israel, the US, the UK and other's direction in the past, why is this any different apart from fitting the US agenda. All you have is one impotent statement and nothing more.

The government of Israel does not seek the destruction of Iran.

I would say not, but that is hardly relevant to this debate. Just because Israel don't seek to destroy Iran and are US allies, it's ok for them to stockpile as many nukes and violate as many UN resolutions as they like? Simply because we believe that they don't intend to use them. I can think of several of the nuclear powers and the one that seems most likely to use it's nuclear weapons is Israel. It's hardly a stable country and is surrounded by enemies, and in a state of constant infighting and terrorist activity. The question is why should anyone trust Israel let alone Iran?

You same people would stand by and watch the holocaust happen all over again.

It was right wing intolerant bigots that persecuted and executed jews during the holocaust, people that wanted supreme power and absolute control over their neighbours, not muslim states like Iran and not your "Liberals".

[Hurin_Rules]

But I think you're missing the central point he was trying to make, Redleg. Israel is not totally blameless here, a poor weakling being menaced by massive bullies. Israel currently occupies land that, in the minds of most Muslims, is Muslim land. They see Palestinians getting bombed and abused daily. We've also seen Israel's main ally invade another Muslim state on the border of Iran in an elective war fought on what seem to be false pretenses. To call Iran the bully when the Israelis are the ones sitting on their fellow Muslims' chests--and with nuclear weapons to boot! --just seems a very poor analogy.