The Templars
I just watched a show on the History channel about the Templar knights. I was wondering what you guys thought happend to their treasure and their order after the prosecution of them in the 1300's.
I wonder if they just went into Switzerland, which one story claims.
Re: The Templars
I imagine the Papacy confescated much of their wealth. As to what happened to their order? It ended, basically. And no, the Masonic order AREN'T the Knight's Templar. I can't prove it, but contact your local lodge, they may well be willing to talk.. or they'll just tell you to bugger off.
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Re: The Templars
Well, it won't be that simple. I think they survived on under another name, at least for a while. It's highly unlikely that you can just wipe out the order and all traces of it just like that. Like what somebody said in the Da Vinci Code topic, it was no coincidence that not long after condemning the Templars as heretics, the Pope Clement V and King Philip IV, who respectively condemned them and took their wealth, died in the same year.
Organisations this powerful don't just disappear. Think of the Nazis, who remained quite powerful after 1945, apparently pretty much controlling some South American country, but not in name of course. The Neo-Nazis are still here today. Just one destruction doesn't mean they disappear forever. Think of the KKK as well, which have disbanded a few times in history, only to reappear.
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Re: The Templars
Well, in one particular case they just melded into another order. In Portugal, an ecclesiastical court found the Templars not guilty of heresy. King Dinis was a supporter of the Templars because they were so instrumental in helping with the Reconquista, in spite of several threatening letters from the Pope. But without papal support, a religious order can't really exist as such. So, King Dinis made some interesting legal arguments and got the Pope to agree with them.
First, he got the Pope to agree that Templar possessions in Portugal didn't belong to the Templars but to the crown and had just been on loan to the Templars. This prevented the Church from gaining control of the Templar properties, which were extensive. Elsewhere, the church gave most of the properties to the Hospitallers.
Then he got the Pope to agree to a new military religious order in Portugal to be called the Order of Christ. Then he gave the Templar possessions to the Order of Christ. Meanwhile, the Templars sort of just disappeared; and a new order, under the direct auspices of King Dinis appeared with control over all the former Templar properties in Portugal. You can draw your own conclusions; but in my mind it's clear that King Dinis simply created the conditions whereby the Templars in Portugal could continue under a new name. Even the name itself is not all that much different from the original name of the Templars. In Portugal, the Poor Fellow-Soldiers of Christ and the Temple of Solomon simply became the Military Order of Christ minus the offending reference to the Temple and Templars.
A very similar situation occurred in Aragon, with King James II creating the Military Order of Montesa under almost exactly the same conditions as King Dinis did.
Last edited by Aenlic; 05-21-2006 at 09:02.
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Re: The Templars
Uh - those are ideologies that like making use of already established symbology and names. I'd say that's a little different really. The Templars and the other Orders were pretty much highly organized "states between states" (and the Teutonic Knights had their very concrete Ordensstaat in Baltic for that matter), with internal economies, bureaucracies and all. Heck, they were in some ways rather better organized than most actual states of their time...Originally Posted by Tiberius
That's a pretty far cry from loose networks of ideologically motivated cliques that prefer to identify with certain common themes, IMHO.
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Re: The Templars
Can any French patron enlighten me,but am i totally wrong but isnt Knights Templars still an illegal organization in France?
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Re: The Templars
No, they aren’t. They still exist, at least as a name. I knew some people belonging to this organisation/association under the law of 1904 regulating associations.
I don't thing the actual French State is afraid of the actual power of the Templars. Nor Phillip II Le Bel, apparently.
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