Montenegro Breaks Away From Serbia

[Ice]

PODGORICA, Serbia-Montenegro (CNN) -- Voters in Montenegro have decided narrowly to sever the country's union with Serbia, a move that breaks up the last two pieces of the former Yugoslavia, according to official preliminary results from the election commission.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/europe...nce/index.html

Good, bad, or ok? I don't really know much about this, other then where these two countries are located in the world. I just thought the formation of a new nation is always interesting to discuss.

[Kralizec]

Goody, yet another mini state with less then a million inhabitants

It seems to serve more a symbolic purpose then anything else, and I don't think it will gain them much in the long run if anything.

[Byzantine Prince]

Doesn't make a difference. It was begging to hapen from the fallout of 91'. Now all we have to do is wait for Kosovo to also do the same. The Balkans are going to turn into the most nationaly concentrated area in the world. It will be fun to see those new countries in 20 years. I bet they will modernize pretty quickly now that they are liberated.

Maybe northern Srbja also wants to leave.

[discovery1]

Bad news for Serbia surely. Methinks that no longer having a coast will hurt them alot. When and if it hits the fan Kosovo is sure to bail.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

My one thought is: great, another reason for them to kill each other.

I hope it works out for them.

[Csargo]

I'm thinking something bad gonna happen out of this.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

.....ah, the Balkans. Always good for a bit of sorrow.

[Lemur]

I remember reading that the Montengrins felt that they were used pretty badly by Serbia as soldiers and officers, leading to the old saying: "The Serbs will fight until the last Montenegrin is dead."

Then there's Otto von Bismarck's take on the region: "The whole of the Balkans is not worth the bones of a single Pomeranian grenadier."

[scotchedpommes]

As ever, there is enough of an ethnic Serbian presence to create tension, and
possible difficulties. There were never any clean breaks, except when there was
relative homogeneity - in other words, see Ten-Day War.


Yugoslavia is dead, long live Yugoslavia.

[Fragony]

When do the negotiations with the EU start, the more the better :P

[ZombieFriedNuts]

Well this is annoying I can’t find it on a map

[Duke Malcolm]

No, it will be as Serbia & Montenegro on maps. Montenegro is the part by the coast, I believe. I doubt many maps have been printed since the Montenegrin referendum...

I love the idea of mini-states on the Continent, they are so quaint, somewhat nostalgic. A colourful by-product of the international drive for nationalism after the break-up of the European Empires... All to give cartographers some extra fun, colouring the map in a few more colours than pink.

I wonder if we can convince them to re-instate a monarchy. They've all been waving flags of their old king, that has to be something. Mini-monarchies are much more fun than mini-republics...

[ShadesPanther]

More powder added to the keg, I guess

[Brenus]

“The Serbs will fight until the last Montenegrin is dead” That should be quite fast, due to the Montenegrin population (around 500.000 and half live in Belgrade….).

I don’t think it will destabilise the region. Montenegro was a recognised State within the Yugoslav Federation, so not really a problem after the collapse. However, Kosovo will be the next hot potato. If Kosovo get its Independence, it will be difficult to deny this right to the Croats and Serbs from Bosnia. And perhaps, will make some trouble for Croatia with its own Serbs minority.

Until now, the solution (Madeleine Albright –sp?- preferred one) in the Balkans was simple: bomb the Serbs. The Serbs want to separate from Croatia and/or Bosnia, bomb the Serbs. The Albanian wanted to separate from Serbia: Bomb the Serbs. Erdut agreement, the Serbs have to agree to live in Croatia and to be Croats. Dayton Agreement, the Serbs have to agree to be Bosniac and to live in Bosnia. Rambouillet Agreement, the Serbs have to agree that the Albanians (hoops, sorry Ethic Albanians) will separate and the Serbs becoming minority in Kosovo will agree to live in Kosova and to be Albanians…

Wait! There are still some parts of Serbia which could be taken: What about the Independent Sandzak, the Free Vojvodina, the Republic of Shumadia and the Principaute of Dedinje (south)?

[KrooK]

"Bomb the Serbs"
It was very good idea that time. It was great idea, especially after Serbs murdered 8000 men in Srebrenica. Or when they established semi concentration camps for Muslim prisoners or public houses where non-serb women were raped and killed after borning Serb children.
Croats or Muslims did do similar things but .....
But they were sent to Hague by government of Croatia or drove alone which I can't tell about Serbs.

Montenegro (Czarnogóra in polish) was independent state for centuries (even when Serbia was part of Ottoman Empire. Now people of Montenegro want independence - I don't see any reason that they shouldn't achieve independence. Especially that these countries are a divided since 1991 - aren't they?

So

HELLO INDEPENDENT MONTENEGRO - could someone post it's flag?

[Dâriûsh]

55,4% is a conveniently befitting result.


Is it too early to say “Welcome to the EU, Montenegro”? Either way, good for them.

[stalin]

Montenegro (Czarnogóra in polish)

thanks for that useless information

[Lemur]

I value and appreciate useless information. Please keep posting, Krook!

[Dâriûsh]

thanks for that useless information

Well, aren't you a nice guy…

[stalin]

why would anyone care what montenegro's name is in poish. I am sure the poles know already

[Vladimir]

Another double-wide in the trailer park of Europe.

[Ser Clegane]

Please keep this civil

No one needs "useless" posts complaining about particular pieces of information that the poster does not consider to be interesting.

[scotchedpommes]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montenegro

For all your useless information needs.

[Kagemusha]

I dont understand what is the problem.If Montenegro is a free country and they have voted to be independent what is the problem? Is the status of independent state only for big nations?For example if we look at the former Soviet republics around Baltics.They are all little Nations,but they are lot better of then they were during Soviet Union.Like it is the small countries around the World that cause the majority of problems.I dont think so.Congratulations for the People of Montenegro for their independancy

[scotchedpommes]

The problem as I see it is quite clear. Montenegro is not yet free. There are a
significant number of people within the country who do not want seperation from
Serbia, not to mention that the Serbs would most likely prefer a continuation of
the union. There were already reports of violence in the border areas around the
time of the election, so I wouldn't be rushing to say they're out of the woods
yet.

[Blodrast]

The problem, my friend, is that the Balkans have always been a highly unstable region, and a powder keg. The volatility of states and nations there only contributes to that.
For most people (which does not include weapons manufacturers who are happy to have yet another market for their goodies), this tension and instability leads to (civil) wars, in the worst case, or poverty and misery for the locals, and internal tensions, in the best case.

The simple fact that the decision was made by such a narrow margin should be a hint that it's nowhere near clear cut...

[Kagemusha]

As far as i know there havent practicly ever been a clear cut,when new states are born.There always will be minorities.Lets just hope things turn better for the Balkans.Maybe one reason that it have developed as gunpowder keg has been that it has been almost constantly through out the history been under a foreign power.

[Blodrast]

Sure, all of those factors contribute to the instability.
However, it's one thing to split with a majority of 50-something percent, and a different one to split like the former Soviet republics, where 90-something percent of the population is indeed, azer, ukrainian, estonian, etc.
But you're definitely right in the fact that being under a foreign power (or more, at the same time :D) is a huge factor...

[Radier]

The more countries the better. Sort of...
And stalin, uppför dig!

[Brenus]

“can't tell about Serbs”
Are you not following the news? Milosevic, dead in The Hague, was Muslim or Croat? No, he was Serb. He was even a Former President of Serbia… Itzetbegovic and Tudjman were also on the list of war criminals. Carla Del Ponte (and before her Louise Arbour) just waited their death to tell people…

“Serbs murdered 8000 men in Srebrenica”:
Not the same, it is like if you want to bomb the Francophone Belgium for a crime committed by the French.

“Croats or Muslims did do similar things but”: Indeed, they did, but, as you mentioned, you don’t care.
For your information: The Celebici camp was set up by joint Bosnian Muslim-Croat forces in 1992 in the riverside village of Celebici, near the town of Konjic in central Bosnia.
Several dozen Bosnian Serb civilians from the Konjic area were detained there in 1992. (500 according other sources)
The lower court (The Hague) ruled that "they were responsible for killing, torturing, sexually assaulting, beating and otherwise subjecting detainees in that camp to cruel and inhumane treatment".
Judges said the prisoners lived in "an atmosphere of terror" due to the frequent and random violence inflicted on them by the guards. The witnesses testified they had severely tortured and raped prisoners.
Well, you will probably answer that figures are different…

“they were sent to Hague by government of Croatia”: Can you give names? That is true for the small fishes, but their General succeeded to escape and was caught, not surrendered…
To give Milosevic to The Hague, the Serbs made a revolution…

“not to mention that the Serbs would most likely prefer a continuation of
the union” Not really, I have to say. It cost Serbia a lot of money, half of the Montenegrins are living in Serbia, they will have now have to contribute…
First, Montenegro will have to enter in EU, which means to reach the criteria… And that is another problem especially corruption. Did I mention that Djukanovic, actual hero of the independence, is wanted by Italian justice for smuggling cigarettes?

“Montenegro is not yet free” Funny enough, I went several times in Montenegro, and you know what? No occupation by Serbian forces, not suicide bombers against Serbian occupation, just nice ice cream and sea side. Montenegro was part of a Federation, it was not occupied.

And by the way, before Milosevic’s son, Marko, took the smuggling of cigarettes from Djukanovic, this one was one of the best allies of Milosevic…