New Video in German Magazine

[ivoignob]

Would any German speakers care to translate some of the comentary for us? I feel I'm missing a trick here - there could be useful information in there regarding the feel of the game, what's done and what's missing etc.

Except pointing out the nice new graphics and animations again and again, he doesn't say very much of importance or of things we didn't know already.

The most important thing he says is, that they got campaign map views also, but that they aren't allowed to show them at this time.

[shifty157]

i assume the AI will stink....them saying otherwise is like every band hyping its newest cd as the heaviest stuff they have ever done....it never is

From what you say I assume that you just started playing with the release of RTW. Had you played MTW or STW you would realize that as far as the AI goes RTW is a fluke in the series. MTW and STW both had considerably better AI than RTW. So a decent AI in MTW2 would merely be a return to normal.

Personally i have high hopes for this game. I believe CA may actually deliver this time.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

From what you say I assume that you just started playing with the release of RTW. Had you played MTW or STW you would realize that as far as the AI goes RTW is a fluke in the series. MTW and STW both had considerably better AI than RTW. So a decent AI in MTW2 would merely be a return to normal.

That certainly is optimistic. I hope (for everyone involved) that you aren't let down.

The video wasn't a new game. It was RTW with (mildly) updated graphics and different units. Otherwise it was exactly vanilla RTW.

[Callahan9119]

i'v played since shogun...ai has never ever been a challenge. if its not crappy city development, poor unit selection, bad tactics, poor design its something else that ruins it...mtw was a laugh. line up, rout the main army and even if they had 4 stacks u just lined up at the borderer and turn the game speed up...nothing hard

the only thing mtw had over rtw strictly regarding ai was it commited to an attack with its line, the rtw ai has the decision making ability of a squirrel in the middle of the road

[Furious Mental]

If you want to make the game slightly less of a pushover perhaps you might want to consider not boxing yourself into the corner of the map

[Callahan9119]

and be a victim of poor game design? let the enemy bring in units 1 at a time to line up its army of peasants and town watch to be routed again? and again and again?

[HarunTaiwan]

AI will be just as bad as RTW.

Graphics sells apparently. Despite "pointless waste of time"'s great essay on gameplay being more important.

[Zatoichi]

Except pointing out the nice new graphics and animations again and again, he doesn't say very much of importance or of things we didn't know already.

The most important thing he says is, that they got campaign map views also, but that they aren't allowed to show them at this time.

Ho hum. Thanks for the info. I'm still hopeful that this was their pre-alpha game for E3 mass consumption rather than the AI we will see in the finished product. I'm a glass half full guy I guess.

[Furious Mental]

"and be a victim of poor game design? let the enemy bring in units 1 at a time to line up its army of peasants and town watch to be routed again? and again and again?"

I don't see what that has to do with it. All I'm saying is that if you want the AI to have more of a chance don't use the borders of the battle map to make your army impossible to flank. And if you're going to exploit the game design in such a way that the AI basically has no opportunity to use tactics anyway, don't complain about how dumb it is.

[Sir Robin]

the rtw ai has the decision making ability of a squirrel in the middle of the road

Classic, absolutely classic!

I expect the AI will be better in MTW2 than RTW since they appear to be using the same code, albeit tweaked a little more than RTW's 1.5.

As many, probably, I hoped the AI portion of the game would be as improved as the graphic part. Currently it appears not to be though hopefully this will change.

As an update Mellons, over at the TWC, found a different video for MTW2.

Six Minutes and Fifty-Two Seconds, Wow!

This one appears to be an exposition piece that some sneaky devil may have grabbed from a trade show, E3 perhaps?

[L'Impresario]

As an update Mellons, over at the TWC, found a different video for MTW2.

Six Minutes and Fifty-Two Seconds, Wow!

This one appears to be an exposition piece that some sneaky devil may have grabbed from a trade show, E3 perhaps?

Liked the weather, but overall it´s ... funny, very funny, for lack of other words.

[Furious Mental]

The weather was nice, as was the artillery, and the arquebusiers I thought. However the soldiers look to be running entirely too fast. Also I find that bombard rather ludicrous.

[doc_bean]

Ugh, i'm so tired of flaming arrows !

It does look like a prettier version of Rome, I'm certainly going to wait until the first members have played and commented on the game before buying it.

[BDC]

Yes, it looks just like Rome.

That's not said in a good way.

[ivoignob]

I have the feeling, the only reason why these pictures don't impress us anymore is the fact, that playing huge battles with massive armys is nothing new to us anymore. The ability to play epic battles was the keyfactor which bounded us to MTW and some others to STW as well, it was not the "better" AI in my humble opinion. Unfortunately the magic is gone, that's why we are alway looking back to MTW. And because of this fact, the programmers have a much harder time to impress us now. Progress is much much slower now. Just a few thoughts, and excuse me for getting offtopic....

[Husar]

I have the feeling, the only reason why these pictures don't impress us anymore is the fact, that playing huge battles with massive armys is nothing new to us anymore. The ability to play epic battles was the keyfactor which bounded us to MTW and some others to STW as well, it was not the "better" AI in my humble opinion. Unfortunately the magic is gone, that's why we are alway looking back to MTW. And because of this fact, the programmers have a much harder time to impress us now. Progress is much much slower now. Just a few thoughts, and excuse me for getting offtopic....

I agree with you, now that the magic is lost, people start picking about details and waiting for a new revolution, but that is pretty hard to make IMO.

[Grifman]

If you want to play MP then you better worry. But that is the effect of having no eras so no big surprise really.


CBR

Why? It's surely a simple thing to agree up front that no one uses cannons, yes?

[Callahan9119]

"and be a victim of poor game design? let the enemy bring in units 1 at a time to line up its army of peasants and town watch to be routed again? and again and again?"

I don't see what that has to do with it. All I'm saying is that if you want the AI to have more of a chance don't use the borders of the battle map to make your army impossible to flank. And if you're going to exploit the game design in such a way that the AI basically has no opportunity to use tactics anyway, don't complain about how dumb it is.

i wasnt doing that, after i routed the enemy army i would wait at the border for enemy reinforcments, so as soon as they came in they quickly would be gone lol i never needed to do anything to help myself vs the ai

[Rodion Romanovich]

Classic, absolutely classic!

I expect the AI will be better in MTW2 than RTW since they appear to be using the same code, albeit tweaked a little more than RTW's 1.5.

As many, probably, I hoped the AI portion of the game would be as improved as the graphic part. Currently it appears not to be though hopefully this will change.

As an update Mellons, over at the TWC, found a different video for MTW2.

Six Minutes and Fifty-Two Seconds, Wow!

This one appears to be an exposition piece that some sneaky devil may have grabbed from a trade show, E3 perhaps?

Hm, this video indicates the following:
- either knights are EVEN faster than cavalry in RTW, or the video is in triple speed (I hope)
- the huge cannon in the picture must be the big cannon used during the siege of Constantinople. It seems a lot overpowered in it's usage vs troops - it wiped out an entire knight unit in one shot. Hopefully both accuracy and payload is lowered by the release, otherwise it takes 20 shots to win a battle Now I don't mind if it destroys city walls easily, but that effectiveness vs troops seems a bit over the top IMO
- the water next to the fortifications looks splendid
- the maps seem huge, which is good. Also the fact that lakes etc. can be next to a castle is nice, I hope it'll be like that in the campaign too. I wonder if the campaign will use premade or auto-generated maps this time too... If the latter, and the quality is still as good as shown in this video, then it's great
- too much flaming arrows and cannons in all previews so far. I'd like to see how a regular traditional engagement infantry vs infantry with limited cavalry and missile support looks! Best of all would be a recording of a multiplayer battle played between two reviewers or even better - TW fans...

[econ21]

Those are my perceptions too, Legio. The cavalry charge also seemed a bit too lethal too quickly.

We did see some infantry vs infantry stuff at the wall breach and there the combat speed seemed more reasonable than it did with cavalry and artillery (although the lethal last cannonade effect may have been scripted or otherwise "set-up" for dramatic effect).

[TB666]

- the huge cannon in the picture must be the big cannon used during the siege of Constantinople. It seems a lot overpowered in it's usage vs troops - it wiped out an entire knight unit in one shot. Hopefully both accuracy and payload is lowered by the release, otherwise it takes 20 shots to win a battle Now I don't mind if it destroys city walls easily, but that effectiveness vs troops seems a bit over the top IMO

Well CA has most likely edited the stats so that it hits everytime.
They did this with the onagers in RTW when they fired fire ammo during the videos and they in the end turned out alright.
Or they simply edited out the shots that didn't hit .
But still I'm confident that CA will make that beast inaccurate.

[Wandarah]

Ugh, i'm so tired of flaming arrows !

It does look like a prettier version of Rome, I'm certainly going to wait until the first members have played and commented on the game before buying it.

lordy, why do that?

knowing these guys unless it's a 2-d chess simulation in which you play against deepblue on the hardest difficulity level, using historicially accurate chess peices, during the transit of venus and jupiter, it's not worth the effort.

you know they'll just be a bunch of whining negative nancies. i'm afraid you'll still have to end up making your own mind about the game. because obviously, the only thing that you'll be convinced of here, is that writing 2000 word essays on sword hilts and arrow tips is actually a relevant exercise in relation to a game.

[Furious Mental]

"i wasnt doing that, after i routed the enemy army i would wait at the border for enemy reinforcments, so as soon as they came in they quickly would be gone lol i never needed to do anything to help myself vs the ai"

ROFL. Hahaha you actually make my point for me. That is actually even more of a cheap and exploitative tactic than boxing yourself into the corner of the map.

[R'as al Ghul]

As an update Mellons, over at the TWC, found a different video for MTW2.

Six Minutes and Fifty-Two Seconds, Wow!

What exactly kills the Knights at 6:03min?

A mortar?

[doc_bean]

lordy, why do that?

knowing these guys unless it's a 2-d chess simulation in which you play against deepblue on the hardest difficulity level, using historicially accurate chess peices, during the transit of venus and jupiter, it's not worth the effort.

you know they'll just be a bunch of whining negative nancies. i'm afraid you'll still have to end up making your own mind about the game. because obviously, the only thing that you'll be convinced of here, is that writing 2000 word essays on sword hilts and arrow tips is actually a relevant exercise in relation to a game.

Well, at least I'll get a general impression why it's liked and why not. I honestly hope they'll release a demo that gives a good idea what the game will be like but I doubt it. In any case, I fear I might be a bit burnt on TW games, so it's going to be a late purchase for me anyway.

[Monk]

What exactly kills the Knights at 6:03min?

A mortar?

I have no idea... but that thing mowed down something like four units of heavy knights with what appeared to be one shot.

Other than that, the "new" vid showed some interesting things by the turkish player. I'm hoping it was AI as it maintained some good formations...

[Duke John]

It was in a previous video: a huge cannon that fires balls of around 1 metre across weighing around 1000 kilo's. I don't have any thoughts on that because it would make me a whining negative nancy.

[Wandarah]

oh dont be all sooky about it, sheesh.

if it makes you feel any better, i think the 6 minute video makes the game look ridiculous - really, really bad. which, if you like, means im a negative nancy too.

[IceTorque]

Does anyone else notice how some of the infantry is in a wedge formation ?
or are my tired old eyes playin tricks on me ?

[Rodion Romanovich]

i didn't notice infantry in wedge formation. However historically the vikings sometimes fought in a giant wedge formation so it could be an interesting idea. Though I doubt anyone used wedge formations in the time period MTW2 covers, which begins after the end of the viking age.